Jeremy Bamber Forum
JEREMY BAMBER CASE => Jeremy Bamber Case Discussion => Topic started by: Adam on August 02, 2016, 07:25:PM
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Everyone agrees with the 2002 appeal, that Sheila's feet were pulled at least two feet after her fatal shot. Thread already created on this.
One supporter has said Sheila was sitting up against the bedside cabinet when shot. Lifeless seated bodies don't move two feet forward across the floor.
Another supporter agrees Sheila's feet were pulled two feet forward and claims the police did this.
One supporter strangly said it was 'my leg being pulled', which I am not sure what this is supposed to mean.
It is correct after the crime scene photographer arrived, Sheila's arm was moved slightly and pictures of this were taken.
However it is against police protocol to move dead bodies at a crime scene, prior to forensics and photographers arriving. No police have ever said they did this on this case.
Some supporters have claimed the police were trying to frame Bamber from the first few minutes. Pulling Sheila's feet forward two feet does not assist them in this.
So with the police ruled out, only Bamber is left. But why would he want to do this ?
The answer is simple. It was part of the frame.
He wanted Sheila lying down so he could nicely lay the rifle across her. And then put the bible next to her.
It would only take a few seconds to do as there was enough room and nothing in the way. He didn't give it a second thought. There were more important issues that night.
He had no idea this would incriminate him further. It didn't. Until 2002
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There were a lot of things against police protocol, doesnt mean the abided by
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There were a lot of things against police protocol, doesnt mean the abided by
Do you believe the police pulled Sheila's feet forward two feet ?
Why would they do this ?
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Still having your leg pulled Adam? ::)
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Still having your leg pulled Adam? ::)
I am afraid you're contradicting yourself.
Saying Sheila shot herself while sitting up. Although she was lying down when found. Dead seated bodies don't move two feet forward.
I would rather go by Dr Ismail and the 2002 appeal. And you saying Sheila was sitting up. Thanks.
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Nobody can remain in a sitting position when dead.They loll to one side As in Sheila's case she'd slithered back with her head just missing the bedside cabinet.
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I am afraid you're contradicting yourself.
Saying Sheila shot herself while sitting up. Although she was lying down when found. Dead seated bodies don't move two feet forward.
I would rather go by Dr Ismail and the 2002 appeal. And you saying Sheila was sitting up. Thanks.
If you had a shade of sense you would realise that I ment she shot herself then fell back. As dead bodies don't sit upright
You go by the 2002 appeal that decided not to submit Ismali's evidence?
520. Our conclusion was that we should not therefore admit the evidence and we have had no regard to it in reaching our conclusion.
Well done
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If you had a shade of sense you would realise that I ment she shot herself then fell back. As dead bodies don't sit upright
You go by the 2002 appeal that decided not to submit Ismali's evidence?
520. Our conclusion was that we should not therefore admit the evidence and we have had no regard to it in reaching our conclusion.
Well done
how many times did she shoot herself before falling back
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If she had have been pulled down, her nightgown would have gone the opposite way, is their any evidence of prints/dna on her?
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If she had have been pulled down, her nightgown would have gone the opposite way, is their any evidence of prints/dna on her?
not really jb just pulled it down when staging the scene.simple really,jb would be wearing gloves
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But how do you move a dead body with such ease, they are heavy you know! plus pull it down and ruffle it as it was? it has to be a one handed operation, one to lift, one to pull the night gown back down, dna would have been left becuase you would have to lean the corpe onto yourself.
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But how do you move a dead body with such ease, they are heavy you know! plus pull it down and ruffle it as it was? it has to be a one handed operation, one to lift, one to pull the night gown back down, dna would have been left becuase you would have to lean the corpe onto yourself.
i disagree.it was very easy for jb to do .you wouldnt 'have' to lift anything just yank the nightie down with a bit of force
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i dont think thats possible with a dead corpse and in my opinion of removing dead corpses, they are far too heavy, they weigh a ton, its not as easy as you think.
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i dont think thats possible with a dead corpse and in my opinion of removing dead corpses, they are far too heavy, they weigh a ton, its not as easy as you think.
Sheila was a slightly built recovering anorexic so I doubt moving her a few inches would have presented any problems for an excited and excitable Jeremy in the grip of his own psychosis.
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Still not easy for a single person or move their clothing because a dead weight is on top of it no matter what weight or stature of the individual.
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O.k point taken, so when Bamber whipped the nightdress in a downward movement off a dead weight as other posters have stated, which looked cotton to me, why was there no creasing on the back of the nightdress in the back upper mid leg region of Sheila, when she was discovered and why no emphasis on this, because any CSI would catch these discrepancies.
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If you had a shade of sense you would realise that I ment she shot herself then fell back. As dead bodies don't sit upright
You go by the 2002 appeal that decided not to submit Ismali's evidence?
520. Our conclusion was that we should not therefore admit the evidence and we have had no regard to it in reaching our conclusion.
Well done
You forgot the rest of the paragraoh -
520:
It can, however, be said about it that if it had been called at trial, it may well have represented yet another formidable string to the prosecution's bow in a case where even without any regard to that evidence, it has to be said that the prosecution were able to put forward a very strong case pointing to guilt.
Yes, this together with you're insistance that Sheila was sittiing up when shot, makes Bamber 100% guilty.
Lifeless seated bodies don't move forward at least two feet across the floor.
Thank you David.
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If she had have been pulled down, her nightgown would have gone the opposite way, is their any evidence of prints/dna on her?
The expert in the 2002 appeal disagrees.
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Sheila was a slightly built recovering anorexic so I doubt moving her a few inches would have presented any problems for an excited and excitable Jeremy in the grip of his own psychosis.
I should have included that in my thread post. She was very light, almost childlike.
So easy to pull during the frame setting.
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Nobody can remain in a sitting position when dead.They loll to one side As in Sheila's case she'd slithered back with her head just missing the bedside cabinet.
People that fall asleep when sitting up, don't fall sideways.
Rigor mortis sets in on dead people and they just stiffen up in the same position.
Anyway her body would be hunched if it fell sideways. It was straight with her head infront of the cabinet.
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People that fall asleep when sitting up, don't fall sideways.
Rigor mortis sets in on dead people and they just stiffen up in the same position.
Anyway her body would be hunched if it fell sideways. It was straight.
People who fall asleep when sitting up do often fall sideways depending on various other considerations.
Rigour mortis does not usually begin to set in until 2 to 6 hours after death. The first signs are the tightening of head and neck muscles before spreading to other muscles of the body, often not reaching its peak until 4 to 6 hours later.
Sheila appears to have been a very slight build probably with a low muscle mass and therefore may not have been as affected by rigour mortis as someone with a high muscle mass.
Your arguments are flawed imo.
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People who fall asleep when sitting up do often fall sideways depending on various other considerations.
