Breakdown of Sheila's drowsiness in days/hours leading to massacre.

[Hardy Boy]

He has lady friends visiting him doesn't he? I doubt I'd get any if I was in prison 

Hi Jonathan visiting time must be something he looks forward to,  he’s human after all,  not sure how much visiting he actually gets though?

[Rob_]

I really cant understand why everyone is so unwilling to accept that the Aga may well have caused the burns to Nevills back and instead pursue more sinister and far fetched explanations.

Not everyone snow! I think the Aga is the most likely cause of the burns to Nevil.

Two people I have spoken to who own Aga's said they can get quite hot on the outside.

We need a scan of the handles and this can be proved or disproved either way.   

[Hardy Boy]

I really cant understand why everyone is so unwilling to accept that the Aga may well have caused the burns to Nevills back and instead pursue more sinister and far fetched explanations.

Ha Ha So Neville supposedly spends hours unconscious, recovers all motor function to stand, walk, speak  to Jeremy on the phone, and then was immediately overpowered and shot by Sheila is not far fetched, it’s more budget science fiction.

[Adam]

Ha Ha So Neville supposedly spends hours unconscious, recovers all motor function to stand, walk, speak  to Jeremy on the phone, and then was immediately overpowered and shot by Sheila is not far fetched, it’s more budget science fiction.

At least Snow is not saying Nevill also spent 10 minutes speaking to Chelmsford Police after regaining conciousness. I agree with that!

[Steve_uk]

Good good, Steve!
Hopefully you will have a long and happy retirement when it comes, once you decide where to settle down that is!

I think you're right to stay in this country if you're dependent on the NHS. Not to say I'm not; we all are to some extent. https://www.examinerlive.co.uk/news/uk-world-news/we-left-uk-retired-now-32992725?int_source=nba

I'll let you know when I've moved, and would welcome a visit, wherever that may be: https://www.fazwaz.com.ec/en/property-sales/3-bedroom-house-for-sale-in-portoviejo-manabi-u4124150

[snow66!]

I think you're right to stay in this country if you're dependent on the NHS. Not to say I'm not; we all are to some extent. https://www.examinerlive.co.uk/news/uk-world-news/we-left-uk-retired-now-32992725?int_source=nba

I'll let you know when I've moved, and would welcome a visit, wherever that may be: https://www.fazwaz.com.ec/en/property-sales/3-bedroom-house-for-sale-in-portoviejo-manabi-u4124150

Well I certainly wont have an abundance of spare cash to spend on health care, Steve!
I'm just aiming for the 'comfortable' lifestyle when I reach retirement at 67 in eight years time, nothing extravagant!
Enough to pay the bills, have a holiday or two and a change of vehicle from time to time!
 

[snow66!]

Hi Snow, I tend to agree with what knight say’s,  elderly people bruise really easily as the person ages the skin becomes thinner, we’ve all seen how easy elder people bruise, if you think about where the marks were on Neville’s back aligned with his spine,  this area would offer no cushioning so forceful prodding could cause those bruises,  and maybe that’s why his head landed in the coal Scuttle as he was prodded/pushed from behind.  Maybe he was prodding hard from behind using this as a method to check for life?  I think once his head went forward uncontrollably into the Coal Scuttle,  Bamber would have know that Neville was dead?

Possibly, HB, but I still think the most probable cause of the marks is the Aga, the spacings are just too similar!

[snow66!]

Not everyone snow! I think the Aga is the most likely cause of the burns to Nevil.

Two people I have spoken to who own Aga's said they can get quite hot on the outside.

We need a scan of the handles and this can be proved or disproved either way.

Sorry Rob, of course I am well aware that the likes of you and Bubo think the Aga burned Nevill too.
Indeed, Bubo pointed out the possibility years ago and had he had access to an Aga I have no doubt he would have worked out which parts of the handles were responsible.
I think Roch believes it may have been the Aga too as does ILB, although he doesn't see that it proves who the killer was.

[ILB]

I honestly don’t know how he’s coped ILB, he really must be mentally strong, chasing a MOJ must be the only positive thing to focus on.  The only way I’d manage if they let me do three hours cycling a day and bike maintenance after.

He's an old head at it now Hardy, it's his bread and butter.

He is literally Ellis Boyd Redding in Shawshank redemption.

[ILB]

The simple problem with the cover up framing scenario is simply the initial outcome was murder suicide.

This wasn't a illterate street kid with a reading age of 9, it was a well spoken middle class privately educated soon to be extremely wealthy individual. A poster boy Thatcherite.  It would have been stratgetic suicide for EP to family this type of man who had just lost five members of his family.

Would have been madness for EP to do this

[snow66!]

Ha Ha So Neville supposedly spends hours unconscious, recovers all motor function to stand, walk, speak  to Jeremy on the phone, and then was immediately overpowered and shot by Sheila is not far fetched, it’s more budget science fiction.

Yes, it sounds far fetched, HB, but if the police didn't move Nevill from the Aga to the scuttle after entry, what other explanation is there if you accept that the Aga made the marks?
OK, you think prodding with the rifle caused the marks, but for me, it is the Aga spacings that seal the deal, just too similar to be coincidental!

[Steve_uk]

He's an old head at it now Hardy, it's his bread and butter.

He is literally Ellis Boyd Redding in Shawshank redemption.

At least he admitted to his heinous crime. Let's hope Bamber is never released.

[Steve_uk]

The simple problem with the cover up framing scenario is simply the initial outcome was murder suicide.

This wasn't a illterate street kid with a reading age of 9, it was a well spoken middle class privately educated soon to be extremely wealthy individual. A poster boy Thatcherite.  It would have been stratgetic suicide for EP to family this type of man who had just lost five members of his family.

Would have been madness for EP to do this

That's why he thought he could dismiss Julie and fool a jury.

[Hardy Boy]

Possibly, HB, but I still think the most probable cause of the marks is the Aga, the spacings are just too similar!

To me Snow it’s the most fitting and simplest explanation, Boyce was right the first time when he said it was caused by the rifle.  I don’t think Bamber would want to take off his gloves and rely on a pulse check, especially when there was a better option,  prodding and pushing is more faster than trying to locate the pulse, this way he keeps his gloves on and keeps hold of the weapon.


For it to be the Aga Snow you have to move away from the simple explanation and either go down the route of Neville’s body being moved by police officers so they could burn evidence, or going against medical Science, I don’t think for one minute Medical science would back up a functional Neville coherent enough to walk, talk and run upstairs and down again after hours unconscious?  Recovery after such would be slow, slurred speech,  unbalanced and unable to stand and confusion and possible vomiting.

[Steve_uk]

After inflicting the above injuries & shooting him 4-8 times, burning his back 3 times as torture is strange. Nevill was either unconcious or dead.

Burning his back 3 times as torture is not exactly Gerald Butler in Law Abiding Citizen.

I couldn't watch that film in its entirety. A small clip on YouTube and I had to desist.