Neville's call to Jeremy. A 1% likelihood ?

[Caroline]

I understand what you're saying, I cannot imagine  how he would feel but I accept he would feel differently than myself because I would never have left the house in the first place 
I guess if he wanted to do it or enjoyed it that puts a different spin on it, for that he  would need to be psychopathic/disordered and he may be. We can guess but we don't know.

I hate killing anything but no one likes flies in the house. I killed one a few months back with the flick of a tea towel and felt bad for about 5 minutes. I rationalised that they spread germs so it had to go. That's about the level of how a psychopath views his/her victims. They don't have to enjoy killing, they may even hate it, but if it's a means to an end - the victim has to go and they can always rationalise it.

[David1819]

You are ignoring that Jeremy could have simply lied to police pretending he thought they would be able to tell to make it look good.

We have no idea whether he was sincere or not when he claimed to them such belief.

I did consider this but I doubt it.

IF he honestly believed it then it means he called his answering machine or left the phone dialing till he got home but only he knows if he did such.   

Yes that's what I have already said. He thinks telecom keeps records so in his mind he has to call his own answer machine from WHF so his story of his dads phone call can be matched with what he assumes the telecom provider would have some record of.

[Caroline]

I did consider this but I doubt it.

Yes that's what I have already said. He thinks telecom keeps records so in his mind he has to call his own answer machine from WHF so his story of his dads phone call can be matched with what he assumes the telecom provider would have some record of.

If he didn't know and he made a call to his house from WHF then he would be against the clock getting home because if he thought they could trace the call, then he would assume they would know the time it was made.

[David1819]

I hate killing anything but no one likes flies in the house. I killed one a few months back with the flick of a tea towel and felt bad for about 5 minutes. I rationalised that they spread germs so it had to go. That's about the level of how a psychopath views his/her victims. They don't have to enjoy killing, they may even hate it, but if it's a means to an end - the victim has to go and they can always rationalise it.

Mums crazy so better off dead
Sisters even more crazy so better off dead
Dad has to put up with crazy mum and sister so better off dead
Twins have my crazy sister to raise them so better off dead
I can run farm better by myself anyway.

Jeremy's rationalisation in a nut shell

[Caroline]

Mums crazy so better off dead
Sisters even more crazy so better off dead
Dad has to put up with crazy mum and sister so better off dead
Twins have my crazy sister to raise them so better off dead
I can run farm better by myself anyway.

Jeremy's rationalisation in a nut shell

Exactly - in his mind he was probably doing them a favour.

[Jane]

Mums crazy so better off dead
Sisters even more crazy so better off dead
Dad has to put up with crazy mum and sister so better off dead
Twins have my crazy sister to raise them so better off dead
I can run farm better by myself anyway.

Jeremy's rationalisation in a nut shell

Do you really believe he wanted the farm? I'm more inclined to think he wanted what he could get for it. Farming didn't appear to be in his soul.

[scipio_usmc]

I did consider this but I doubt it.

Yes that's what I have already said. He thinks telecom keeps records so in his mind he has to call his own answer machine from WHF so his story of his dads phone call can be matched with what he assumes the telecom provider would have some record of.

If using his answering machine he would have to have hauled ass home. Even if he phoned his house and left it ringing with the ringer on low to pick up when he arrived home he only would have a limited time to get home and the records would prove the calls came earlier than he asserted.

I find it much more likely that he simply said such to the police to try to snow them as opposed to actually believing the phone company recorded such.  If he actually believed it then he would have phoned the police much faster than he did because the gap in time between when he allegedly received the call and finally called them would be too much to be credible.  Calling his answering machine at 2:45 and not calling police until 3:26 would be pretty damning.  Making it ring till he got home and picking up the phone around 3AM but not calling till 3:26 is still a problem though not quite as bad.   The logistics of it is another problem.  On some phone systems of that era after 8 minutes of ringing it would be cut off on others it could last up to 18 minutes before being cut off.  We don't know which applied to that system.

