Who has more rights thirty years on: Jeremy or Colin?

[Stephanie]

We seem now to have reached a most unsatisfactory state of affairs: indeed we are at an impasse as both innocent and guilty camps hold steadfastly to their views, and with no new evidence forthcoming. Those who insist on Jeremy's innocence point to bureaucratic inaccuracies and a cover-up unparalleled at the time, whilst the guilters insist that though there were minor inaccuracies the correct verdict was ultimately reached.

Where do we go from here? Are Colin's wishes paramount, that the man who deprived him of his two sons should spend the rest of his life behind bars, or is there still some smidgen of hope through the legal process that the sentence can be overturned? Do we begrudge Jeremy a badminton lesson or can rehabilitation only commence when an admission of guilt is made, possibly to Terry Waite or some other man of the cloth, engaging him in discourse to gently coax out the truth, though in a more intimate environment than a reception-room with screwed-down chairs set within the confines of a dank Victorian edifice, where the only outcome hitherto has been an entrenchment of Jeremy's story, buttressed as he is by an army of supporters, celebrities amongst them, who swear blindly that a miscarriage of justice has taken place.

Whilst I am fully aware of the staffing crisis and financial cut backs in our prisons, pressure should be put on prison Governors, NOMS and all other outside agencies to ensure they are protecting the public, as well as prisoners.

Prisons should be pressured to share with the public the risk level of each prisoner in their care.

[Stephanie]

Stephanie there's a difference between a smidgen of Colin's book and the Encyclopaedia Britannica..

You'll have to explain the difference Steve because most of your posts appear to me like you've swallowed every volume of the Encyclopaedia Britannica?

[Steve_uk]

You'll have to explain the difference Steve because most of your posts appear to me like you've swallowed every volume of the Encyclopaedia Britannica?

Maybe, but it's lodged inside my head and spouted therefrom, not regurgitated verbatim from another person's source.

[Stephanie]

Maybe, but it's lodged inside my head and spouted therefrom, not regurgitated verbatim from another person's source.

I'd understand it if I were taking information from 3rd parties who had given their opinion on the Jeremy Bamber's case over the decades, then adding reams of my own spiel,  or another third parties spiel, but I'm not.

The regurgitated verbatim material to which you refer, explains clearly my point regarding disordered individuals, their traits and manipulation techniques. What's the point in attempting to re-invent the wheel and waste time and energy in the process?

If posters aren't interested in reading links of interest or are in denial about Bamber, that's up to them but the information is there if/when they may need it?

[Stephanie]

Whilst I am fully aware of the staffing crisis and financial cut backs in our prisons, pressure should be put on prison Governors, NOMS and all other outside agencies to ensure they are protecting the public, as well as prisoners.

Prisons should be pressured to share with the public the risk level of each prisoner in their care.

It should be a pre-requisite for every prisoner.

Maybe the prison should start classifying prisoners and incorporating a number or letter into their prisoner ID number, which represents their risk level? Along the lines of the digits included in UK driving licences maybe.

Courts should also be forced to publicly disclose the details of a prisoners pathology at the same time the prisoner is sentenced; (following a guilty verdict). They don't need to go into any details but if the prisoner is personality disordered - the public should be told.

[Steve_uk]

I'd understand it if I were taking information from 3rd parties who had given their opinion on the Jeremy Bamber's case over the decades, then adding reams of my own spiel,  or another third parties spiel, but I'm not.

The regurgitated verbatim material to which you refer, explains clearly my point regarding disordered individuals, their traits and manipulation techniques. What's the point in attempting to re-invent the wheel and waste time and energy in the process?

If posters aren't interested in reading links of interest or are in denial about Bamber, that's up to them but the information is there if/when they may need it?

But what you haven't done successfully is to apply this consistently to specific incidents in Jeremy Bamber's life which reinforces the point you were trying to make. It's why so many members got to screaming pitch when another of your posts appeared(and I was probably one of only a handful of members who has digested them all), and now you've had two complaints you have at least heeded what the silent majority were thinking all along.

[Stephanie]

But what you haven't done successfully is to apply this consistently to specific incidents in Jeremy Bamber's life which reinforces the point you were trying to make. It's why so many members got to screaming pitch when another of your posts appeared(and I was probably one of only a handful of members who has digested them all), and now you've had two complaints you have at least heeded what the silent majority were thinking all along.

I've done it successfully. It's there if people want to read it.

There's no point attempting to debate with posters who have proven they are bias, in denial or have a personal agenda; especially if some of the people fit the criteria in some of the material I've posted.

[Steve_uk]

I've done it successfully. It's there if people want to read it.

There's no point attempting to debate with posters who have proven they are bias, in denial or have a personal agenda; especially if some of the people fit the criteria in some of the material I've posted.

From what I recall you've mentioned Aunt Agatha and the Daisygate saga which has been discussed many times before, to be fair sometime before you joined the site. But there's no point in sermonizing on the theory of psychopathy if you can't relate it to day to day activities in Jeremy Bamber's life, whether past or present.

[Stephanie]

I bet most people here and those who are in contact with Jeremy Bamber have never bothered to find out what his current risk levels are. Most people probably won't know what that means and he most certainly won't be divulging it.

[Stephanie]

From what I recall you've mentioned Aunt Agatha and the Daisygate saga which has been discussed many times before, to be fair sometime before you joined the site. But there's no point in sermonizing on the theory of psychopathy if you can't relate it to day to day activities in Jeremy Bamber's life, whether past or present.

When did you join the site Steve?