Rigour mortis does not usually begin to set in until 2 to 6 hours after death. The first signs are the tightening of head and neck muscles before spreading to other muscles of the body, often not reaching its peak until 4 to 6 hours later.
Sheila appears to have been a very slight build probably with a low muscle mass and therefore may not have been as affected by rigour mortis as someone with a high muscle mass.
Your arguments are flawed imo.
You're arguments are flawed and without sources again.
Bamber shot Sheila around 2pm. Which is 2 - 6 hours before the police entered WHF. So rigor mortis had set in.
People fall asleep on trains, in cars on chairs, but I have yet to see someone fall sideways. Even when in cars, trains and planes which are moving vehicles.
What has Sheila being small got to do with anything ?
If you don't believe Bamber pulled Sheila's legs at least two feet, please say why the police would do this in the short period before the crime scene photographer arrived.
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You're arguments are flawed and without sources again.
Bamber shot Sheila around 2pm. Which is 2 - 6 hours before the police entered WHF. So rigor mortis had set in.
People fall asleep on trains, in cars on chairs, but I have yet to see someone fall sideways. Even when in cars, trains and planes which are moving vehicles.
What has Sheila being small got to do with anything ?
If you don't believe Bamber pulled Sheila's legs at least two feet, please say why the police would do this in the short period before the crime scene photographer arrived.
Adam seems you don't read posts properly, I did not say rigor mortis had not set in just reminding you how long it takes and that someone of Sheila's build may never have been totally stiff during rigor mortis because I would guess she had a poor muscle base due to her genetics and her diet. She was incredibly light at 7st .... being almost 5'8"
Of course people fall sideways when they are sleeping. if they are sitting absolutely bolt upright, with their back well supported and are perfectly balanced they may not but it's far more common to slip sideways. What about the old joke of someone waking up on a train with their head on their neighbour's shoulder? I was simply saying you cannot prove anything by your argument that people never slip sideways because we know that they often do.
The fact is that babies and children who tend to have a small muscle base do not show the same symptoms of rigor mortis as well muscled adults because in rigor mortis it is the muscles which tighten and cause the body to stiffen.
I simply suggested that Sheila was very light and slight and was a recovering anorexic I believe, therefore she also may have had a poor muscle base which would mean her body may not have ever completely stiffened up with rigor mortis. If you used your reasoning from this fact you may have come to the conclusion that this may explain why the police were able to move Sheila's wrist/arm many hours after some believe she died and that rigor mortis would have kicked in.
I do not know whether JB or the police pulled Sheila's legs or what the reason would be for the police do that, therefore I am afraid I can't help you there.
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Adam seems you don't read posts properly, I did not say rigor mortis had not set in just reminding you how long it takes and that someone of Sheila's build may never have been totally stiff during rigor mortis because I would guess she had a poor muscle base due to her genetics and her diet. She was incredibly light at 7st .... being almost 5'8" As muscle weighs heavy I would guess her muscles were not very developed.
Of course people fall sideways when they are sleeping. if they are sitting absolutely bolt upright, with their back well supported and are perfectly balanced they may not but it's far more common to slip sideways. What about the old joke of someone waking up on a train with their head on their neighbour's shoulder? I was simply saying you cannot prove anything by your argument that people never slip sideways because we know that they often do.
The fact is that babies and children who tend to have a small muscle base do not show the same symptoms of rigor mortis as most adults because in rigor mortis it is the muscles which tighten and cause the body to stiffen. I just suggested that Sheila was very light and slight and was a recovering anorexic I believe, therefore she also may have had small muscles which would mean her body may not have ever completely stiffened up with rigor mortis. If you used your reasoning from this fact you may have come to the conclusion that this may explain why the police were able to move Sheila's wrist/arm many hours after they and you believe she died.
I do not know whether JB or the police pulled Sheila's legs or what the reason would be for the police do that, therefore I am afraid I can't help you there.
7 stone ? Some 6 year olds weigh more.
Perhaps Bamber carried her ten yards ?
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7 stone ? Some 6 year olds weigh more.
Perhaps Bamber carried her ten yards ?
I know!! That is my point!! As for Bamber carrying her, she was still only 4" shorter than JB therefore she would be difficult to carry and I believe impossible to carry without waking her but I am sure you will disagree. You seem to know a magical way of picking p a 5'8" woman and carrying her like a baby without waking her.
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I know!! That is my point!! As for Bamber carrying her, she was still only 4" shorter than JB therefore she would be difficult to carry and I believe impossible to carry without waking her but I am sure you will disagree. You seem to know a magical way of picking p a 5'8" woman and carrying her like a baby without waking her.
She may have started to wake within the 10 seconds of carrying. She may not have done.
One thing is for sure, she wouldn't have a clue she was about to be shot.
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She may have started to wake within the 10 seconds of carrying. She may not have done.
One thing is for sure, she wouldn't have a clue she was about to be shot.
Sheila was a mother of two small boys, Colin said she was an excellent mother therefore she would have opened her eyes immediately she was disturbed and been wide awake. Mothers always sleep with one ear open.
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O.k point taken, so when Bamber whipped the nightdress in a downward movement off a dead weight as other posters have stated, which looked cotton to me, why was there no creasing on the back of the nightdress in the back upper mid leg region of Sheila, when she was discovered and why no emphasis on this, because any CSI would catch these discrepancies.
No answer, came the firm reply,eh Zoe ?
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Sheila was a mother of two small boys, Colin said she was an excellent mother therefore she would have opened her eyes immediately she was disturbed and been wide awake. Mothers always sleep with one ear open.
Not manic depressive mothers on the brink of a psychotic episode. June told PB Sheila was taking NO interest in the boys.
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You're arguments are flawed and without sources again.
Bamber shot Sheila around 2pm. Which is 2 - 6 hours before the police entered WHF. So rigor mortis had set in.
Rigor mortis cannot have fully set in because police moved her arm and hand :-\ plus there is not much lividity in the legs :-\
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Not manic depressive mothers on the brink of a psychotic episode. June told PB Sheila was taking NO interest in the boys.
I know but I am just looking at the situation from Adam's point of viewand pointing out in that context Sheila would have woken if lifted from the bed by JB.
It depends what the argument is, Adam believes JB killed everyone therefore he does not consider Sheila to be in the state you believe her to be in. You believe Sheila killed the boys and everyone else therefore JB would not have been lifting her out of bed.
I have an open mind but tend towards JB guilty because I am not convinced Sheila could have shot herself twice among other things and I don'y believe the police shot her.
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I have an open mind but tend towards JB guilty because I am not convinced Sheila could have shot herself twice among other things and I don'y believe the police shot her.