[scipio_usmc]

If he didn't know and he made a call to his house from WHF then he would be against the clock getting home because if he thought they could trace the call, then he would assume they would know the time it was made.

It would have forced him to haul ass home and call police as soon as he arrived home to keep the gap manageable. 

Moreover it means he would have expected police to be able to tell he lied about calling police before Julie.  If the phone company kept detailed records of the times of all the calls it would mean lying about calling Julie after police would be pointless.

He would have taken all this into account when making up what time Nevill supposedly called him.  I think he knew that they would not be able to tell anything.

[Caroline]

If using his answering machine he would have to have hauled ass home. Even if he phoned his house and left it ringing with the ringer on low to pick up when he arrived home he only would have a limited time to get home and the records would prove the calls came earlier than he asserted.

I find it much more likely that he simply said such to the police to try to snow them as opposed to actually believing the phone company recorded such.  If he actually believed it then he would have phoned the police much faster than he did because the gap in time between when he allegedly received the call and finally called them would be too much to be credible.  Calling his answering machine at 2:45 and not calling police until 3:26 would be pretty damning.  Making it ring till he got home and picking up the phone around 3AM but not calling till 3:26 is still a problem though not quite as bad.   The logistics of it is another problem.  On some phone systems of that era after 8 minutes of ringing it would be cut off on others it could last up to 18 minutes before being cut off.  We don't know which applied to that system.

I agree, as I said before, if he thought the call would be registered, he would have to think that the time was too. I think he was just playing  ignorant.

[David1819]

It would have forced him to haul ass home and call police as soon as he arrived home to keep the gap manageable. 

Moreover it means he would have expected police to be able to tell he lied about calling police before Julie.  If the phone company kept detailed records of the times of all the calls it would mean lying about calling Julie after police would be pointless.

He would have taken all this into account when making up what time Nevill supposedly called him.  I think he knew that they would not be able to tell anything.

Once everyone is dead and he has cleaned himself up, the last thing he does is call his own answerphone then get back to his within 10 minutes to call police its possible.

[nugnug]

i think they were trying to establish that when they timed the bike ride.

[Alias]

Mums crazy so better off dead
Sisters even more crazy so better off dead
Dad has to put up with crazy mum and sister so better off dead
Twins have my crazy sister to raise them so better off dead
I can run farm better by myself anyway.

Jeremy's rationalisation in a nut shell

That is your take - you have no idea. It makes sense to you to stage a two shot murder as suicide?

[scipio_usmc]

Once everyone is dead and he has cleaned himself up, the last thing he does is call his own answerphone then get back to his within 10 minutes to call police its possible.

But if he knew they could get the times of all the calls from police why would he call Julie first?  His goal would be to call police as soon as he got home.  If he thought they could tell he would have phoned police before her.

If he honestly believed police could and would look up the phone records then it means he anticipated they would be able to tell he phoned Julie first and means he would have admitted such to police instead of lying.  Being caught in a lie is worse than admitting the truth.

The timelines he gave are what someone who assumed they would not be able to check times of calls would provide.

[Adam]

But if he knew they could get the times of all the calls from police why would he call Julie first?  His goal would be to call police as soon as he got home.  If he thought they could tell he would have phoned police before her.

If he honestly believed police could and would look up the phone records then it means he anticipated they would be able to tell he phoned Julie first and means he would have admitted such to police instead of lying.  Being caught in a lie is worse than admitting the truth.

The timelines he gave are what someone who assumed they would not be able to check times of calls would provide.

That's a good point.

Bamber spent a year planning the crime. It wouldn't be hard to find out if a call from WHF could be traced.

He was just playing dumb and innocent for the police. Trying to give the impression a call was made from WHF and phone records if they existed would show that.

Anyway, a call from WHF to Bamber could have been made by Bamber himself.

[Adam]

Mums crazy so better off dead
Sisters even more crazy so better off dead
Dad has to put up with crazy mum and sister so better off dead
Twins have my crazy sister to raise them so better off dead
I can run farm better by myself anyway.

Jeremy's rationalisation in a nut shell

Julie has given Bamber's justification why each person had to die.