Neville calling Jeremy. A time for closure ?

[lookout]

What has height/weight got to do with anything when the aggressor is wavering a rifle at its victim ??

[lookout]

There have been incidents in America of 4 and 5 year olds " playing " with a gun that was carelessly left out,and when the parent/s have witnessed this,they've naturally been very cautious when removing the weapon from the child. So here you have 3ft odd height against a possible 6ft. The stumbling block being the gun and NOT the height of the person holding it !!

[Mr. Gee]

It's not a case of 'wanting' to believe Jeremy is guilty at all. Personally I don't believe the call happened because he is now willing to completely change the times in order to fit in a call from Neville. What is true now, was true then - you can't just change the time to suit.

Well something must have changed Caroline, or you wouldn't have changed your belief abut the call happening?

[Caroline]

Well something must have changed Caroline, or you wouldn't have changed your belief abut the call happening?

I've said MANY times why I changed my mind. It's not a case of 'wanting' him to be guilty, admitting you have changed your mind when you have argued as vehemently as I did, the other way, isn't easy. But I'm not going to lie about what I think. The phone call always bothered me, but I played it down until I could think of a decent explanation - I never found one. I'm sure there are things that bug you and that make you question innocence? When there are enough of them, you can't ignore them any longer. I'm not saying I think he's guilty just to p**s on people's chips - it's what I believe and if people accepted that it's nothing personal against them,debate might be a LOT easier!

[Jane]

I've said MANY times why I changed my mind. It's not a case of 'wanting' him to be guilty, admitting you have changed your mind when you have argued as vehemently as I did, the other way, isn't easy. But I'm not going to lie about what I think. The phone call always bothered me, but I played it down until I could think of a decent explanation - I never found one. I'm sure there are things that bug you and that make you question innocence? When there are enough of them, you can't ignore them any longer. I'm not saying I think he's guilty just to p**s on people's chips - it's what I believe and if people accepted that it's nothing personal against them,debate might be a LOT easier!

Can I follow that by adding that there are beliefs I held when I thought he was innocent that, even though I've changed my mind, I STILL hold to be true. One of the reasons that this case is so complex is the sub plots going on in the background.

[Caroline]

Can I follow that by adding that there are beliefs I held when I thought he was innocent that, even though I've changed my mind, I STILL hold to be true. One of the reasons that this case is so complex is the sub plots going on in the background.

Me too - the silencer for instance, still think that was planted.

[nugnug]

i think its got to be 4 policeman checked the cupboard and dident see it.

and if jeremy had used the silencer i dont think he would be asking for tests to be done on it beouse he would know that would prove his guilt.

[Jane]

i think its got to be 4 policeman checked the cupboard and dident see it.

and if jeremy had used the silencer i dont think he would be asking for tests to be done on it beouse he would know that would prove his guilt.

And we have Adam -who we rather wish we didn't!!!- having him trailing bloodied clothes around Europe whilst LEAVING an in criminating silencer right under the noses of the police. I DON'T THINK SO.

[nugnug]

you would think a silencer would be a priorty to get rid of.

[Jane]

you would a silencer would be a priorty to get rid of.

You certainly would, Nugs

[Adam]

And we have Adam -who we rather wish we didn't!!!- having him trailing bloodied clothes around Europe whilst LEAVING an in criminating silencer right under the noses of the police. I DON'T THINK SO.

This thread is about closure of the ridiculous claim about Neville calling Jeremy.

I created a recent thread about closure of blooded clothing disposal. That is if there was blood. As well as threads on the silencer.

[Adam]

The judge called Neville's call 'difficult or impossible to understand and explain' / 'mysterious'. He is correct as there are a lot of reasons why Neville would not call Jeremy -


Jeremy may not answer. Regardless of whether he heard the phone ringing or not.

Neville may not have time. Sheila was going crazy. There were five people inside WHF who were the priority.

He may not answer for a long time as was 'sleeping like a log'.

Neville may only get the answering machine.

Neville will assume the answering machine is switched on. Making it impossible for Jeremy to answer the phone within 3 - 8 rings as he was 'sleeping like a log'.

