Appeal for new information

[lookout]

Unless of  ourse she is trying to atone for her past sins of putting an innocent man behind bars? Some people do this.They cram their lives with good works to give the impression they have a good heart. Jimmy Savile being just one example. Robert Maxwell being another, giving the impression that he was being generous by giving £1000's to AIDS organisations, whilst all the time he was robbing the pension funds of his workers.

I agree Lugg. Beware those who can't do enough for folk. Usually a motive behind their " good deeds ".
There are very few who will do anything for anybody out of the good of their hearts.

[maggie]

I agree Lugg. Beware those who can't do enough for folk. Usually a motive behind their " good deeds ".
There are very few who will do anything for anybody out of the good of their hearts.

I think there are good and selfless people around lookout, you being one of them but a person with low emoting skills quite often likes to get into positions of power and will often use their charm and brain power to do that.  imo

[Caroline R]

I never ignore anyone's posts and have answered yours,apart from wishing to speculate on the sexuality of Julie which I find distasteful. In the first telephone call(the tonight's the night call on the Tuesday evening) Julie was pleasantly tired after working all day in London and off her guard as to what Jeremy had in store. They both ended the call when the conversation had run its course.

But you have no problem speculating on Jeremy's sexuality! And after the second call, she simply went back to sleep!

[Caroline R]

No I'm like the cat with the proverbial nine lives and am currently on life number 6. I believe there was talk of a job at a flower nursery but Julie was not working there at the time of the murders,hence her returning to London on Sunday 4th August,and her surprise at seeing the bicycle at Goldhanger for the first time on the Saturday. Jeremy did not mention the reason you suggest for the presence of the bicycle there during interrogation by Police at any time as far as I can remember.

Her alleged surprise!

[hourglass]

Keep up XiLi. It was the banana men from Mars.

That is not correct, Martians look completely different.  It was the Silurians.   

[hourglass]

Why should speculation about Julie's sexuality be so distasteful to you. She seemed not to have your reserve. She quite unnecessarily introduced anal sex into her witness statement and I believe that you, on numerous occasions, have called Jeremy's sexuality into question.

As for her being "pleasantly tired after working all day(!)........." I imagine it may have had more to do with what she and her friends had been smoking before they retired to bed.

Women often say that.  It is like to play the "little victim card", "He was so cruel to me!"  "He was unnatural!"

Men are easy to control.  If they want things a woman not like you tell them to stop and they never try again.  They want things like that they can go and pay for it and not come back.

I think she was just play "victim card" at that point.

[Caroline R]

But she was a young girl from the north of England whom one could in no way describe as being well versed in London's ways. Here she was faced with a situation where the official verdict as recorded by a Police force was "four murders and a suicide",so what was the likelihood that one individual could overturn it?

I'm also from the north of England and can tell you, in Julie's shoes I'd have been shocked initially but as soon as I had gathered my thoughts, I would have gone to the police and I'm talking days not weeks or after being dumped. He would be the one being dumped, just before I shopped him! Everything about her actions point to 'a woman scorned and cold calculating revenge!

[hourglass]

I'm also from the north of England and can tell you, in Julie's shoes I'd have been shocked initially but as soon as I had gathered my thoughts, I would have gone to the police and I'm talking days not weeks or after being dumped. He would be the one being dumped, just before I shopped him! Everything about her actions point to 'a woman scorned and cold calculating revenge!

I think it is the time to "gather thoughts" that is the difficult bit.  People react in different ways.  When you are older and stronger a few hours to firm up a judgement is more than enough.  When younger or inexperienced in violence then maybe longer.  I do know of women who have sat quietly for years while they or their children have been abused and it is only after some trigger that they finally take action.  This is true of a lot of cases when a man has been arrested for serious crime and the woman finally speaks up.  A lot depends on your support network too.

Consider Ian Huntley case where his girl friend help with cover up.  Initally not belive what happen and then finally end up in jail.  I am sure she wishes she spoke up earlier but maybe afraid of violence or not wanting to think the worst.

[Caroline R]

I think it is the time to "gather thoughts" that is the difficult bit.  People react in different ways.  When you are older and stronger a few hours to firm up a judgement is more than enough.  When younger or inexperienced in violence then maybe longer.  I do know of women who have sat quietly for years while they or their children have been abused and it is only after some trigger that they finally take action.  This is true of a lot of cases when a man has been arrested for serious crime and the woman finally speaks up.  A lot depends on your support network too.

Consider Ian Huntley case where his girl friend help with cover up.  Initally not belive what happen and then finally end up in jail.  I am sure she wishes she spoke up earlier but maybe afraid of violence or not wanting to think the worst.

You're see I could go along with this had she not identified the bodies, ONLY told police after being dumped, sold her story to the highest bidder and while agreeing to pose in that ridiculous manner!! And let us not forget that both the jury and the judge placed little faith in her testimony!

