Jeremy Bamber Forum
JEREMY BAMBER CASE => Jeremy Bamber Case Discussion => Topic started by: Adam on September 28, 2014, 10:53:AM
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Neville to Jeremy - 'Mysterious', said the judge.
Jeremy to Julie - 'Unbelievable', said the COA judges.
Neville to the police - Very unlikely said Jeremy. Until 2005.
Jeremy to Witham - Not 999 ? and strangely not answered.
Jeremy to Chelmsford - Again, not 999 ?
Chelmsford to Witham. Strangely answered.
Jeremy to Julie at 5am. 'A police car is coming to pick you up'.
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The most mysterious one of all was the one which was expected from Sheilas' birth mother that night ??
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It was a 'strange' night of phone calls.
Jeremy telling Julie 'he only had one 10p coin. Lucky he left his cottage with it.
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Why evade the facts ?
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Just changed the thread title.
There is no proof of three of the phone calls Jeremy has claimed took place.
Yes I did say 'three'.
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Change the record for Gods' sake ! It makes no difference to me whatsoever how much you disbelieve Jeremy. You'll NEVER change my mind,seeing as you think you've changed everyone elses'. ::)
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Change the record for Gods' sake ! It makes no difference to me whatsoever how much you disbelieve Jeremy. You'll NEVER change my mind,seeing as you think you've changed everyone elses'. ::)
Strange how each phone call is controversial in their own ways. Or not believed.
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In between buttoning up his shirt. Putting on two jumpers, and a jacket, Jeremy managed to remember to bring 'one 10p' with him.
Good planning.
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In between buttoning up his shirt. Putting on two jumpers, and a jacket, Jeremy managed to remember to bring 'one 10p' with him.
Good planning.
Adam what are you trying to say? LOL....That Jeremy knew that the police would have asked him to call her... ;D ;D ;D ;D
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In between buttoning up his shirt. Putting on two jumpers, and a jacket, Jeremy managed to remember to bring 'one 10p' with him.
Good planning.
He could always have asked the copper who took him to the call box OR done a reversed charge call.
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Adam what are you trying to say? LOL....That Jeremy knew that the police would have asked him to call her... ;D ;D ;D ;D
He obviously wanted Julie there. Whisking her over first thing in the morning. After Bews said he requested that he phone Julie.
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He could always have asked the copper who took him to the call box OR done a reversed charge call.
Thought a copper would give him more than one 10p. Julie said Jeremy only had 'one 10p'.
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Thought a copper would give him more than one 10p. Julie said Jeremy only had 'one 10p'.
But it isn't recorded that Jeremy asked.
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He obviously wanted Julie there. Whisking her over first thing in the morning. After Bews said he requested that he phone Julie.
He was asked if there was anyone who he might want to be with him and he said his girlfriend. There is nothing unusual about this Adam. The police went with him to the telephone box and he made a quick call knowing that he had only got one 10 pence on him. He may have had more money on him but he had only got one 10 pence to make a call. ;D ;D ;D ;D
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He obviously wanted Julie there. Whisking her over first thing in the morning. After Bews said he requested he phone Julie.
Who else could Jeremy have called at that time ? The relatives didn't particularly want to know the family. Even Sheilas' letter from hospital to AE was ignored.!
All EP were doing was nit-picking and generally finding fault,oh,and noting these little irrelevancies down in their various pocketbooks for future reference so that they could sting him. ???
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He obviously wanted Julie there. Whisking her over first thing in the morning. After Bews said he requested that he phone Julie.
He was asked if there was anyone he wanted to call/be with him and he said he wanted his girlfriend. Irrelevant of WHO he called, the police took him to make the call.
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He was asked if there was anyone who he might want to be with him and he said his girlfriend. There is nothing unusual about this Adam. The police went with him to the telephone box and he made a quick call knowing that he had only got one 10 pence on him. He may have had more money on him but he had only got one 10 pence to make a call. ;D ;D ;D ;D
He must have put the 10p in his pocket before leaving the cottage.
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He must have put the 10p in his pocket before leaving the cottage.
WHY must he?
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WHY must he?
