Neville's call to Jeremy. A 1% likelihood ?

[Jan]

He does it deliberately, Jan. Plays thick to wind people up. It's a mask to cover his refusal to accept any theory other than his own.

glad its not just me then 

[Caroline]

Jan, I agree if Sheila killed in a psychotic episode whether frenzied or not her mind would have been distorted, no one can believe she was in her right mind when she killed her boys therefore as you say she wouldn't have behaved rationally at all so it's pointless looking for rational behaviour.

And yet rationality would be required to decide to use the rifle and to fathom out how to load it, connect the magazine and chamber a shot.

[Caroline]

WE NEVER SAID SHE SLEPT THERE.

I think she did. It certainly makes more sense than being 'carried' there and not waking up.

[Jan]

I haven't changed that.

There are lots of ways Sheila could have ended up in the main bedroom.

Bamber was perfectly capable of carrying an asleep Sheila a few feet.

Ok -so you are saying she slept through her sons and mother being brutally shot and a huge fight ( allegedly) in the kitchen - people running up and down stairs  sugar bowls being knocked over and lights being smashed ? Do you know what a rifle sounds like even with the silencer on?

then she did not wake up when carried to the bedroom over her dead mother?

Just want to get your thoughts clear.

[maggie]

to be honest I just like a good debate and like to see both sides - but there are plenty of guilters at the moment so I like to provide a balance .

I still though have not seen one probable (99% ) scenario how Sheila would allow herself to be shot in that way/ in that position  with no resistance or defensive action- logically or purely animal instinct. And if she had fought back or even put her hands up in human reaction his whole plan would have fallen to pieces and been destroyed - what was he back up plan then?

I absolutely agree with you Jan, if he did it I believe he knew he would have to take her completely by surprise and shoot her in the neck before getting her in the right position to shoot her again feigning suicide, it was a massive gamble so no idea what Plan B could have been.

[susan]

to be honest I just like a good debate and like to see both sides - but there are plenty of guilters at the moment so I like to provide a balance .

I still though have not seen one probable (99% ) scenario how Sheila would allow herself to be shot in that way/ in that position  with no resistance or defensive action- logically or purely animal instinct. And if she had fought back or even put her hands up in human reaction his whole plan would have fallen to pieces and been destroyed - what was he back up plan then?

Jan I agree with you on this point and I have wondered why Sheila did not put up any resistance unless it was a joint suicide and she was double crossed

[lookout]

Sheila had a temper and it definitely would have shown even towards Jeremy if he'd  dared hurt one of her boys,so to even think it was he who'd killed them, Sheila would have fought him leaving her mark/s with her long nails. He'd have been black and blue as I'd wager a bet that she was stronger than he was in one of her " do's ".

[lookout]

Didn't I see written not so long ago that the family were often squabbling/rowing ?

[maggie]

I think she did. It certainly makes more sense than being 'carried' there and not waking up.

Of course she would have woken up, no way could he have carried her to the main bedroom put her down and shot her while still asleep, makes no sense at all, neither do I believe she would have walked there/been led there without any attempt to get away from him. She either killed herself or JB shot her once in the neck, catching her unawares and then positioned her on the floor and shot her again leaving the rifle on her and setting the scene (badly) as a suicide.

[Jane]

Sheila had a temper and it definitely would have shown even towards Jeremy if he'd  dared hurt one of her boys,so to even think it was he who'd killed them, Sheila would have fought him leaving her mark/s with her long nails. He'd have been black and blue as I'd wager a bet that she was stronger than he was in one of her " do's ".

Nothing of Sheila's behaviour in that last fortnight suggests she had an ounce of resistance in her.

[Jan]

I think she did. It certainly makes more sense than being 'carried' there and not waking up.

yes adam should accept this scenario  that she slept on her parents bed - it makes his theory easier.He can pm me if he decides to change his mind.

[Jane]

Didn't I see written not so long ago that the family were often squabbling/rowing ?

MOST families have disagreements. The Bambers were probably no different. Sheila, as she didn't live there would have been unlikely to have been involved.

[maggie]

Jan I agree with you on this point and I have wondered why Sheila did not put up any resistance unless it was a joint suicide and she was double crossed

But why would Sheila agree to a suicide pact with JB?  Why would she agree to her boys being killed unless she was ill enough to kill them herself?  I don't believe she would have killed them unless psychotic and therefore would have done it alone, she wouldn't have needed Jeremy and would have killed him as well if he was there....  wouldn't she?
I keep coming back to the belief she slept with June that night, hence the reason for the bear and her dying in that room and where was June going when she walked over to where Sheila was found?  If Sheila was lying on top of June's dried blood it means Sheila either died much later or was moved over the blood spots after she died.

[Jane]

yes adam should accept this scenario  that she slept on her parents bed - it makes his theory easier.He can pm me if he decides to change his mind.

Yes Jan, it may help rehabilitate him if he had someone to communicate with.

[maggie]

yes adam should accept this scenario  that she slept on her parents bed - it makes his theory easier.He can pm me if he decides to change his mind.