[tyler]

Hi Girls 
I have been reading your posts with interest! Re:JM........I agree that it appears that she went to the police once she realised that JB was slipping away from her.But can we really believe that that JB told her he was responsible for the murders.How could he have possibly known that she would not have gone straight to the police?Does anyone think it more likely that the "relatives" convinced her that he was responsible?
I find it interesting that Mabel Speakman changed her will,leaving everything to PB,on the 3rd September 1985,after RWB told her that the family were dead and that Jeremy was responsible.This is less than 4 weeks following the murders!And that initially.David,Anthony,Peter,and Colin all believed that Sheila could very well have been responsible.The driving force behind the campaign to put the blame on Jeremy appears to have been RWB and his daughter AE.And it was both of these family members that appear to have been a little more concerned with the financial aspect of things following the murders.
What is also interesting is that Basil Cox and the Boutflours decided that that June and Sheila's estates should go to their next of kin,which just happened to be Mabel Speakman,so all this passed to PB too upon Mabel Speakman's death the following year.Jeremy had not yet had his trial,or even been arrested in connection with the murders! And yet RWB told the jury (who had specifically asked) that his family would NOT benefit financially if Jeremy was indeed found guilty.The jury had wanted to know if RWB and "others" had a financial motive for giving evidence against Jeremy.Did RWB blatantly lie to the jury? If so,what else did he lie about?
None of this sits easy with me!

[killingeve]

Yes Caroline but he expressed an antipathy towards Jeremy from the outset,possibly not wanting to maintain the status quo as DCI Taff Jones did.

Hi Steve_uk

The police have a long history of allowing their own prejudices to wrongly influence cases:

Birmingham 6/Maguire 7/Guildford 4 etc = Irish and Catholic

Stephen Lawrence = Black

Jeremy Bamber = Posh ie privately educated, well spoken, middle class, smooth, babe magnet etc

The police were only happy dealing with known quantities ie white, British, heterosexual, working class males.  Anyone outside had an uphill battle.

[maggie]

Hi Girls 
I have been reading your posts with interest! Re:JM........I agree that it appears that she went to the police once she realised that JB was slipping away from her.But can we really believe that that JB told her he was responsible for the murders.How could he have possibly known that she would not have gone straight to the police?Does anyone think it more likely that the "relatives" convinced her that he was responsible?
I find it interesting that Mabel Speakman changed her will,leaving everything to PB,on the 3rd September 1985,after RWB told her that the family were dead and that Jeremy was responsible.This is less than 4 weeks following the murders!And that initially.David,Anthony,Peter,and Colin all believed that Sheila could very well have been responsible.The driving force behind the campaign to put the blame on Jeremy appears to have been RWB and his daughter AE.And it was both of these family members that appear to have been a little more concerned with the financial aspect of things following the murders.
What is also interesting is that Basil Cox and the Boutflours decided that that June and Sheila's estates should go to their next of kin,which just happened to be Mabel Speakman,so all this passed to PB too upon Mabel Speakman's death the following year.Jeremy had not yet had his trial,or even been arrested in connection with the murders! And yet RWB told the jury (who had specifically asked) that his family would NOT benefit financially if Jeremy was indeed found guilty.The jury had wanted to know if RWB and "others" had a financial motive for giving evidence against Jeremy.Did RWB blatantly lie to the jury? If so,what else did he lie about?
None of this sits easy with me!

Or me Tyler.  I agree with what you have written.  I cannot believe for a moment that JB told Julie he had commited the murders. 

The kind of personality needed to commit such dreadful crimes just doesn't gel with the niaivity and stupidity of someone who will admit such a thing to anyone, and then a few weeks later turn them against him.
   
She has never mentioned him theatening or bullying her, or of her being truly, genuinely terrified of him.

I feel the family chose him by default and then it was easy to build a case around him, especially as some of his recent history had been dodgy.   

He's made out to be some sort of pantomime villain by the likes of steve and bares little or no resemblence to anything approaching a psychopathic murderer either in his behaviour after the murders or in fact in his previous history.
 
I find it impossible to believe that anyone but a psychopath could commit such a cold blooded evil crime.  Sheila was obviously really ill and was not of sound mind so am not levelling such accusations against her. imo

[Lugg]

Women often say that.  It is like to play the "little victim card", "He was so cruel to me!"  "He was unnatural!"

Men are easy to control.  If they want things a woman not like you tell them to stop and they never try again.  They want things like that they can go and pay for it and not come back.

I think she was just play "victim card" at that point.

My wife ordered me to say that that's not true.

[maggie]

I'm also from the north of England and can tell you, in Julie's shoes I'd have been shocked initially but as soon as I had gathered my thoughts, I would have gone to the police and I'm talking days not weeks or after being dumped. He would be the one being dumped, just before I shopped him! Everything about her actions point to 'a woman scorned and cold calculating revenge!

I don't think I would have been dumping anyone Caroline, I do think I would be running for the train going home to the 'North' and then telling the police.  I would have been terrified but not because of the area of the country I grew up in but because anyone in theie right mind would be terrified of someone who could commit such a nightmare crime.

[maggie]

My wife ordered me to say that that's not true.

I have to agree with your wife Lugg, never noticed anyone taking any notice of me.  Most men do what they want in my experience.