Its a semi automatic gun. If it was a manual rifle I would probably take the same position
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Its a semi automatic gun. If it was a manual rifle I would probably take the same position
she would still have to push the trigger twice.and as jane has said and i agree it would be hard if not impossible to move her neck to fire the kill shot
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she would still have to push the trigger twice.and as jane has said and i agree it would be hard if not impossible to move her neck to fire the kill shot
We don't really know if Sheila could have moved her neck or not after the first shot. Much of the injury was to soft tissue, the external jugular was shaved and there was damage to the neck vertebrae but how much damage we don't really know. She wouldn't have been paralysed by the injuries because there is no mention of the spinal chord being damaged.
I have known a couple of people who broke their back ie. their vertebrae not the spinal chord, my close friend broke two vertebrae in her lumbar region as a student nurse and although in pain she did walk around for a few days after the injury before being admitted to hospital. Of course she wasn't shot so it's not a good comparison except as an example to show how a person can function with shattered vertebrae.
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Not after the first shot it wouldn't.
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We don't really know if Sheila could have moved her neck or not after the first shot. Much of the injury was to soft tissue, the external jugular was shaved and there was damage to the neck vertebrae but how much damage we don't really know. She wouldn't have been paralysed by the injuries because there is no mention of the spinal chord being damaged.
I have known a couple of people who broke their back ie. their vertebrae not the spinal chord, my close friend broke two vertebrae in her lumbar region as a student nurse and although in pain she did walk around for a few days after the injury before being admitted to hospital. Of course she wasn't shot so it's not a good comparison except as an example to show how a person can function with shattered vertebrae.
She put her hand on the wound at some point so she wasn't paralysed.
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She put her hand on the wound at some point so she wasn't paralysed.
She wouldn't have been paralysed because her spinal chord wasn't affected and of course she appeared to have put her hand up to her neck and touched her wound after the first shot.
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She put her hand on the wound at some point so she wasn't paralysed.
Nor dead at that point either.
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was it the back of her hand that she put to the wound.most people would use their palm
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did the doctor change his mind about if sheila could move her neck or not
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was it the back of her hand that she put to the wound.most people would use their palm
Does it matter ? The fact was that she was alive before the second shot-------------which followed seconds after if you study the wounds.
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did the doctor change his mind about if sheila could move her neck or not
Originally Vanezis stated the two shots were about 30 mins apart and that Sheila could have been able to walk about after the first shot, he later changed his mind and said the two shots were seconds apart.
He also stated in his original written report that Sheila had blood on the palm of her hand, possibly from when she put her hand up to the wound on her neck but his typed report said that the palms of her hands were clean. :-\
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she would still have to push the trigger twice.and as jane has said and i agree it would be hard if not impossible to move her neck to fire the kill shot
No pathologist has made this claim
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Originally Vanezis stated the two shots were about 30 mins apart and that Sheila could have been able to walk about after the first shot, he later changed his mind and said the two shots were seconds apart.
He also stated in his original written report that Sheila had blood on the palm of her hand, possibly from when she put her hand up to the wound on her neck but his typed report said that the palms of her hands were clean. :-\
She cannot have got the blood on her hands from her wounds because the blood stains around the wounds are not smudged
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She put her hand on the wound at some point so she wasn't paralysed.
No she didn't - there would be a mark around the wound if she has and there isn't any.
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Whose were the fingermarks on Sheila's neck and also June's ? Were they bloodied or indented ( as in pressure ) ?
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Whose were the fingermarks on Sheila's neck and also June's ? Were they bloodied or indented ( as in pressure ) ?
do you know if theres a photo of them'finger marks.'junes one's could have been made by june herself
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do you know if theres a photo of them'finger marks.'junes one's could have been made by june herself
There WILL be photographs showing all injuries,including the finger marks---------held under PII. If you read the pathologist's first report,this is stated.
I hardly think that June would have gripped her own neck so much so as to leave fingermarks. They were impressed.
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There WILL be photographs showing all injuries,including the finger marks---------held under PII. If you read the pathologist's first report,this is stated.
I hardly think that June would have gripped her own neck so much so as to leave fingermarks. They were impressed.
Impressed? Where does it state that?
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Impressed? Where does it state that?
If the marks/prints were impressed it means that they were visible as opposed to not. Impressions of someone's fingermarks. Just another term for being visible.
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If the marks/prints were impressed it means that they were visible as opposed to not. Impressions of someone's fingermarks. Just another term for being visible.
They weren't indented marks, they were blood smears Lookout.
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If the marks/prints were impressed it means that they were visible as opposed to not. Impressions of someone's fingermarks. Just another term for being visible.
so they could easily have been made by junes own hand :)
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so they could easily have been made by junes own hand :)
Why would you try and choke yourself ?
Not unless you press hard--------try it sometime and I bet you won't see any impression.
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Why would you try and choke yourself ?
Not unless you press hard--------try it sometime and I bet you won't see any impression.
They were BLOOD marks and not impressions. Cover your hands in paint and touch your throat you'll soon see marks then.
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Why would you try and choke yourself ?
Not unless you press hard--------try it sometime and I bet you won't see any impression.
maybe gasping for air or trying to find the wound to stop the bleeding by placing her hand on it
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Wilkes's book supports that Sheila's legs were pulled.
" John Hayward showed the jury Sheila Caffell's bloodied nightdress. He said it indicated she had been shot in a reclining position and not while lying down".
Why an earth would the police pull Sheila's legs over two feet before crime scene photos were taken ?
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If fingermarks had remained visible,it would have indicated that June had been already dead when they were applied,as indentations stay put after a person has died. Who but an out of control person would do that ?
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If fingermarks had remained visible,it would have indicated that June had been already dead when they were applied,as indentations stay put after a person has died. Who but an out of control person would do that ?
Not sure what this has to do with Sheila's legs being pulled.
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Not sure what this has to do with Sheila's legs being pulled.
Oh dear-----same goes for your blood spots on the kitchen window thread.
This thread is old hat anyway !
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The thread is about Bamber pulling Sheila's legs.
A new source was found today from John Hayward. Which supports David, Buddy and the 2002 appeal assertion that Sheila was sitting up when shot.
Me and the 2002 appeal believing Sheila's legs were pulled by Bamber. Buddy saying the police pulled Sheila's legs before photos were taken.
You have said it is my leg being pulled.
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The thread is about Bamber pulling Sheila's legs.
A new source was found today from John Hayward. Which supports David, Buddy and the 2002 appeal assertion that Sheila was sitting up when shot.
Me and the 2002 appeal believing Sheila's legs were pulled by Bamber. Buddy saying the police pulled Sheila's legs before photos were taken.
You have said it is my leg being pulled.
Do you think there would have been blood on the cabinet behind her head if that was the case? Even if it was a few splattered spots ?
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There was blood found on the Lamp behind Sheila..... DB couldn't believe the lamp was still on the bed side table after the murders when his sister moved in.
