Neville's call to Jeremy. A 1% likelihood ?

[Adam]

I do agree but then I have always found it hard to believe that he could have crawled through the window, killed all five people even if Nevill was in his expected place he still got away and ran downstairs.... the risk of taking on Nevill was so massive..... fighting over the rifle with Nevill, bashing poor him with the rifle without a mark on him and dashing back over the fields etc. and the rest is history....  it's very difficult to take on board and that is the problem for me.
There is always the feeling if he was involved he wasn't alone but I cannot believe it was Sheila because unless psychotic she just wouldn't have done it. She wouldn't have calmly planned it because it would have been crazy for her to believe she could overcome Nevill and she would never have killed her children in her right mind......   

That's what he did. Got through a window, got a loaded gun and started shooting people.

Choosing the perfect time for an execution.

[maggie]

That's what he did. Got through a window, got a loaded gun and started shooting people.

Choosing the perfect time for an execution.

That is what he was found guilty of so in the eyes of the law that is what he did.
It is OK to question the establishment Adam, you aren't a 'conspiracy theorist' if you question and have doubts about the legal system and the police.

[maggie]

That's a good point.

Bamber spent a year planning the crime. It wouldn't be hard to find out if a call from WHF could be traced.

He was just playing dumb and innocent for the police. Trying to give the impression a call was made from WHF and phone records if they existed would show that.

Anyway, a call from WHF to Bamber could have been made by Bamber himself.

He spent a year planning the crime, investigating whether a call would be registered from WHF to his house but didn't bother to lie down with his rifle and work out how it would fall if he shot himself under his chin.
I find that hard to believe ... of course it may be true as I don't know how his mind worked/works but neither does anyone else.

[Jan]

That's a good point.

Bamber spent a year planning the crime. It wouldn't be hard to find out if a call from WHF could be traced.

He was just playing dumb and innocent for the police. Trying to give the impression a call was made from WHF and phone records if they existed would show that.

Anyway, a call from WHF to Bamber could have been made by Bamber himself.

But who said he spent a year planning the crime? Julie did not - she said he hired a hit man - so no planning there ? And after the trial she said he NEVER admitted being the murderer? Bit of a clever get out clause there don't you think?

discuss Adam.

[Adam]

If Jeremy had been the murderer he would have to have had a back up plan . There is no way he could be 100% sure Sheila would not fight back and lie in exactly where required and therefore the phone call would not have been part of the plan. So he would have been clever enough to have a plan b . But apparently not clever enough to blab about his crime.

There was no back up plan.

Everyone had to die. He improvised when Neville got downstairs. Smashing Neville's head in.

[Jan]

? improvised - so you are saying he had no back up plan if Sheila did not lie down in the exact position he wanted her too and did not even put her hands up instinctively to protect herself?

He never even thought for one minute that that was a possibility?

[Adam]

Cycle to WHF:

Evidence - Bike recently made available. Easy journey. Unseen.


Get into WHF

Evidence - Bathroom window loose or open. Quiet entrance.


Pick up rifle:

Evidence ' Fully loaded rifle available as stated by Jeremy.


Enter main bedroom:

Evidence - Two adults in this room who must be killed first as potential to provide most resistance.


Shoot an in bed June and Neville:

Evidence - Nine of the 11 shots were from inches away by or in the bed.


Go to reload or chase Neville:

Evidence - Spare bullets found in kitchen.


(Unplanned) kitchen fight:

Evidence - Neville was brutally beaten there. 


Shoot and kill a knocked out Neville:

Evidence - Four kitchen head shots into Neville.


Return upstairs:

Evidence - All other shots upstairs.


Either wake and shoot or shoot an already awake Sheila:

Evidence - Sheila found shot in the corner of main bedroom.


Shoot June once:

Evidence - June had moved a few feet. Third head shot required.


Reload, shoot the sleeping twins:

Evidence - Twins shot 8 times in bed. Amount of bullets used shows two reloads carried out on the night.


Stage the scene:

Evidence - Gun and bible by Sheila. Silencer put in a box.


Exit out of kitchen window:

Evidence - 20 sources say it can be banged shut from outside.


Cycle home:

Evidence - Bike found at Jeremy's cottage.

[Jan]

Cycle to WHF:

Evidence - Bike recently made available. Easy journey. Unseen.


Get into WHF

Evidence - Bathroom window loose or open. Quiet entrance.


Pick up rifle:

Evidence ' Fully loaded rifle available as stated by Jeremy.