Because he phoned Julie.
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He must have put the 10p in his pocket before leaving the cottage.
He may have had other change too....and some notes. ;D ;D ;D ;D
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He was asked if there was anyone he wanted to call/be with him and he said he wanted his girlfriend. Irrelevant of WHO he called, the police took him to make the call.
Bews's statement does not say that.
Bit presumptuous of Jeremy to say a police car was picking her up.
A bit presumptuous of the police to arrange this hours before entry. Or had they ?
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Jeeze--------5 murders and Adam's going on about 10p. ::)
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He may have had other change too....and some notes. ;D ;D ;D ;D
He must have put those in his pocket before leaving to. Together with 10p.
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He must have put those in his pocket before leaving to. Together with 10p.
Adam he could not forsee that he would use a call box at all. To suggest that would be bonkers. lol ;D ;D ;D
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Bews's statement does not say that.
Bit presumptuous of Jeremy to say a police car was picking her up.
A bit presumptuous of the police to arrange this. Or had they ?
This is totally outside of the parameters and moving towards inane stupidity.
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This is totally outside of the parameters and moving towards inane stupidity.
I don't understand. It was hours before the raid team entered.
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I don't understand. It was hours before the raid team entered.
Do tell us why that was Adam--------please.
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Adam he could not forsee that he would use a call box at all. To suggest that would be bonkers. lol ;D ;D ;D
If he committed the massacre. He would want Julie there ASAP. He rang her at 3am for gods sake.
Ringing her at 5am ensured she arrived early. Ringing her late morning after making breakfast and giving his statement meant he would have no one to boast to for most of the day.
So 'one 10p' was needed.
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Adam,are you by any chance sending me SPAM mail ??
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If he committed the massacre. He would want Julie there ASAP. He rang her at 3am for gods sake.
Ringing her at 5am ensured she arrived early. Ringing her late morning after making breakfast and giving his statement meant he would have no one to boast to for most of the day.
So 'one 10p' was needed.
If he'd been as close to having OCD as you're implying, he wouldn't have been sussed.
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Adam,are you by any chance sending me SPAM mail ??
No answer came the firm reply. It can be traced.
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No answer came the firm reply. It can be traced.
Why would I send you spam mail ?
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If he committed the massacre. He would want Julie there ASAP. He rang her at 3am for gods sake.
Ringing her at 5am ensured she arrived early. Ringing her late morning after making breakfast and giving his statement meant he would have no one to boast to for most of the day.
So 'one 10p' was needed.
If he had wanted Julie there then why did he not askl her this when he phoned her at 3:15?
How would he know that the police would not call her themselves. How could it be possible for him to know in advance that they would ask him if he wanted anyone there with him? It was not until the declaration of a siege was in place by the police that this prompted the police to ask in the first place.
It could have turned out differently of course. Bews could have banged on the front door of the farm, looked in every window to access the situation, but he didn't. Its not practical to take a member of the public round the farm on a rekkie if the police thought there were any danger to them or the person with them. :) :) :) :)
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If he had wanted Julie there then why did he not askl her this when he phoned her at 3:15?
How would he know that the police would not call her themselves. How could it be possible for him to know in advance that they would ask him if he wanted anyone there with him? It was not until the declaration of a siege was in place by the police that this prompted the police to ask in the first place.
It could have turned out differently of course. Bews could have banged on the front door of the farm, looked in every window to access the situation, but he didn't. Its not practical to take a member of the public round the farm on a rekkie if the police thought there were any danger to them or the person with them. :) :) :) :)
He can't send a police car to Julie's at 3.00am. The police had not even arrived at WHF.
But at the earliest opportunity, Julie was whisked from Lewisham to Essex.
Well if the police didn't ask him, he could ask the police. Which is what Bews said did happen. Jeremy leaving the crime scene to find a call box.
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He can't send a police car to Julie's at 3.00am. The police had not even arrived at WHF.
But at the earliest opportunity, Julie was whisked from Lewisham to Essex.
Well if the police didn't ask him, he could ask the police. Which is what Bews said did happen. Jeremy leaving the crime scene to find a call box.