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There is no evidence that Bamber staged his sister's body on the bedroom floor. On the contrary, based upon what must have happened involving the contents of the police radio message logs, and police witness statements, the only people who could have adjusted Sheila's body on the floor of the bedroom by dragging her body by both feet is the police themselves. Jeremy was never present inside the farmhouse after cops confirmed two bodies found upon entry into the kitchen at 7.37 and 7.38am. Certainly, by 8.10am, Sheila's body could not possibly have been anywhere upstairs at all, otherwise a total of four bodies found upstairs would have been reported at 'that' time...
Do not ignore the contents of the police radio message logs which were messages passed spontaneously in real time. The police themselves have not offered an official explanation yet (and we are thirty years down the road) for this discrepancy in the body count downstairs and upstairs by the state of play at 8.10am. Bamber himself did not pass those messages and record them, the police did. More significantly, those who saw the figure at the bedroom window with Jeremy at about 4am, (occupants of CA07) were directly involved in relaying the information that 'two bodies had been found downstairs in the kitchen, the body of one dead male, and the body of one dead female'. Therefore, Bews, Myall and Saxby were fully aware from as early as 7.38am, that Sheila's body had been downstairs in the kitchen, yet not one of them has come forward to point out this fact after later learning that Sheila's body ended up on the bedroom floor in time for PC Bird to photograph it there from 10 O'clock, onwards...
Surely, because Bews, Myall and Saxby knew Sheila's body had not even been upstairs until after 8.10am, they should have questioned how her body ended up there thereafter? Did she make her own way there? Was she carried upstairs by the police?
The simple answer is that Bews, Myall and Saxby performed Communication duties between the scene and the control room at a critical point in time, when Ralph Bamber and Sheila Caffells bodies were found downstairs in the kitchen (7.37 and 7.38am), and only a further three bodies found upstairs by 8.10am. The key radio messages that were relayed after 8.10am, onward which involved the displacement of Sheila's body from the kitchen downstairs, to the main bedroom upstairs, have not been disclosed, but Bews, Myall and Saxby would have been privy to this information. They would have known about it. But like the rest of the corrupt officers on duty that morning who have all been involved in trying to cover up the true circumstances of Sheila Caffells death, they have chosen to remain silent about it
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You agree with Buddy then Mike, that the police pulled Sheila's legs ?
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You agree with Buddy then Mike, that the police pulled Sheila's legs ?
Did anyone pull Sheila's legs?
Well, police certainly lifted her body from on top of the bed, onto the floor, that is something that I know with 100% certainty. So, with that in the bag so to speak, I ask myself did police move her body directly from the bed into 'that' position denoted by the set of photographs that PC Bird took from 10 O'clock onwards? I am drawn to the conclusion that police had laid Sheila's body in a different position on the bedroom floor than that shown in PC Birds images. I believe that at one stage prior to police rolling her body onto its back that she had been placed on her right side which is what caused the bloodstain on the upper right hand side of the nightdress. Whilst her body was in this position, obviously the gun was not with the body, it was elsewhere, possibly put back at the window. The police have made no attempt to explain how that triangular shaped bloodstain came about on the nightdress, if she had been sat upright at the time she was shot, and had simply slipped down onto the floor into the position she ended up being photographed in. What is apparent to me, is the very reason why it has been suggested that she was in a sitting posture, or leaning back slightly, comes about because in the photographs I have seen of the body on the bed Sheila was only shot once by that stage. That first shot was not inflicted upstairs at all. She was shot once downstairs. The second shot was inflicted upstairs after her body / she, arrived there, and once her body (in an unconscious state) had been moved from the bed to the floor. Sheila was laid out on the bedroom floor when she received the second fatal shot beneath the chin. Jeremy did not shoot her, and she did not shoot herself. Once she had been shot on this second occasion, police rolled her body into the recovery position upon its right side. At this time the rear part of her nightdress hung down behind her bottom. Afterwards her body was rolled back into the supine position, and the front hem of the nightdress adjusted so as to give Sheila a modicum of decency. This 'rolling of the body's by police left that part of the nightdress which had been hung down behind her bottom whilst she was on her right side, displaced and ruffled beneath her body by the time she ended up where PC Bird took photographs of her. A police officer may have adjusted her legs either by drawing them together or by pulling upon them, in order for the rifle to be brought back to the body and plonked upon it...
If Sheila had been shot whilst sat upright and been killed instantaneously as alleged, the triangular stain on the nightdress, and the diagonal runs of blood from her mouth and nostrils could not have occurred, neither could the rifle have ended up where it did, nor her right hand remain on the weapon...
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You don't agree with David, that Sheila was sitting upright and shot herself twice ?
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You don't agree with David, that Sheila was sitting upright and shot herself twice ?
Sheila was not shot twice whilst sat up, or laid slightly backwards she was stood upright at the time of the first shot downstairs, and she was laid out flat on her back when she was shot on the second occasion with her body being 'on the bedroom floor'. How could she have been shot twice whilst sitting upright in the bedroom, if one shot killed her immediately, and the rifle was always resting against an upstairs window since before entry by the firearm officers into the farmhouse?
Sheila did not get shot until after the entry of firearm officers, and by that stage the rifle by which is supposed to have wounded and killed her, was already in position at an upstairs window as confirmed by the WPC Julia Jeapes statement from around 7.15, onwards, and photographed there after 10 am by PC Bird...
With the rifle at the window upstairs from 7.15am, onward, how could 'that' rifle have been used to shoot Sheila if (as I maintain) she was shot initially downstairs in the kitchen when a firearm officer commenced his entry to get into the kitchen itself? If what I am saying is true, and I am assured it is true, then of course the rifle at the upstairs window could not have fired 'that' first shot. This is because Sheila was downstairs in the kitchen, whilst the rifle which has been deemed the gun which had fired both of the shots into Sheila's body, was upstairs resting against a window, here, there, or wherever...
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The Official site says Sheila shot herself once and stayed in the kitchen. Then went upstairs after the raid team entered WHF. The police then shot the second bullet into her upstairs.
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The Official site says Sheila shot herself once and stayed in the kitchen. Then went upstairs after the raid team entered WHF. The police then shot the second bullet into her upstairs.
Yes, I am aware of their approach to the same outcome as in Sheila was shot twice in total. But, they are wrong about her shooting herself downstairs in the kitchen - what did she shoot herself with if that be true? Since, if that be true which gun did she use to shoot herself with in the kitchen after the firearm officers entered? The anshuzt rifle which is supposed to have fired both of the shots she received was still resting against an upstairs window where it had been eyeballed as being there from 7.15am, onward, so which gun did Sheila shoot herself with, if it wasn't the anshuzt rifle? And, why would police present the evidence that the same anshuzt rifle had fired both of the shots Sheila sustained?
Let's not forget that according to the ballistic expert, Fletcher, bullet PV/20 was a whole bullet, but the one recovered during autopsy by the pathologist was a fragmented bullet. How can a whole bullet, and a fragmented bullet, be the same bullet?