Enter main bedroom:

Evidence - Two adults in this room who must be killed first as potential to provide most resistance.


Shoot an in bed June and Neville:

Evidence - Nine of the 11 shots were from inches away by or in the bed.


Go to reload or chase Neville:

Evidence - Spare bullets found in kitchen.


Kitchen fight:

Evidence - Neville was brutally beaten there. 


Shoot and kill a knocked out Neville:

Evidence - Four kitchen head shots into Neville.


Return upstairs:

Evidence - All other shots upstairs.


Either wake and shoot or shoot an already awake Sheila:

Evidence - Sheila found shot in the corner of main bedroom.


Shoot June once:

Evidence - June had moved a few feet. Third head shot required.


Reload, shoot the sleeping twins:

Evidence - Twins shot 8 times in bed. Amount of bullets used shows two reloads carried out on the night.


Stage the scene:

Evidence - Gun and bible by Sheila. Silencer put in a box.


Exit out of kitchen window:

Evidence - 20 sources say it can be banged shut from outside.


Cycle home:

Evidence - Bike found at Jeremy's cottage.

You are avoiding the questions . And by the way there was absolutely no forensic evidence linking the bike to the crime at all

[Adam]

? improvised - so you are saying he had no back up plan if Sheila did not lie down in the exact position he wanted her too and did not even put her hands up instinctively to protect herself?

He never even thought for one minute that that was a possibility?

If Sheila resisted, he would use his vastly superior strenght to overpower her. Simple.

[Adam]

Do you not comprehend relationships within a family ? You say Jeremy had not spoken to his mother for years - but he was a regular visitor to the farmhouse and a share holder in their businesses at age 24.

June helped out Sheila all the time - but yes they had their UPS and DOWNs - that is what happens in families some times . Colin describes happy family times and unhappy family times - I think that is quite normal . Colin is someone who knew the family and if there is a book you should read perhaps that is one that might give you some insight.

If Sheila was depressed while she was in the house then perhaps she did turn to her parents? Perhaps she found them controlling ? Perhaps she found her mother interfering and judgemental at times but there are happy family photos as well. Nothing is so black and white.

I have reported you to the moderators again. Accusing me of not 'comprehending relationships in a family'. Jan you must calm down. Bamber is guilty. Accept it.

Sheila sleeping with Neville and June that night is a new suggestion. Similar to Bamber having a daughter.

Whether she slept on her own or not is not of much interest to me. Although if she did, it explains how she got into the main bedroom.

It would be a surprise that Sheila stayed in the main bedroom if Bamber had shot June & Neville ten times, then gone downstairs. Thought she would go to her sons room.

[Jane]

I have reported you to the moderators again. Accusing me of not 'comprehending relationships in a family'. Jan you must calm down. Bamber is guilty. Accept it.

Sheila sleeping with Neville and June that night is a new suggestion. Similar to Bamber having a daughter.

Whether she slept on her own or not is not of much interest to me. Although if she did, it explains how she got into the main bedroom.

It would be a surprise that Sheila stayed in the main bedroom if Bamber had shot June & Neville ten times, then gone downstairs. Thought she would go to her sons room.

You clearly have problems with literacy, this time leading to you making a fool of yourself for reporting Jan for accusing you of not comprehending relationships within a family. SHE DIDN'T, xxxxxx!!! She ASKED if you comprehended them which is entirely different.

[Adam]

Maggie
had all this happened Jeremy would have not expected to find Sheila in June's bed so he would have had to do some quick thinking staging Sheila making beds staging Ralph downstairs cleaning himself up staging Ralph downstairs back to the cottage on foot and appearing calm for his phone call to EP he must be one very cool customer to do this after just murdering his whole family just not ringing true IMO.

There is no evidence Sheila was sleeping in Neville and June's bed.

If she was it was a surprise she suddenly killed the xxx xxxxxx xxx xxx been sharing a bed with.

[Adam]

sorry I resorted to capitals ( shouting ) which I hate .

Other things going on in my life , a moment where my self control slipped.

Jan you must calm down.

Other things in you're life is no excuse.

[Adam]

It seems that supporters are now saying Sheila would have resisted and are going on about Sheila's two shots.

Both of which have been discussed to death. Bamber actually did quite well, managing to kill Sheila with two shots. June needed eight.

Do supporters say how Sheila committed the crime. In a word 'no'.

[lookout]

There was no forensic evidence linking Jeremy to the crime anyway.Jones prayed for a miracle in order to get a conviction,so the " silencer " was used--------------made-up or what ?