But can we entirely trust what Bews says. Isn't it, in part, because of some of what he said, that questions were raised?
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He can't send a police car to Julie's at 3.00am. The police had not even arrived at WHF.
But at the earliest opportunity, Julie was whisked from Lewisham to Essex.
Well if the police didn't ask him, he could ask the police. Which is what Bews said did happen. Jeremy leaving the crime scene to find a call box.
No, but he could have asked her to come, nonetheless. Apart from telling her his plan and saying that tonight it the night she told him to go to bed. She did not believe that Jeremy had done anything for 4 weeks after....It was not until she caught him on the telephone to an old flame that she threw a wobbly...
It mattered nothing to her that he may have killed 5 people, what really hurt her was him arranging to meet up with his ex girl friend. This is when the tables turned and this is when she went to police with her story and then sat half naked after the trial and posed for a photo shoot for the NOTW and got 25 thousand pounds for doing so.....
Don't get me wrong Adam, it would have been difficult for her to have stuck by him at the onset with what she claimed to know. But, when you go and identify two little boys who died for no reason at all, surely this would have changed her mind immediately and not the call to his ex. Sorry for the bluntness. :) :) :) :)
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But can we entirely trust what Bews says. Isn't it, in part, because of some of what he said, that questions were raised?
I didn't know that about Bews. Have you got a source ?
Anyway. Jeremy asked if he could phone Julie at 5am. Several hours before anyone knew what had happened. This was at the earliest available time for him. Bews did say he made this offer.
Jeremy had one 10p to call Julie with.
He left the crime scene, probably for a long period to find a call box and make the call. Saying 'a police car is going to pick you up'.
There is no evidence that the police had agreed to pick Julie up. They had not determined the situation.
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No, but he could have asked her to come, nonetheless. Apart from telling her his plan and saying that tonight it the night she told him to go to bed. She did not believe that Jeremy had done anything for 4 weeks after....It was not until she caught him on the telephone to an old flame that she threw a wobbly...
It mattered nothing to her that he may have killed 5 people, what really hurt her was him arranging to meet up with his ex girl friend. This is when the tables turned and this is when she went to police with her story and then sat half naked after the trial and posed for a photo shoot for the NOTW and got 25 thousand pounds for doing so.....
Don't get me wrong Adam, it would have been difficult for her to have stuck by him at the onset with what she claimed to know. But, when you go and identify two little boys who died for no reason at all, surely this would have changed her mind immediately and not the call to his ex. Sorry for the bluntness. :) :) :) :)
She is said to have returned to bed and "knew he'd done it"?
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I didn't know that.
Anyway. Jeremy asked if he could phone Julie at 5am. Several hours before anyone knew what had happened. This was at the earliest available time for him. Bews did say he made this offer.
Jeremy had one 10p to call Julie with.
He left the crime scene, probably for a long period to find a call box and make the call. Saying 'a police car is going to pick you up'.
There is no evidence that the police had agreed to pick Julie up. They had not determined the situation.
The police did pick her up Adam. It is documented somewhere I have read it....Is it unusual not to have money in ones pocket or something? ;D ;D ;D ;D
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Why would I send you spam mail ?
I'm not asking you why you'd send them.I'm asking you have you.
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No, but he could have asked her to come, nonetheless. Apart from telling her his plan and saying that tonight it the night she told him to go to bed. She did not believe that Jeremy had done anything for 4 weeks after....It was not until she caught him on the telephone to an old flame that she threw a wobbly...
It mattered nothing to her that he may have killed 5 people, what really hurt her was him arranging to meet up with his ex girl friend. This is when the tables turned and this is when she went to police with her story and then sat half naked after the trial and posed for a photo shoot for the NOTW and got 25 thousand pounds for doing so.....
Don't get me wrong Adam, it would have been difficult for her to have stuck by him at the onset with what she claimed to know. But, when you go and identify two little boys who died for no reason at all, surely this would have changed her mind immediately and not the call to his ex. Sorry for the bluntness. :) :) :) :)
How is Julie supposed to get from Lewisham to Essex at 3am ?