The ballistic evidence in this respect, involving PV/20, is plainly wrong, and the reason why the facts do not add up, is because it's manufactured evidence. You might manufacture evidence because you are trying to cover something up. Bullet PV/20 relates to the first shot, the so called 'non fatal shot'. It has been tampered with because police have attempted and succeeded in making this a one gun crime. However, Sheila was shot twice, once downstairs, and once upstairs, once downstairs with a different gun, and once upstairs with use of the anshuzt rifle from the bedroom window. The position of 'that' rifle at an upstairs window, as verified by WPC Jeapes from around 7.15am, onward, confirms by its presence there at whichever upstairs window, that Sheila Caffell had not been shot and killed by 'that' stage, since if that were the case, who had placed the anshuzt rifle at the upstairs window in time for Jeapes to see it there?
No other rifle was reportedly found in any upstairs rooms, only the anshuzt rifle...
This raises a serious question regarding Jeremy being the murderer who shot and killed his sister and the others with use of 'that' rifle. If he was the killer, and he staged his sister's body to fool the police into thinking his sister had taken her own life after she had killed the others, then why would he leave the murder weapon resting against an upstairs window? Even more bizarre, if the only weapon found upstairs was the anshuzt rifle how can 'it' be at an upstairs window, and on his sister's body, both at the same time?
Impossible...
So, if there was only one such rifle found upstairs at a window, how does that equate with Jeremy Bamber being 'the killer'?
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However, if there had been a second .22 calibre rifle, 'it' being originally downstairs, and later, upstairs, then that changes the picture considerably...
Did such a second rifle potentially exist?
If so, how might it have been used in the overall scheme of things?
Who owned such a rifle?
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Jeremy is adamant that two such rifles were present at the scene on the evening prior to the shootings (1) the family owned anshuzt rifle, and (2) a Bruno bolt action rifle...
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Jeremy is adamant that two such rifles were present at the scene on the evening prior to the shootings (1) the family owned anshuzt rifle, and (2) a Bruno bolt action rifle...
Anthony Pargeter, the owner of the Bruno rifle, is maintaining that for one reason or another, his rifle was not at the scene at the material time...
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Anthony Pargeter, the owner of the Bruno rifle, is maintaining that for one reason or another, his rifle was not at the scene at the material time...
Is his account factual, or true, or not?
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Working on the assumption that the Bruno rifle was present at the scene at the time of the shootings. This adequately accounts for 10 bullets which the ballistic expert Fletcher could not link or associate to the exclusion of all other weapons the fact that these had been loaded, and fired via the anshuzt rifle.
Additionally, use of the Bruno rifle in the shootings and it's capacity to hold 10 rounds, reduces the requirement for anyone to have to load any additional bullets into the anshuzt rifle...
This could be a way of explaining the low level of lead deposits found on the hand swabs taken from Sheila on the 7th August 1985...
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Working on the assumption that the Bruno rifle was present at the scene at the time of the shootings. This adequately accounts for 10 bullets which the ballistic expert Fletcher could not link or associate to the exclusion of all other weapons the fact that these had been loaded, and fired via the anshuzt rifle.
Additionally, use of the Bruno rifle in the shootings and it's capacity to hold 10 rounds, reduces the requirement for anyone to have to load any additional bullets into the anshuzt rifle...
This could be a way of explaining the low level of lead deposits found on the hand swabs taken from Sheila on the 7th August 1985...
Alternatively, the killer brought his own weapon with him to the scene, and afterwards scurried away taking his own weapon with him...
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This brings me back to the key argument relating to the rifle being at a window, and on the body, or at the window, or on the body?
The same rifle, cannot have been at a window and also have been on Sheila's body at one and the same time,vit had to either have been at a window, or on the body?
We know, that in a one rifle upstairs scenario, that at around 7.15am, the rifle was at an upstairs window. We can therefore safely assume that the rifle at 'that' window, was 'not' on the body', at that precise moment in time...
At about 7.15am, therefore, the rifle was 'not' on the body of Sheila Caffell...
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This brings me back to the key argument relating to the rifle being at a window, and on the body, or at the window, or on the body?
The same rifle, cannot have been at a window and also have been on Sheila's body at one and the same time,vit had to either have been at a window, or on the body?
We know, that in a one rifle upstairs scenario, that at around 7.15am, the rifle was at an upstairs window. We can therefore safely assume that the rifle at 'that' window, was 'not' on the body', at that precise moment in time...
At about 7.15am, therefore, the rifle was 'not' on the body of Sheila Caffell...
The fact that the rifle at the window (7.15am), was no longer at the window by 10 O'clock when PC Bird photographed 'it' upon Sheila's body, suggests that somebody moved or brought 'that' rifle from the window to the body at sometime after 7.15am...
Only people who had access to the farmhouse after 7.15am, could have moved, or brought the rifle to the body from the bedroom window...
With 100% certainty Jeremy Bamber could not have been one such person. There was as much a chance that PS Saxby, PS Bews, and PC Myall, being that person who moved or who brought the rifle to the body from 'that' window, as there was for Jeremy to have been capable of doing such an undertaking. If we use 7.15am as the benchmark against which we calculate all possibilities, then it is no coincidence that everything points to Bambers innocence in these murders. He never entered the farmhouse that particular morning, he was outside in the company of police at all times, so he could hardly have brought the rifle to his sister's body from the window at any stage after 7.15am, and staged his sister's body to fool police into thinking and accepting that his sister had taken her own life...
The rifle was either at the window or on Sheila's body, when cops entered the farmhouse...
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If the rifle was with Sheila when police 'found' her body upon entry to the kitchen (7.37 and 7.38am), then how had it got into her possession downstairs in the kitchen from an upstairs window? If such a thing were true, then people would be able to say, that Sheila had taken possession of the rifle from the window upstairs at some point after 7.15am, and brought it downstairs with her intending to use it. But, according to the contents of one firearm officers witness statement, he states that when police entered the kitchen the .22 rifle was not present...
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Movement of the rifle between a window upstairs and Sheila's body upstairs, that is the key to solving four murders, and Sheila Caffells death. Who was responsible for displacing 'that' rifle, from window to body, and or vice versa, after 7.15am...
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Movement of the rifle between a window upstairs and Sheila's body upstairs, that is the key to solving four murders, and Sheila Caffells death. Who was responsible for displacing 'that' rifle, from window to body, and or vice versa, after 7.15am...
As I say, it wasn't Jeremy Bamber. It wasn't PS Saxby. It wasn't PS Bews. It wasn't PC Myall...
If it was Sheila then obviously she had still been very much alive at 7.15am, and afterwards. But if it wasn't Sheila, then what?
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As I say, it wasn't Jeremy Bamber. It wasn't PS Saxby. It wasn't PS Bews. It wasn't PC Myall...