Jeremy did not like Sheila or understand her illness.  So would just make things worse when trying to talk her down.

Sheila did not like Jeremy.

Another adult, June was available at WHF.

The rifle was not powerful, being used for vermin. Neville would know this. So Neville would tackle Sheila prior to shots being fired.

Sheila had 'limited'/ no experience with guns. So Neville would tackle Sheila prior to shots being fired.

Neville could restrain Sheila easily. If fully or even partially fit.

Neville and June together could restrain Sheila easily. If fully or even partially fit.

Jeremy was three miles away and not dressed. 

The police had been called by Neville ten minutes earlier.

Neville would be putting his only son in danger.

Jeremy may be scared to go over. He told Liz Rimmington that Sheila was going 'back to the nut house' and told the police she had committed child abuse. Now Neville had told him she had 'gone crazy' with a gun.

Jeremy did not have a key to WHF so would have to smash the door down, or smash a window. Or shout through the letter box. Making Sheila more excitable.  Neville may not have been aware that Jeremy could get in through windows.

Sheila would not be pleased to see him.

Jeremy would be reluctant to rush over if answering the phone. Having poor relations with all the family.

Jeremy may refuse to go over. Being tired and upset at being woken.Lookout said it was common for Sheila to have 'one of her turns' so he may have decided to go back to bed.

Jeremy may not rush over. Maybe wasting up to 26 minutes doing strange things.

Jeremy may just ring nearby farm workers and tell them to go over. Something Neville could do himself and may consider a better option.

Jeremy may just ring the Foakes's and tell them to go over. Something Neville could do and may consider a better option. 

Neville calling someone would antagonise Sheila. She may even brutally beat someone.

Neville could call the Foakes's. Who were two adults living at WHF.

There was no time to make any calls if Sheila had 'gone' crazy with a gun. 

When there was time to make a call Neville had the option of restraining Sheila. Getting June to assist.

There was no time to wait for someone to arrive. Sheila had 'gone 'crazy'.

Relations between the two were poor and getting worse.   After Jeremy robbed the caravan site and spent the money.

Neville would be prepared to take a torso bullet in order to restrain Sheila. Knowing the gun was for shooting vermin/rabbits and a torso shot would not kill him.

The kitchen phone was downstairs. Meaning everyone would be left upstairs. Unless Sheila had accompanied him downstairs.

If the answering machine was switched off, as his supporters claim. Jeremy would not hear his downstairs phone. If his bedroom door was shut.

Neville was bigger and stronger than Jeremy and the head of the family.

Sheila would have to let Neville open the door when Jeremy arrives. Or Neville would have to put himself in danger by getting to the front door against Sheila's wishes.

Sheila is more likely to fire bullets if more people start pressurising her and arriving on the scene.

Neville would be aware that he was the person who always had most success in calming down an excited Sheila. If he couldn't, then someone who thought Sheila was a 'looney' certainly could not.

Jeremy was not known to be especially brave. So may refuse to go anywhere near the inside of WHF. Preferring to stay 50 yards from the entrance.  This is what happened.

Neville would be implicating his son if there were any injuries or fatalities. As Jeremy would be first on the scene and first witness. This is what happened.

Jeremy was not known for being especially brave. So may have just phoned the police. Neville had either already done this. Or wanted to keep things private. Jeremy did in fact call the police.

It is not standard practice to call relations on the phone at 3am when you're life is in danger. There are no other examples of this happening.


Do people believe after 29 years,  it is time for closure on this issue ?

[Adam]

A reminder of the reasons.

Reading everything about Jeremy, both pro and anti, it is amazing that people believe Neville would ring him.

If Neville thought Jeremy was going to rush over, go through the loose window & restrain Sheila, Neville was wrong. Very wrong.

[Jane]

This thread is about closure of the ridiculous claim about Neville calling Jeremy.

I created a recent thread about closure of blooded clothing disposal. That is if there was blood. As well as threads on the silencer.

Were you expecting a medal?

[nugnug]

You certainly would, Nugs

it would be my top priority i think to get rid of more than the clothes.