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He obviously wanted Julie there. Whisking her over first thing in the morning. After Bews said he requested that he phone Julie.
Wow! Good job he never had a hole in his pocket then. You would no doubt you'd have called it yet another mystery. ;D
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How is Julie supposed to get from Lewisham to Essex at 3am ?
Friends car?
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Taxi ? Pay at other end----------Jeremy was loaded !
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Taxi ? Pay at other end----------Jeremy was loaded !
He only had 10 pence...lol ;D ;D ;D ;D
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How is Julie supposed to get from Lewisham to Essex at 3am ?
It wasn't a police problem. They're law enforcers not taxi services. She would have had to order a taxi or ask a friend.
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He only had 10 pence...lol ;D ;D ;D ;D
According to most,he was loaded. ::) What about what he stole from his dads' wallet ??-------eeeeek ;D
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He may have had other change too....and some notes. ;D ;D ;D ;D
Good job he had another jumper in the car as well. Very suspicious that? ;D
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According to most,he was loaded. ::) What about what he stole from his dads' wallet ??-------eeeeek ;D
Probably £50 notes which wouldn't be any good in a phone box coz they don't give change ;D ;D ;D
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Bews's statement does not say that.
Bit presumptuous of Jeremy to say a police car was picking her up.
A bit presumptuous of the police to arrange this hours before entry. Or had they ?
They probably told him that although obviously it was not recorded?
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Probably £50 notes which wouldn't be any good in a phone box coz they don't give change ;D ;D ;D
Taxi,girl-----taxi. ;D ;D ;D ;D
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Taxi,girl-----taxi. ;D ;D ;D ;D
It costs 200 quid even today from London as you have to pay their return journey as well.
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It costs 200 quid even today from London as you have to pay their return journey as well.
It's probably nearly as much as half of that to go up by train if it isn't prebooked and it's NOT door to door service. :D
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It costs 200 quid even today from London as you have to pay their return journey as well.
There was enough in Nevilles' wallet to choke a goat,so no problem there if the lad was that desperate.
Always supposing that he took money from the wallet----that is. ??
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Good job he had another jumper in the car as well. Very suspicious that? ;D
Source please.
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It wasn't a police problem. They're law enforcers not taxi services. She would have had to order a taxi or ask a friend.
She could not afford a taxi. A friend at 3am, driving her from Lewisham to Essex ? No chance.
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Source please.
Some things don't require one, Adam. There's nothing suspicious about having a sweater in his car. It's feasible that he may have needed an extra one when he left home early in the morning and discarded it at some point during the day.
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She could not afford a taxi. A friend at 3am, driving her from Lewisham to Essex ? No chance.
TOTALLY irrelevant and not within the remit of this board.
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She could not afford a taxi. A friend at 3am, driving her from Lewisham to Essex ? No chance.
Erm,selective reading now is it ? I asked about him using the cash he took from his dads' wallet while he was" murdering the family".Enough for a fare that distance,eh ? Taxi to be sent to pick up Julie------------------------except that she was too smashed to even hear what was being said on the phone !
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Some things don't require one, Adam. There's nothing suspicious about having a sweater in his car. It's feasible that he may have needed an extra one when he left home early in the morning and discarded it at some point during the day.
Grahame is saying 'he did'.
Not that it's feasible.
So I requested a source.
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Grahame is saying 'he did'.
Not that it's feasible.
So I requested a source.
I would suggest it may have been a tongue in cheek comment.
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Grahame is saying 'he did'.
Not that it's feasible.
So I requested a source.
What am I saying he did to?
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What am I saying he did to?
I thinks he's on about the jumper in the car.
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I thinks he's on about the jumper in the car.
Oh right. Lol ;D just joking about that ::)
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Oh right. Lol ;D just joking about that ::)
Have a feeling, just a hunch, mind, that Adam doesn't do humour...................unless it's his own ;)
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What am I saying he did to?
You said he had a spare jumper in his car.
I asked for a source.
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Have a feeling, just a hunch, mind, that Adam doesn't do humour...................unless it's his own ;)
Almost American you could say. ;D
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You said he had a spare jumper in his car.
I asked for a source.