If it was Sheila then obviously she had still been very much alive at 7.15am, and afterwards. But if it wasn't Sheila, then what?
What we do then is, we work systematically through every person who entered and exited whf between 7.30am, until 10 O'clock, until we pinpoint the person, or persons who did move or bring the rifle from an upstairs window to Sheila Caffells body...
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A starting point for this exercise, would be that at some stage after 7.15am when Jeapes spotted the rifle at an upstairs window, that Sheila took possession of the rifle in question and eventually shot and killed herself...
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A starting point for this exercise, would be that at some stage after 7.15am when Jeapes spotted the rifle at an upstairs window, that Sheila took possession of the rifle in question and eventually shot and killed herself...
Set against this, the two scenarios of radio message log versus witness statement version of events regarding body count downstairs and upstairs - which account is true?
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Set against this, the two scenarios of radio message log versus witness statement version of events regarding body count downstairs and upstairs - which account is true?
A massive clue to help people arrive at the correct interpretation comes in the words spoken by firearm officers who were 'instructed' at a debriefing on that first evening of the police investigation by senior officers, to write up their notes, and reports, along the lines that 'what they had been dealing with was a case of four murders and a suicide'...
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Now, taking such an approach throws 'a spanner into the works', because no rifle was reportedly found downstairs with either of the two bodies (male and female). In particular, police were known to be dealing with only two bodies by 7.45am, one murder, and a suicide', by that stage. How then could firearm officers write up their notes along the lines that what they had been dealing with was a case of four murders and a suicide', without a gun being found with the assumed suicide in the kitchen? On the other hand, with the displacement of the female suicide body from the kitchen to the bedroom and the staged scene in the bedroom involving the rifle from the window having been brought to the body, one can start to see the potential for firearm officers to adopt the approach to include the body count downstairs and upstairs at the end of play, rather than have to deal with the transition of the body count originally being two bodies downstairs, three up, changing into one body down, four up. Having to try and accommodate these changes in their note writings would merely have served to expose the mistakes that were made during the firearm operation, which but for the grace of God, could have resulted in police officers being shot at, and even killed...
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Cops didn't want to arrest Jeremy, or charge him with the murders, except for an over zealous 'DS 'Stan' Jones, who took an early dislike to Jeremy...
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The absolute truth of the matter, is that the body count downstairs and upstairs changed at around 8.30am that morning - from 2/3, into 1/4...
Get this, when the body count was 2/3 PS Adams was the Commander of the firearm operation, as opposed to PI Montgomery being the Commander when the body count changed, from 2/3 into 1/4...
How utterly bizarre that a supposed firearm operation had two different Commanders, at different times, in the same firearms operation?
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The absolute truth of the matter, is that the body count downstairs and upstairs changed at around 8.30am that morning - from 2/3, into 1/4...
Get this, when the body count was 2/3 PS Adams was the Commander of the firearm operation, as opposed to PI Montgomery being the Commander when the body count changed, from 2/3 into 1/4...
How utterly bizarre that a supposed firearm operation had two different Commanders, at different times, in the same firearms operation?
rifle observed resting against upstairs window prior to entry by firearm officers
7.30am
COMMANDER Adams
no rifle in kitchen
'the body of one dead male, and one dead female found on entry to kitchen '(7.37am)
'one dead male, one dead female' (7.38am)
'can you contact your police surgeon, and Coroner's officer, regarding two bodies, one male, one female' (7.42am)
'can you come into office police are dealing with an incident at whf, involving a murder and a suicide' (7.45am)
'after a thorough search of the premises, a further three bodies found upstairs. Five dead in total' (8.10am)
8.30am
COMMANDER Montgomery
rifle at window brought to body
'Ralph Bamber downstairs in kitchen'
'June Bamber and Sheila Caffell in main bedroom'
Daniel and Nicholas Caffell in adjoining bedroom'...
later that evening at a debriefing, senior officers gave following instruction to junior officers
'make sure you write your notes up and your reports along the lines that what we were dealing with was four murders and a suicide'...
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rifle observed resting against upstairs window prior to entry by firearm officers
7.30am
COMMANDER Adams
no rifle in kitchen
'the body of one dead male, and one dead female found on entry to kitchen '(7.37am)
'one dead male, one dead female' (7.38am)
'can you contact your police surgeon, and Coroner's officer, regarding two bodies, one male, one female' (7.42am)
'can you come into office police are dealing with an incident at whf, involving a murder and a suicide' (7.45am)
'after a thorough search of the premises, a further three bodies found upstairs. Five dead in total' (8.10am)
8.30am
COMMANDER Montgomery
rifle at window brought to body
'Ralph Bamber downstairs in kitchen'
'June Bamber and Sheila Caffell in main bedroom'
Daniel and Nicholas Caffell in adjoining bedroom'...
later that evening at a debriefing, senior officers gave following instruction to junior officers
'make sure you write your notes up and your reports along the lines that what we were dealing with was four murders and a suicide'...
Whilst PS Adams was the Commander, the female body referred to in the kitchen, was the suicide mentioned by 'Linda' in the control room when she contacted 'DS Davidson' at his home at 7.45am, and requested him to come into the office because police were dealing with an incident at whf involving two bodies, a murder and a suicide'. These two bodies could only be reference to the bodies of Ralph and Sheila, where Ralph's death was referred to as a murder, and Sheila's death being referred to as a suicide...
June Bambers death could not have been described as a suicide...
There were only two female bodies amongst the five victims...
The bodies were found in the following order, Ralph (a murder), Sheila (a suicide), June (a murder), Daniel (a murder), and Nicholas (a murder) according to the police radio message log contents. But if the witness statement version of events is relied upon, the order in which Sheila and June's bodies were found, are reversed, so that Ralph's body (a murder) was found first, June's body (a murder) was found second, then Sheila's body (a suicide) found thirdly, followed by the deaths of the twin boys (both murders)...
Now, the interesting thing in so far as the witness statement version of events, is that only one body was supposedly found downstairs, that being a male body, the body of Ralph Bamber. The second body that the firearm officers come upon is June Bambers body which was just inside the entrance to the main bedroom, she had been shot a total of 7 times...
Hardly likely then, that June's death could have been described as a suicide?
Next, came the discovery of Sheila's body in the same bedroom. Hers being the third body that was found, it being correctly interpreted as a suicide. But before the discovery of Sheila's body, there would have had to be reported two murders, then a suicide. But, as we know, independent messages were passed from the scene at 7.42am, for the police surgeon, and the Coroner's officer to be contacted regarding the discovery of two bodies, one male, and a female...
We know that the first two bodies referred to, involved one dead male, and one dead female. We know that police were talking in terms of one of these deaths having been a murder, whilst the second death was being talked about in terms of it having been a suicide - now, if June Bamber was the second body found her death could not be described as it having been regarded as a suicide...