[notsure]

We seem now to have reached a most unsatisfactory state of affairs: indeed we are at an impasse as both innocent and guilty camps hold steadfastly to their views, and with no new evidence forthcoming. Those who insist on Jeremy's innocence point to bureaucratic inaccuracies and a cover-up unparalleled at the time, whilst the guilters insist that though there were minor inaccuracies the correct verdict was ultimately reached.
,
Where do we go from here? Are Colin's wishes paramount, that the man who deprived him of his two sons should spend the rest of his life behind bars, or is there still some smidgen of hope through the legal process that the sentence can be overturned? Do we begrudge Jeremy a badminton lesson or can rehabilitation only commence when an admission of guilt is made, possibly to Terry Waite or some other man of the cloth, engaging him in discourse to gently coax out the truth, though in a more intimate environment than a reception-room with screwed-down chairs set within the confines of a dank Victorian edifice, where the only outcome hitherto has been an entrenchment of Jeremy's story, buttressed as he is by an army of supporters, celebrities amongst them, who swear blindly that a miscarriage of justice has taken place.

hi steve, I agree it seems we have no where else to go until some further information/evidence comes to light. The ct say more in 2017 so hopefully if nothing else will give us something new to talk about.

It's a difficult question regarding colin, if I put myself in his shoes jb should never be let out and any murderer that kills 5 including children should never be freed. I don't think the prisons need to tell us anything regarding the guilty prisoners progress as the punishment would be life incarcerated and they would just have to suffer it.

However miscarriages of justice do happen and if jb is one of those then I wouldn'twant him to be locked up for a day longer. We as a society have to get this right more often. People behave differently to what you and I call the norm it doesn't make them guilty. In the luke mitchell case there was a lit written about him Nd his behaviour and the way he looked and he was tried in the press imo. I have to add I really don't know too much about the case but surely it is right that convictions are not made on police building stories based on people's character totally. P's I don't know enough about the case to say guilt or innocence .

[Steve_uk]

When did you join the site Steve?

Why don't you check; the information is there to reference if you're a member.

[Stephanie]

hi steve, I agree it seems we have no where else to go until some further information/evidence comes to light. The ct say more in 2017 so hopefully if nothing else will give us something new to talk about.

It's a difficult question regarding colin, if I put myself in his shoes jb should never be let out and any murderer that kills 5 including children should never be freed. I don't think the prisons need to tell us anything regarding the guilty prisoners progress as the punishment would be life incarcerated and they would just have to suffer it.

However miscarriages of justice do happen and if jb is one of those then I wouldn'twant him to be locked up for a day longer. We as a society have to get this right more often. People behave differently to what you and I call the norm it doesn't make them guilty. In the luke mitchell case there was a lit written about him Nd his behaviour and the way he looked and he was tried in the press imo. I have to add I really don't know too much about the case but surely it is right that convictions are not made on police building stories based on people's character totally. P's I don't know enough about the case to say guilt or innocence .

But what do we do when we have people like Karen Torely campaigning for alleged MOJ's?

She helped free a guilty man from death row, ran off with his brother who was serving 65 years for murder and continued campaigning for people like Simon Hall, having learned nothing.

[Steve_uk]

hi steve, I agree it seems we have no where else to go until some further information/evidence comes to light. The ct say more in 2017 so hopefully if nothing else will give us something new to talk about.

It's a difficult question regarding colin, if I put myself in his shoes jb should never be let out and any murderer that kills 5 including children should never be freed. I don't think the prisons need to tell us anything regarding the guilty prisoners progress as the punishment would be life incarcerated and they would just have to suffer it.

However miscarriages of justice do happen and if jb is one of those then I wouldn'twant him to be locked up for a day longer. We as a society have to get this right more often. People behave differently to what you and I call the norm it doesn't make them guilty. In the luke mitchell case there was a lit written about him Nd his behaviour and the way he looked and he was tried in the press imo. I have to add I really don't know too much about the case but surely it is right that convictions are not made on police building stories based on people's character totally. P's I don't know enough about the case to say guilt or innocence .

What a well-thought out post notsure. I was thinking back to the Evans and Allen case in 1964, the last hangings in Britain, and whether I would have wanted Jeremy Bamber to face the same punishment. I wonder whether the controversy would have ended there, or if the campaigners would have been as vociferous had they not had this figurehead incarcerated, however much he may or may not have been directing the traffic. Would the two jurors who found him guilty have increased to three, thus nullifying the whole point of legal state execution if he were to escape any punishment, or would it have been better as a society to rid ourselves of this mass murderer once and for all, rather than keep him alive with the minute chance that he will ever be released and the undoubted concomitant effect on anyone's mental health in the process?

[notsure]

What a well-thought out post notsure. I was thinking back to the Evans and Allen case in 1964, the last hangings in Britain, and whether I would have wanted Jeremy Bamber to face the same punishment. I wonder whether the controversy would have ended there, or if the campaigners would have been as vociferous had they not had this figurehead incarcerated, however much he may or may not have been directing the traffic. Would the two jurors who found him guilty have increased to three, thus nullifying the whole point of legal state execution if he were to escape any punishment, or would it have been better as a society to rid ourselves of this mass murderer once and for all, rather than keep him alive with the minute chance that he will ever be released and the undoubted concomitant effect on anyone's mental health in the same position?

oh blimey I'm not sure what I think about the death penalty. !!!!  It's a dilemma isn't it. We know jb wouldn't have got it as it was a 10 to 2 and it wouldn't have been allowed. Then again people like Huntley, what's the point in keeping him locked up, I don't think he will ever get out do you.  I live just a few miles from those families.  . I suppose the system has to work a lot better so we don't find innocent people guilty then we could when certain give out a death penalty when needed ridding society of these evil monsters.

I cannot imagine what it must do to a person's mental health being locked up for innocent or guilty people, I think I would ratherbe dead. IIt's amazing how humans have the ability to cope.

Having said all that I hope I nevery have to sit on a jury in a murder trial.