DUHHHHH ??? ??? ???
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You said he had a spare jumper in his car.
I asked for a source.
LOL ;D
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Almost American you could say. ;D
You could be right there,Mr G. :-\
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You could be right there,Mr G. :-\
in other words pie in face humour. :)
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in other words pie in face humour. :)
OBVIOUS.......ly :D :D :D
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Where's the proof that he stopped to put a jumper on anyway?
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Where's the proof that he stopped to put a jumper on anyway?
He didn't stop Reader.
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He didn't stop Reader.
Bewes said he arrived about 2 minutes after they did. Hardly any time at all. I'm really baffled as to why it is used by some to say he was "delaying" the police?
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Bewes said he arrived about 2 minutes after they did. Hardly any time at all. I'm really baffled as to why it is used by some to say he was "delaying" the police?
Just another straw to grasp. ::)
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Where's the proof that he stopped to put a jumper on anyway?
No on is saying he did.
Grahame said he had a spare jumper in his car. It later came to light that this was a joke post after I requested a source.
He did have a shirt, two jumpers and a jacket on. And one 10p coin.
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Bewes said he arrived about 2 minutes after they did. Hardly any time at all. I'm really baffled as to why it is used by some to say he was "delaying" the police?
Bews's WS says Jeremy arrived 3/4 minutes later. A lot of minutes.
It is only a 7 minute car journey at at average speed (see Mike's video). There was no traffic and the police passed him on the way.
Jeremy must have been driving as fast as an old tug boat. But as other people have said, he was scared.
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Bews's WS says Jeremy arrived 3/4 minutes later. A lot of minutes.
It is only a 7 minute car journey at at average speed (see Mike's video). There was no traffic and the police passed him on the way.
Jeremy must have been driving as fast as an old tug boat. But as other people have said, he was scared.
Wouldn't you have been scared at not knowing what you were going in to.?
I always thought that " murderers " weren't scaredy cats ??
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No on is saying he did.
Grahame said he had a spare jumper in his car. It later came to light that this was a joke post after I requested a source.
He did have a shirt, two jumpers and a jacket on. And one 10p coin.
Rge joke was about the copper stopping to put a jumper on.
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He didn't stop Reader.
I expect you're right.
It's a bit odd that some statements suggested that CA7 waited 3 to 4 minutes for him to arrive. There's wasn't much reason for exaggerating this time and yet estimating Jeremy's speed as 30mph when he was overtaken. Had CA7 averaged 50 mph for the final mile, whilst Jeremy averaged 25 mph, CA7 would have been waiting where they stopped for just 72 seconds before Jeremy got there (because CA7 would have taken 72 seconds, whereas Jeremy would have taken 144 seconds). None of the statements of the officers in CA7 suggest Jeremy was asked anything at the time in relation to how long it had taken for him to catch them up.
Ps Bews seemed to have realized that the estimates didn't make sense, as his statement of 19/09/85 corrected his earlier statement by saying the 3 to 4 minute wait was timed from when Jeremy was overtaken rather than from when CA7 parked. However, Pc Saxby and Pc Myall didn't make this correction, and the correction is bizarre anyway as there was no reason to estimate the duration of that interval and the duration still seems exaggerated.
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Wouldn't you have been scared at not knowing what you were going in to.?
I always thought that " murderers " weren't scaredy cats ??
Oh he was scared alright, bloody terrified actually. Wouldn't you be knowing what you had just done and what the possible consequences might be? No wonder he went off and puked after the adrenalin had worn off.
It takes a certain type of guy to shoot two sleeping children in the head and face.
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Bews's WS says Jeremy arrived 3/4 minutes later. A lot of minutes.
It is only a 7 minute car journey at at average speed (see Mike's video). There was no traffic and the police passed him on the way.
Jeremy must have been driving as fast as an old tug boat. But as other people have said, he was scared.
This is what Bewes actually meant which I estimate that they waited around a couple of minutes? But 3-4 minutes is still not very long and could never be counted as a "delaying tactic" by Bamber. To say so is in my opinion just silly.