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Whilst PS Adams was the Commander, the female body referred to in the kitchen, was the suicide mentioned by 'Linda' in the control room when she contacted 'DS Davidson' at his home at 7.45am, and requested him to come into the office because police were dealing with an incident at whf involving two bodies, a murder and a suicide'. These two bodies could only be reference to the bodies of Ralph and Sheila, where Ralph's death was referred to as a murder, and Sheila's death being referred to as a suicide...
June Bambers death could not have been described as a suicide...
There were only two female bodies amongst the five victims...
The bodies were found in the following order, Ralph (a murder), Sheila (a suicide), June (a murder), Daniel (a murder), and Nicholas (a murder) according to the police radio message log contents. But if the witness statement version of events is relied upon, the order in which Sheila and June's bodies were found, are reversed, so that Ralph's body (a murder) was found first, June's body (a murder) was found second, then Sheila's body (a suicide) found thirdly, followed by the deaths of the twin boys (both murders)...
Now, the interesting thing in so far as the witness statement version of events, is that only one body was supposedly found downstairs, that being a male body, the body of Ralph Bamber. The second body that the firearm officers come upon is June Bambers body which was just inside the entrance to the main bedroom, she had been shot a total of 7 times...
Hardly likely then, that June's death could have been described as a suicide?
Next, came the discovery of Sheila's body in the same bedroom. Hers being the third body that was found, it being correctly interpreted as a suicide. But before the discovery of Sheila's body, there would have had to be reported two murders, then a suicide. But, as we know, independent messages were passed from the scene at 7.42am, for the police surgeon, and the Coroner's officer to be contacted regarding the discovery of two bodies, one male, and a female...
We know that the first two bodies referred to, involved one dead male, and one dead female. We know that police were talking in terms of one of these deaths having been a murder, whilst the second death was being talked about in terms of it having been a suicide - now, if June Bamber was the second body found her death could not be described as it having been regarded as a suicide...
Here layeth the problem...
The first two bodies found were, a male body, and a female body. These first two bodies had been reported as a murder, and a suicide (independantly), yet although Ralphs death could certainly be looked upon as a murder, Junes death could not possibly be looked upon as a suicide...
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Timed events, as of 7.37am, 7.38am, 7.42am, 7.45am and 8.10am, were specific - two bodies found upon entry, body of a male, body of a female, a murder, a suicide, and a further three bodies upstairs. There is no getting away from these facts, the situation is set in stone, there exist timed events confirming this scenario. Who were the three victims mentioned as 'having been found upstairs at 8.10am'?
June, Daniel, and Nicholas?
Sheila, Daniel, and Nicholas?
Think about it, first two bodies found, body of one dead male (Ralph), and the body of one female (Sheila / June), first body described as a murder (Ralph), second body described as a suicide (Sheila / June)? According to the contents of the timed police message logs, by 7.45am, that particular morning two bodies had been found upon entry to the kitchen. So, forget about the issue involving a murder, and a suicide, for one moment. Concentrate on two bodies being reportedly found in the kitchen...
A 'male body', and a 'female body', was reportedly found upon entry to the kitchen - refer to the log contents timed at 7.37am, and 7.38am. These are recorded facts, not imagination. Police work, involves documented facts, and such facts or details are usually accompanied by a reference to the time such occurences took place. There's an old saying, 'if you want to know the time, ask a policeman'...
In this instance, that is precisely what we all must do - What time did police report finding the body of 'one' dead male, and the body of ' one' dead female? Well, we know that these reports were accompanied by the timings of 7.37am, and 7.38am...
There's no getting away from the truth in this matter, the facts speak for themselves, two bodies had been found, not just a single body. a dead male body, can easily be defined as being different to the find of a dead female body, referred to in the same documented logs. A male body, as opposed to a female body, both dead, time of messages 7.37am, and 7.38am. We also know, that as a result of the discovery of these two bodies (one male, one female) that a request was made for the police surgeon and the Coroners officer, to attend the incident involving the discovery of 'two bodies' by 7.42am...
Within three minutes of these latter requests being made (7.42am), staff in the control room were made aware that one of these two reported deaths was being described as having been a murder, whilst the second death had been spoken of in terms of it having been a suicide...
By 8.10am, if all of the aforementioned were true, then obviously with it being known or believed that the farmhouse had a total of five residents at that stage, that the other three victims had to be somewhere else inside the farmhouse (alive or dead). It therefore comes as no surprise to discover, that by this stage, 'a further three bodies' were found upstairs...
Based on the contents of the police radio message log events, everything appears tickityboo, two bodies downstairs, three bodies up, supported by 'timed' log entries. Everything fits snugly into the grand scheme of things. Nothing could be any clearer. PS Adams was the Commander of the firearms operation at the scene, from around 5am, until that time (8.10am)...
Then, something went terribly wrong inside the farmhouse...
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What could possibly have gone wrong, after 8.10am?
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What could possibly have gone wrong, after 8.10am?
Well, whatever did go wrong after 8.10am, resulted in the Commandership of the firearm operation changing hands in rather unusual and bizarre circumstances. Since, from 8.10am, onward, PI Montgomery became 'Commander', a role switch which caused a rift between Adams and Montgomery...
How did such a rift come about?
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Well, whatever did go wrong after 8.10am, resulted in the Commandership of the firearm operation changing hands in rather unusual and bizarre circumstances. Since, from 8.10am, onward, PI Montgomery became 'Commander', a role switch which caused a rift between Adams and Montgomery...
How did such a rift come about?
In a nutshell, the situation was not helped by the fact that Adams had remained in charge inside an outbuilding situated close to the farmhouse, after Montgomery, Harris and Gibbons went directly from 'there' into the farmhouse at around 8.15am. At that time, upon arrival of Montgomery, Harris and Gibbons inside the kitchen of the farmhouse, it became apparent that there was only a dead male body (Ralph) in the kitchen - for whatever reason, or whatever circumstance, the kitchen body count had taken a dramatic turn. There was only 'one body' present in the kitchen, a male body. This caused panic in the minds of Montgomery, Harris and Gibbons who had arrived in the kitchen, unarmed...
What we know, is that at this critical point, Montgomery assumed 'Commandership' of the ongoing operation from inside the kitchen. This coincided with the circumstances of the situation which arose from that stage onward, with the body of a female having previously been reported as present in the kitchen, having disappeared into some other part of the farmhouse. At this time, it is no coincidence to note that the telephone eavesdrop involving the kitchen phone with its handset off its cradle, being terminated to enable Harris to use the aforementioned kitchen handset to be used so that Harris could contact Simpson directly and update him with regard to the problem which had just arisen...
The female body was missing from the kitchen...
