What exhibits were destroyed in 1996?

[lookout]

Doesn't matter if they believe him guilty or innocent. If there was no puddle there was no puddle.

You're too quick on the uptake,Mat. It wasn't about the " puddle " I'm afraid. It was about digestion.
It just goes to show how swift you at honing in if you think there's any aggro that you can join in with.
How utterly sad ! Better luck next time,eh ?

[lookout]

Behind the table where we can't see ? That would be a start. Another place where there was blood,and that was on the cupboard doors. Now which doors,I don't know,but it was definitely cupboard doors.

[No-Bits]

To Caroline and Hartley you are now stating that the "fight" in the kitchen was "staged".
(1) To say that the kitchen scene was staged must remain only an assumption by you and Hartley. There is nothing at the scene to suggest any such thing. This must be emphasised every time that this "staging" is mentioned.
             (2) The police have already admitted that the breaking of crockery etc happened when the raid team broke in. Even if one officer admitted it and the rest remained silent, nevertheless that one officer's admission must surely through suspicion upon the statements of the other officers as he has no reason to lie. Because of this all the raid team statements must of necessity be treated with caution.
             (3) I the light of this one officer's admission that the damage was caused through the actions of the raid team and the fact that they admitted to have moved the body of Sheila even so ever slightly we are justified in assuming that if the scene was staged then it must have been staged by the police themselves.
 
To suggest that the kitchen scene was "staged" must remain only speculation, as there is absolute no evidence for this except within your own minds and prejudice.

There was quite clearly a fight of some description, the pathologist attributes many of the wounds to Nevill's arms as being caused by being struck with a linear object. Naturally the most obvious linear object to hand would be the murder weapon, although metal pokers are also a candidate.

I will not speak for Caroline, however I am of the opinion that a fight (perhaps even just a one sided assault) did indeed take place, however there are items in the kitchen which appear to be unnaturally placed, another word would be staged.

I trust that enlightens you Miss P? 

[No-Bits]

Behind the table where we can't see ? That would be a start. Another place where there was blood,and that was on the cupboard doors. Now which doors,I don't know,but it was definitely cupboard doors.

I believe you are mistaken on this Lookout.

There is another item of furniture where the phone was located, there are what appears to be 'bloody' fingerprints on the edge of the counter top.

There are no other 'pools' of blood. Or at least there is no evidence that there was.

[Caroline]

To Caroline and Hartley you are now stating that the "fight" in the kitchen was "staged".
(1) To say that the kitchen scene was staged must remain only an assumption by you and Hartley. There is nothing at the scene to suggest any such thing. This must be emphasised every time that this "staging" is mentioned.
             (2) The police have already admitted that the breaking of crockery etc happened when the raid team broke in. Even if one officer admitted it and the rest remained silent, nevertheless that one officer's admission must surely through suspicion upon the statements of the other officers as he has no reason to lie. Because of this all the raid team statements must of necessity be treated with caution.
             (3) I the light of this one officer's admission that the damage was caused through the actions of the raid team and the fact that they admitted to have moved the body of Sheila even so ever slightly we are justified in assuming that if the scene was staged then it must have been staged by the police themselves.
 
To suggest that the kitchen scene was "staged" must remain only speculation, as there is absolute no evidence for this except within your own minds and prejudice.

I didn't say it WAS staged, I said it LOOKS as though it was staged. Stop taking everything sooooooooooooooooo personally. 

[JackiePreece]

There was quite clearly a fight of some description, the pathologist attributes many of the wounds to Nevill's arms as being caused by being struck with a linear object. Naturally the most obvious linear object to hand would be the murder weapon, although metal pokers are also a candidate.

I will not speak for Caroline, however I am of the opinion that a fight (perhaps even just a one sided assault) did indeed take place, however there are items in the kitchen which appear to be unnaturally placed, another word would be staged.

I trust that enlightens you Miss P? 

Pure speculation

[guest154]

You're too quick on the uptake,Mat. It wasn't about the " puddle " I'm afraid. It was about digestion.
It just goes to show how swift you at honing in if you think there's any aggro that you can join in with.
How utterly sad ! Better luck next time,eh ?

No I am not wrong. You read about the puddle in a book. I clearly remember you stating such.

[nugnug]

An author refenced a pool of blood yet offered no evidentiary basis for the claim.  Lookout doesn't care that no evidentiary basis was provided and chooses to run with any claims by authors that support her claims that evidence was tampered with by police regardless of whether they are unsupported allegations.

no policeman has so far sued any of these authers.

[Adam]

There was quite clearly a fight of some description, the pathologist attributes many of the wounds to Nevill's arms as being caused by being struck with a linear object. Naturally the most obvious linear object to hand would be the murder weapon, although metal pokers are also a candidate.