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Oh he was scared alright, bloody terrified actually. Wouldn't you be knowing what you had just done and what the possible consequences might be? No wonder he went off and puked after the adrenalin had worn off.
Erm,the truth NEVER scares me,the same as it doesn't scare Jeremy.
Sudden shock makes you sick,it's a well known fact with a lot of people. Shock at hearing bad news--------or doesn't it affect you ??
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Oh he was scared alright, bloody terrified actually. Wouldn't you be knowing what you had just done and what the possible consequences might be? No wonder he went off and puked after the adrenalin had worn off.
It takes a certain type of guy to shoot two sleeping children in the head and face.
Sick is how you'll look when Jeremy is released ! ;D ;D ;D ;D
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Erm,the truth NEVER scares me,the same as it doesn't scare Jeremy.
Sudden shock makes you sick,it's a well known fact with a lot of people. Shock at hearing bad news--------or doesn't it affect you ??
If he had just killed 5 people even at that time he would have been as high as a kite because of the adrenalin in his body.
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If he had just killed 5 people even at that time he would have been as high as a kite because of the adrenalin in his body.
He would for sure. His body language would have been a dead give-away.
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He would for sure. His body language would have been a dead give-away.
He would have an unconrollable shake throughout his whole body.
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He would have an unconrollable shake throughout his whole body.
You're telling me.
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But as other people have said, he was scared.
What other people? In regard to his arrival at WHF, Ps Bews and Pc Myall used identical wording to state that he did not appear dishevelled in any way and did not appear to be emotionally excited.
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Oh he was scared alright, bloody terrified actually. Wouldn't you be knowing what you had just done and what the possible consequences might be? No wonder he went off and puked after the adrenalin had worn off.
It takes a certain type of guy to shoot two sleeping children in the head and face.
DB once shot someone in the face in a shooting incident while on a shoot. Actually in the eye.
Strange how that never came out. No wonder Neville turned his back at shoots,eh ?
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What other people? In regard to his arrival at WHF, Ps Bews and Pc Myall used identical wording to state that he did not appear dishevelled in any way and did not appear to be emotionally excited.
I can not comprehend how he could have thought it was a good plan to stand next to the police outside the house when he would have had no idea how he would have reacted to killing 5 people. The phone call was obviously not an alibi as it could not be proved. He had no idea how much blood or GRS would have been on him or how much he would have had to clean up.
Unless the police were totally stupid then it would have been obvious he was a man who had just killed 5 people , rushed to get rid of all the evidence and cleaned himself up. Let alone the fact that he would have been totally panicking about the fact he had to shoot Sheila twice.
His reactions were totally in line with someone who thought he was possibly going to a scenario that was going to be tricky to sort out - but as the night unfolded and he was begging the police to go in and save his family the realisation of the situation began to sink in.
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What other people? In regard to his arrival at WHF, Ps Bews and Pc Myall used identical wording to state that he did not appear dishevelled in any way and did not appear to be emotionally excited.
Hi Reader. When witnesses use identical wording in my limited experience it usually indicates collusion.
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I can not comprehend how he could have thought it was a good plan to stand next to the police outside the house when he would have had no idea how he would have reacted to killing 5 people. The phone call was obviously not an alibi as it could not be proved. He had no idea how much blood or GRS would have been on him or how much he would have had to clean up.
Unless the police were totally stupid then it would have been obvious he was a man who had just killed 5 people , rushed to get rid of all the evidence and cleaned himself up. Let alone the fact that he would have been totally panicking about the fact he had to shoot Sheila twice.
His reactions were totally in line with someone who thought he was possibly going to a scenario that was going to be tricky to sort out - but as the night unfolded and he was begging the police to go in and save his family the realisation of the situation began to sink in.
Have you got a source that he was 'begging' the police to go in.
Thought he was sat in a police car talking about 2 grand kit cars. Or using his 10p to tell Julie ' a police car is coming to pick you up'.
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I can not comprehend how he could have thought it was a good plan to stand next to the police outside the house when he would have had no idea how he would have reacted to killing 5 people. The phone call was obviously not an alibi as it could not be proved. He had no idea how much blood or GRS would have been on him or how much he would have had to clean up.