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It is irrelevant that just prior to the raid team forcing open the farmhouse door, that the body of Ralph Bamber was mistaken for the body of a female. Since, that mistake took place before police got inside the farmhouse. What we do know is that 'one police entered the kitchen, the aforementioned mistake would have been rectified, which does not help to explain the reported discovery of the bodies of one dead male, 'and' one dead female, found upon entry to the kitchen. This was confirmed a minute later, so everyone can be sure that Sheila was downstairs in the kitchen for the whole of the period 7.37am until 8.10am (33 minutes)...
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It is irrelevant that just prior to the raid team forcing open the farmhouse door, that the body of Ralph Bamber was mistaken for the body of a female. Since, that mistake took place before police got inside the farmhouse. What we do know is that 'one police entered the kitchen, the aforementioned mistake would have been rectified, which does not help to explain the reported discovery of the bodies of one dead male, 'and' one dead female, found upon entry to the kitchen. This was confirmed a minute later, so everyone can be sure that Sheila was downstairs in the kitchen for the whole of the period 7.37am until 8.10am (33 minutes)...
By the same token, there were only three additional bodies upstairs' throughout the same 33 minute period...
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What is of particular importance, are the circumstances which brought about a change in the body count downstairs, and upstairs?
One body (the body of a female) became displaced from its original location downstairs in the kitchen, to the main bedroom, upstairs...
How did this transition occur?
Did police carry her body physically upstairs, or did she make her own way from from one place to the other?
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Was she already wounded by that stage?
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Was she already wounded by that stage?
If so, who had shot her, and whereabouts inside the farmhouse did she first get shot? Upstairs? Downstairs?
Where was the gun which had fired the first shot?
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Mike are you going to join Lookout and contribute to the campaign to raise £4,000p ?
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Mike are you going to join Lookout and contribute to the campaign to raise £4,000p ?
What is meant by the term 'contribute to the campaign'?
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When police used the term, 'the body of one dead female' (7.37am), and 'One dead female' (7.38am) it meant that police thought Sheila had been killed and was presumed to have been dead in the kitchen...
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When police used the term, 'the body of one dead female' (7.37am), and 'One dead female' (7.38am) it meant that police thought Sheila had been killed and was presumed to have been dead in the kitchen...
Reference to 'the body of one dead female', and 'one dead female', aforementioned, was a reference to Sheila, not June Bamber. We know this because after June was shot she did not leave the bedroom at all...
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Reference to 'the body of one dead female', and 'one dead female', aforementioned, was a reference to Sheila, not June Bamber. We know this because after June was shot she did not leave the bedroom at all...
The fact that it was Sheila's body being referred to as 'dead' in the kitchen is concerned, this is reemphasized by confirmation by 'Linda' in the control room, contacting DS Davidson (SOCO) at his home address at 7.45am, requesting him to come on duty to the office because police are dealing with an incident at whf involving two bodies, a murder, and a suicide. The male body (Ralph Bamber) was a murder, the female body could only have been a reference to Sheila Caffell, because it is not tenable to argue that June Bambers death was a suicide...
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By 8.10am, police mistakenly assumed that the siege was over and done with, hence why Montgomery, Harris and Gibbons marched themselves unarmed into the main kitchen only to find the body of one dead male...
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According to the police radio message logs, a fourth body was never found upstairs...
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Once Jeapes spotted the rifle leaning against an upper floor window, she made a point of fixing her gaze upon it, ready to report to the forward control point manned by PS Adams, Montgomery, Harris, Gibbons and Clarke, at first instant it disappeared - Jeapes made no report suggesting the rifle had moved away from the window at any stage. It remained at the window upstairs until she left the scene with other firearm officers at around 9am...
By 9.13am, the rifle was brought to Sheila's body from 'that' window - it fired the fatal shot which killed her...
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The shocking truth is that Sheila Caffell still lived for over one and a half hours after police entered the farmhouse, and she did not shoot herself...
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The shocking truth is that Sheila Caffell still lived for over one and a half hours after police entered the farmhouse, and she did not shoot herself...
How could she have possibly died from being shot not once, but twice by use of the anshuzt rifle that for almost two continuous hours had remained untouched against an upstairs window, being constantly monitored by a trained firearms instructor?
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Alarm bells are ringing out loud and clear...
Lets set out the now known facts :-
With the rifle at an upstairs window from 7.15am onward, and remaining there for almost two hours until 9.13am, how could police hope to maintain that Sheila had been shot and killed downstairs in the kitchen (police message log contents), or found shot upstairs in the bedroom (witness statement accounts) whilst ever the said rifle remained unmoved resting against some upstairs window, or other, and the police come up with a claim of suicide downstairs in the region of the kitchen, and a suicide upstairs in the bedroom, both accounts relying upon an impossible claim that the rifle from the upstairs window had been used in both suicide scenarios, when if the truth be known Sheila had not used the rifle at all to shoot herself with, either downstairs in the kitchen, or upstairs in the bedroom...
Her suicide, whether downstairs in the kitchen, or upstairs in the bedroom, were clearly arranged and involved the staging of her body in the bedroom, as though she had always been in possession of the rifle from the window, which of course was not true...
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Alarm bells are ringing out loud and clear...
Lets set out the now known facts :-
With the rifle at an upstairs window from 7.15am onward, and remaining there for almost two hours until 9.13am, how could police hope to maintain that Sheila had been shot and killed downstairs in the kitchen (police message log contents), or found shot upstairs in the bedroom (witness statement accounts) whilst ever the said rifle remained unmoved resting against some upstairs window, or other, and the police come up with a claim of suicide downstairs in the region of the kitchen, and a suicide upstairs in the bedroom, both accounts relying upon an impossible claim that the rifle from the upstairs window had been used in both suicide scenarios, when if the truth be known Sheila had not used the rifle at all to shoot herself with, either downstairs in the kitchen, or upstairs in the bedroom...
Her suicide, whether downstairs in the kitchen, or upstairs in the bedroom, were clearly arranged and involved the staging of her body in the bedroom, as though she had always been in possession of the rifle from the window, which of course was not true...
The anshuzt rifle did not fire the first shot across Sheila's neck downstairs, but it was used to inflict the fatal head shot upstairs in the bedroom...
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The anshuzt rifle did not fire the first shot across Sheila's neck downstairs, but it was used to inflict the fatal head shot upstairs in the bedroom...
Look into the ballistic evidence concerning bullets PV/19 and PV/20 - no suspicions around PV/19, but the same cannot be said for bullet PV/20. This is because police introduced a substituted bullet which had been test fired via the rifle afterwards, to replace the round fired by the other weapon...
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Mike are you going to join Lookout and contribute to the campaign to raise £4,000p ?
I think that is a bit of a personal question . Mike has spent hundreds perhaps even thousands of hours on this case. I think his commitment is obvious. And I don't think any of us needs to know the answer to your question.
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Nobody pulled Sheila forward. She was sitting leaning against the bedside cabinet after the first shot. She then shuffled forward to afford a better position for the second. Simple.
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Plus the pull back from the rifle would have shifted her.