Who has more rights thirty years on: Jeremy or Colin?

[notsure]

But what do we do when we have people like Karen Torely campaigning for alleged MOJ's?

She helped free a guilty man from death row, ran off with his brother who was serving 65 years for murder and continued campaigning for people like Simon Hall, having learned nothing.

well we live in a democratic country so having said that what would you do?

[Stephanie]

hi steve, I agree it seems we have no where else to go until some further information/evidence comes to light. The ct say more in 2017 so hopefully if nothing else will give us something new to talk about.

It's a difficult question regarding colin, if I put myself in his shoes jb should never be let out and any murderer that kills 5 including children should never be freed. I don't think the prisons need to tell us anything regarding the guilty prisoners progress as the punishment would be life incarcerated and they would just have to suffer it.

However miscarriages of justice do happen and if jb is one of those then I wouldn'twant him to be locked up for a day longer. We as a society have to get this right more often. People behave differently to what you and I call the norm it doesn't make them guilty. In the luke mitchell case there was a lit written about him Nd his behaviour and the way he looked and he was tried in the press imo. I have to add I really don't know too much about the case but surely it is right that convictions are not made on police building stories based on people's character totally. P's I don't know enough about the case to say guilt or innocence .

What a well-thought out post notsure. I was thinking back to the Evans and Allen case in 1964, the last hangings in Britain, and whether I would have wanted Jeremy Bamber to face the same punishment. I wonder whether the controversy would have ended there, or if the campaigners would have been as vociferous had they not had this figurehead incarcerated, however much he may or may not have been directing the traffic. Would the two jurors who found him guilty have increased to three, thus nullifying the whole point of legal state execution if he were to escape any punishment, or would it have been better as a society to rid ourselves of this mass murderer once and for all, rather than keep him alive with the minute chance that he will ever be released and the undoubted concomitant effect on anyone's mental health in the same position?

oh blimey I'm not sure what I think about the death penalty. !!!!  It's a dilemma isn't it. We know jb wouldn't have got it as it was a 10 to 2 and it wouldn't have been allowed. Then again people like Huntley, what's the point in keeping him locked up, I don't think he will ever get out do you.  I live just a few miles from those families.  . I suppose the system has to work a lot better so we don't find innocent people guilty then we could when certain give out a death penalty when needed ridding society of these evil monsters.

I cannot imagine what it must do to a person's mental health being locked up for innocent or guilty people, I think I would ratherbe dead. IIt's amazing how humans have the ability to cope.

Having said all that I hope I nevery have to sit on a jury in a murder trial.

You both highlight a crucial factor.

The importance of raising awareness of personality disorders (PD) and the red flags to look out for.

Since September 2015 UK prisons have started raising awareness with staff and 152 pages of guidelines are now in place. Prior to this time, PD's had been neglected.

It is my belief that in 2017 Jeremy Bamber will be exposed for the con artist he is.

[Stephanie]

well we live in a democratic country so having said that what would you do?

  I rest my case.

[David1819]

The Police didn't get any of the loot. I can't understand why they would go against their own boss of the time when all they probably thought that day was how much overtime they could claim.

The police did not discover any of the evidence used to convict him. The only exception of police getting the loot is DCI Ainsley getting employed by RWB at the business he inherited as a result of Jeremy's conviction.

[Steve_uk]

The police did not discover any of the evidence used to convict him. The only exception of police getting the loot is DCI Ainsley getting employed by RWB at the business he inherited as a result of Jeremy's conviction.

They should have found the silencer, but they weren't looking for one. The rest was circumstantial evidence, as Jeremy declared it to be "the perfect crime".

[Steve_uk]

You both highlight a crucial factor.

The importance of raising awareness of personality disorders (PD) and the red flags to look out for.

Since 2015 UK prisons have started raising awareness with staff and guidelines are now in place. Prior to this time, PD's had been neglected.

It is my belief that in 2017 Jeremy Bamber will be exposed for the con artist he is.

Stephanie you have something to contribute to this site, but why not give examples as an illustration of your point with references to the literature on the case or the documents in the library here?

[David1819]

I've done it successfully. It's there if people want to read it.

There's no point attempting to debate with posters who have proven they are bias, in denial or have a personal agenda; especially if some of the people fit the criteria in some of the material I've posted.

Your unqualified opinion proves nothing.


Here is part of Proffessor Egan's university/work profile.

HCPC-accredited forensic and clinical psychologist. Expert in the administration of forensic risk assessment instruments (PCL-R, HCR-20, SVR-20), assessment of personality disorder (IPDE), and the assessment of intelligence (WASI, WAIS-IV, Wechsler Memory Scale).

He was prepared to put his reputation on the line concluding Jeremy was no psychopath.

What does Stephanie do? Ignore him   

But it gets worse. Stephanie then claimed (without evidence) that Bamber had fooled him. In other words making up an excuse to ignore the evidence to suit ones own bias.

[Steve_uk]

Stephanie(or anyone): can psychopaths ever be reformed by therapy of some description? I was not referring specifically to Jeremy Bamber but wondered if there were any examples of this?

[lookout]

Only in their twilight years does it lessen Steve. If they live that long,that is. It's an incurable disease.

[Stephanie]

Only in their twilight years does it lessen Steve. If they live that long,that is. It's an incurable disease.

Psychopathy is not a disease!

And why wouldn't psychopaths live longer? You clearly have no understanding at all!

And what lessons in the twilight years?

[lookout]

A disease of the mind/brain.

[lookout]

I said lessens not lessons.

[Stephanie]

A disease of the mind/brain.

No is isn't!

[Stephanie]

I said lessens not lessons.

What lessens?

[Stephanie]

Stephanie(or anyone): can psychopaths ever be reformed by therapy of some description? I was not referring specifically to Jeremy Bamber but wondered if there were any examples of this?

Michael Stone is an example.

An untreatable psychopath.

I can't remember the name of the professor with pyschopathy?  I've got a mind block. Caroline will know.

Within the criminal justice system? Who knows?  I don't trust the statistics.