I will not speak for Caroline, however I am of the opinion that a fight (perhaps even just a one sided assault) did indeed take place, however there are items in the kitchen which appear to be unnaturally placed, another word would be staged.

I trust that enlightens you Miss P? 

A fight certainly took place. Both people knowing it was a life or death fight.

[Adam]

From the 2002 appeal:

42. The examination of Nevill Bamber's body also revealed black eyes and a broken nose, linear bruising to the cheeks, lacerations to the head, linear type bruising to the right forearm, bruising to the left wrist and forearm and three circular burn type marks to the back. The linear marks were consistent with Mr Bamber having been struck with a long blunt object, possibly a gun.

The judge said Neville put up a tremendous struggle for life. The crime scene confirms this, with smashed lampshades and upturned furniture.

Neville was fit enough to get downstairs. Either following the killer to challenge him/her. Or to get past him/her upstairs before being caught downstairs.

Neville could restrain Sheila with one arm BW said. But he didn't. Or leave a mark on her.

Sheila was not tall enough to reach Neville's face with her hands. But somehow during the struggle managed to get Neville sitting down. Perhaps by hitting him with the rifle stock with tremendous force. Once sitting down she proceeded to smash his face in. And then reload and shoot him three more times. Talk about psychotic episode.


If it was Jeremy, he was either followed by or chased Neville. After firing 11 bullets in the main bedroom, he had to reload and stop Neville using the downstairs phone. Jeremy could reach Neville's face with or without the rifle. Finally bashing an injured Neville to near death with a combination of punches and rifle blows.  Three more bullets after a reload sealing his fate.

The back burn marks are strange. I suspect the killer wanted to make sure there was no life, after the rifle proved to be not very powerful.

[lookout]

There was more than one gun in that farmhouse.Why didn't Neville pick one up,Pargeters for instance,and shoot Jeremy in the legs to put him out of action ? Being that Neville was " the big,strong man " that everyone has described him as being,why wasn't he strong enough to have grappled the rifle from Jeremy and knocked him cold ?
I don't buy the fact that Jeremy wouldn't have shown any marks/injuries from the " violent " struggle in the kitchen. It would have been a fight to the finish between the two men.
No,poor Neville was trying his level best to reason with Sheila,as it's obvious that he was opposed to hitting a woman,particularly a sick one,who he wouldn't have thought was sick enough to open fire.

A young milksop of a man has no chance against a" big,strong" farmer. He'd have knocked the rifle right out of Jeremys' grasp,by immediately diverting his attention.
3 adults ? Come on----------------Sheila wouldn't have been averse to using her " psychotic powers " in order to protect her children.

[Adam]

There was more than one gun in that farmhouse.Why didn't Neville pick one up,Pargeters for instance,and shoot Jeremy in the legs to put him out of action ? Being that Neville was " the big,strong man " that everyone has described him as being,why wasn't he strong enough to have grappled the rifle from Jeremy and knocked him cold ?
I don't buy the fact that Jeremy wouldn't have shown any marks/injuries from the " violent " struggle in the kitchen. It would have been a fight to the finish between the two men.
No,poor Neville was trying his level best to reason with Sheila,as it's obvious that he was opposed to hitting a woman,particularly a sick one,who he wouldn't have thought was sick enough to open fire.

A young milksop of a man has no chance against a" big,strong" farmer. He'd have knocked the rifle right out of Jeremys' grasp,by immediately diverting his attention.
3 adults ? Come on----------------Sheila wouldn't have been averse to using her " psychotic powers " in order to protect her children.

Well Neville would have to get to the gun cupboard. Then find a gun that was loaded. If there were no loaded guns he would have to load. Something he would not have time to do.

Neville was badly injured when downstairs. Having been shot four times. Jeremy was fully clothed and holding a weapon. But there was still a tremendous struggle according to the judge.

[Jan]

If the body had been there for hours how do you know that some of those injuries were not caused whilst he was shot and incapable of fighting back - mainly the head injuries ?

and as we discussed before - was his pyjama jacket of when he was shot ? If not why would Jeremy put it on if he was staging it as him being shot by Sheila?

Why the cushion on the floor to absorb some of the blood?

[lookout]

A fight certainly took place. Both people knowing it was a life or death fight.

So why wasn't Jeremy black and blue after the " life or death fight " ? To come away from such a fight,completely unscathed,is some feat !

[lookout]

Strange how we didn't hear anything about the abdominal " injury " that Sheila had,which was pointed out by the pathologist,who'd said was there before the tragedy ? What was it ? Self-inflicted,or did it happen at the time that June received her black eye just days before the tragedy ?