Unless the police were totally stupid then it would have been obvious he was a man who had just killed 5 people , rushed to get rid of all the evidence and cleaned himself up. Let alone the fact that he would have been totally panicking about the fact he had to shoot Sheila twice.
His reactions were totally in line with someone who thought he was possibly going to a scenario that was going to be tricky to sort out - but as the night unfolded and he was begging the police to go in and save his family the realisation of the situation began to sink in.
Far form begging police to go in he lied to them and made them scared to enter.
Everything he did was out of character looking back at it. Eveyrhting he did was contrived or made up from the claim he took a gun out to shoot rabbits and left it out to the bullets he claimed he left with the gun that he obviously staged.
He clearly thought he was good enough to get away with it and fooled police initially but the processing of the evidence revealed he lied and was repsonsible. Unfortunately for him it is not just up to police on the scene to decide what happened.
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Far form begging police to go in he lied to them and made them scared to enter.
Everything he did was out of character looking back at it. Eveyrhting he did was contrived or made up from the claim he took a gun out to shoot rabbits and left it out to the bullets he claimed he left with the gun that he obviously staged.
He clearly thought he was good enough to get away with it and fooled police initially but the processing of the evidence revealed he lied and was repsonsible. Unfortunately for him it is not just up to police on the scene to decide what happened.
All pure assumption I'm afraid. That is just the interpretation you choose to put on his actions.
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Far form begging police to go in he lied to them and made them scared to enter.
Everything he did was out of character looking back at it. Eveyrhting he did was contrived or made up from the claim he took a gun out to shoot rabbits and left it out to the bullets he claimed he left with the gun that he obviously staged.
He clearly thought he was good enough to get away with it and fooled police initially but the processing of the evidence revealed he lied and was repsonsible. Unfortunately for him it is not just up to police on the scene to decide what happened.
The people who acted out of character were Jeremys' relatives.
Fine upstanding pillars of the community ?? Yeah-----------until you take a look at THEIR backgrounds !!
So how about leaving Jeremy alone for once--------he's still where YOU want him to be,so what more do you want ?
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Far form begging police to go in he lied to them and made them scared to enter.
Everything he did was out of character looking back at it. Eveyrhting he did was contrived or made up from the claim he took a gun out to shoot rabbits and left it out to the bullets he claimed he left with the gun that he obviously staged.
He clearly thought he was good enough to get away with it and fooled police initially but the processing of the evidence revealed he lied and was repsonsible. Unfortunately for him it is not just up to police on the scene to decide what happened.
Initially he never even told them a shot had been fired - they were a group of very experienced officers who had armed support - against what was apparently a slip of a girl who had never fired a gun in anger against another human being. There was apparently according to you - no movement - no sound whatsoever and no warning shots no threats .They did not even know ANY shots had been fired. I think you are severely overestimating the affect Jeremy could have on EP. Don't forget that he also denied some of the comments that in Sept a month after the crime were attributed to him. If you look at the notebooks a lot of the comments that he apparently made are not there.
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Initially he never even told them a shot had been fired - they were a group of very experienced officers who had armed support - against what was apparently a slip of a girl who had never fired a gun in anger against another human being. There was apparently according to you - no movement - no sound whatsoever and no warning shots no threats .They did not even know ANY shots had been fired. I think you are severely overestimating the affect Jeremy could have on EP. Don't forget that he also denied some of the comments that in Sept a month after the crime were attributed to him. If you look at the notebooks a lot of the comments that he apparently made are not there.
Jeremy told the police Sheila knew how to handle guns.
And that Neville had said she had gone 'crazy'.
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Jeremy told the police Sheila knew how to handle guns.
And that Neville had said she had gone 'crazy'.
I re-iterate he never said a shot had been fired and if you read the statement that Mike posted the original officers did not seen too concerned they were just trying to make contact with Sheila.
Going crazy with the gun could have just meant running about and waving it about.
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I re-iterate he never said a shot had been fired and if you read the statement that Mike posted the original officers did not seen too concerned they were just trying to make contact with Sheila.
Going crazy with the gun could have just meant running about and waving it about.
The statement that one of the relatives made saying that they had never seen Sheila with a gun as DB admitted that she had been to Scotland with a shooting party. I bet you that there are pictures of her holding a gun somewhere in the family photo album? ;)
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I think Jeremy did say in his later statements that he believed Sheila had also been out shooting with his father , but I guess there was no-one to verify that unless she had been seen by farmworkers.
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Initially he never even told them a shot had been fired - they were a group of very experienced officers who had armed support - against what was apparently a slip of a girl who had never fired a gun in anger against another human being. There was apparently according to you - no movement - no sound whatsoever and no warning shots no threats .They did not even know ANY shots had been fired. I think you are severely overestimating the affect Jeremy could have on EP. Don't forget that he also denied some of the comments that in Sept a month after the crime were attributed to him. If you look at the notebooks a lot of the comments that he apparently made are not there.
1) they were unarmed. The lies he told about her having an arsenal at her disposal and knowing how to use all such weapons resulted in them calling for armed support. He also told them she was nuts not bothering to say she was currently being successfully medicated. His statements mad ethem scared to do anything themselves and instead to called for armed support who treated it as a hostage situation because of his lies.
2) the simple fact he lied about such shows he was trying to deceive the officers. Why did he lie? he lied because he wanted them to believe she was capable of using the guns so they would beleive she did it when the bodies were found. It doesn't amtter whether it fooled police or not the fact he lied to frame her is what is so significant.
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Lying and trying to deceive are much the same thing. If he's innocent and wasn't trying to deceive, what is your proof that he lied? How does omitting some details about Sheila prove that they were omitted with the deliberate intention of deceiving the police?
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1) they were unarmed. The lies he told about her having an arsenal at her disposal and knowing how to use all such weapons resulted in them calling for armed support. He also told them she was nuts not bothering to say she was currently being successfully medicated. His statements mad ethem scared to do anything themselves and instead to called for armed support who treated it as a hostage situation because of his lies.
2) the simple fact he lied about such shows he was trying to deceive the officers. Why did he lie? he lied because he wanted them to believe she was capable of using the guns so they would beleive she did it when the bodies were found. It doesn't amtter whether it fooled police or not the fact he lied to frame her is what is so significant.
I believe that according to the telephone log they already knew that. They called the armed unit as soon as Bewes saw the "trick of light" in the window, not before.
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How is that "according to the telephone log"?
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How is that "according to the telephone log"?
Because the telephone log said there were various weapons in the house.
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The police already knew there were weapons in the house, but you had also highlighted the suggestion that Jeremy told the police that Sheila knew how to use them all. That part wasn't in the telephone log.
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The police already knew there were weapons in the house, but you had also highlighted the suggestion that Jeremy told the police that Sheila knew how to use them all. That part wasn't in the telephone log.
I may have highlighted the whole passage of scipio's, but what I meant was that she did in fact have an arsenal of weapons at her disposal. The police would have naturally draw the conclusion that she knew how to use them, or at least she potentially knew how to use them.
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I may have highlighted the whole passage of scipio's, but what I meant was that she did in fact have an arsenal of weapons at her disposal. The police would have naturally draw the conclusion that she knew how to use them, or at least she potentially knew how to use them.
They had no way to know whether she could or couldn't which is why they asked Jeremy. If they had no one to ask they woudl have to have assumed it was possible. But they would not have even known about the weapons in the firs tplace without having someone to ask...
He told them she knew how to used them all and that he taught her how. That lies served a purpose at that moment. After the family's input repeating the lies would create conflict so he changed his story figuring what he told the other officers would either not come out at all or not have anyone take note of the conflict.
Indeed police did not take note of the conflict or question him about such until September so he was right in a way. But only right to an extent since they eventually got around to it but only because of evidence that made them end up taking note. It should have made them suspicious early on but didn't.
To be fair the only way to know about the change was after getting the accounts of the initial police and comparing them to his statement. But they should have been able to do that a week after the murders.
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The way of the shooting would denote that the shooter wasn't that familiar with guns ! Not exactly the steady hand you'd expect from a crack-shot.