Vidvic, With the greatest respect concerning the firing of a .22 rifle inside a house in the dead of night the attaching of a silencer with the ammo used would make very almost no difference at all. Silencers are usually used for distance shooting with supersonic ammunition.
.22 make little more noise than a cap gun. I have fired .22 on a number of occasions. To be fair it was on an indoor range.
Cliff, doesn't it seem reasonable to you that it was irrelevant whether a silencer was used because if it wasn't then it would have woken them up? Because it was quite obvious that it did wake them, so why argue that a silencer was used? It seems that those who keep on about a silencer are just arguing to make it seem as if the silencer was the crucial piece of evidence that convicted Jeremy. When in fact it would have made no difference if it was used or not?
I agree Grahame.
You really think he could have murdered those two little boys without a silencer??
The fact that they were discovered in a sleeping position without ever seemingly being disturbed says otherwise.
The evidence shows that June was shot first whilst in a sleeping position so is feasible to say that a silencer must have been fitted as it's generally accepted that the boys were the first victims and without question the elder Bambers would have heard this and have been out of bed by the time he got to their room.
Yes I do Lucy. It is quite feasible. It had to be that way, because (1) She loved them and didn't want them to wake up. Perhaps the little boy with the thumb in his mouth was shot first. But had to be killed first if it was Sheila so that they would not suffer. June and Ralph both woke up and the shots to them were all over the place. Hardly an accurate shot in them. Only when they stopped moving were they finished off with bullets to the head.
Sorry Grahame but I find your post quite offensive.
Have worked in mental health for many years and have read all of the evidence regarding Sheila's illness and medication and do not believe for a second that she did this......you have a bystanders view of paranoid schizophrenia that in no way resembles the reality.
June was actually shot in a sleeping position which suggests that she was initially asleep.....I think that this points to a silencer being used.
The fact that there was hardly an accurate shot points to them actually being moving targets after they were awakened.
No Lucy I have personal experience of schizophrenia. And the fact that they actually were awakened points to the fact that a silencer was not used. Also you have absolutely no right to say that my post was offensive. Just because you think you know all about schizophrenia and assume that I don't. Believe you me I have seen it and experienced it first hand young lady and know exactly what paranoid schizophrenics are capable of. So you have no reason on earth to say my post is offensive. Let me tell you one thing Lucy70. You ain't lived mate. You need to experience their violence first hand and then you can come back and tell me what you think I don't know. Sitting on the edge as an observer thinking you know it all. Goods grief woman use your brains for once. If you are anything like those so called psychiatrists treating my ******* then you know sod all. Most of the psychiatrists I've dealt with in the time I and my wife were suffering with my own ****** were crackpots themselves and knew diddly squat. You and your "many years" experience. 
bystanders view indeed? Perhaps you ought to start living with a paranoid schizophrenic instead of "working in" mental health. Know all about the case indeed. lolololol You have just proved you know nothing about it at all.
I have experienced their violence first hand Grahame and know exactly how scary and destructive this can be and what some people are capable of but this has always been from people on secure units. With the right medication the vast majority of schizophrenics are entirely manageable either in the community or on a general ward and in no way pose any threat to anyone. To say that that I know nothing and have no experience is unfair and innaccurate. Apart from having a schizophrenic parent for the past 40 years and 10 years working experience I currently work in the community with an active caseload of around 50, the majority of whom are schizophrenics.
Is that enough experience for you?
Yes Lucy it is. But you had no right to say that you find my post offensive. And assume that I see things from a bystanders point of view. Even on your own admission you say they can be violent. Plus, the right medication as you put it is a hit and miss situation as many psychologists will admit. It sometimes takes years to get the right medication. That is if they get the diagnosis right in the first place? We found it very difficult to make the different psychologists listen to us and still they don't. In fact at the interviews they rather listened to the patient than to us. They completely discounted what we had to say. We knew the patient was lying, but they listened to her and the said all she needed was "anger management classes". 
Where "right" medication is concerned most of it is them experimenting with different drugs on our relatives and then watching the reaction. I have confidence in very very few psychologists. Where schizophrenics are concerned it is not right to say that they can't think straight and plan mischief. The facts are that they can be very deceptive and calculating as well as having violent episodes. The person I'm talking about kicked in front door in (she is 7 stone in weight) but she kicked the front door in. Made several holes in walls with her fists (not a mark on her fists by the way) And stabbed her boyfriend, missing his brain by inches....she stabbed him in his butt. 
So I don't really accept your statement that the violent ones are institutionalised. The fact is it is the national health's policy to institutionalise as many mentally ill people as possible. The money being the chief reason for this. And so you have more potentially violent schizophrenics outside institutions than there are inside. All because in the psychiatrists view they can be handled with drugs. And do you know what Lucy? If you work with these people I think you know that what I say is true?
Well said, Grahame. I'm so sorry to hear about your relation's mental health problems. A member of my family has had mental health problems too resulting from the use of cannabis and I would think there are many, many families with similar experiences to yours.
Although my relation's problems were not as serious as those that your relation and your family have suffered, these were serious enough, so I can understand and relate to your experience. In my family's experience, mental health issues, even when the sufferer is on medication, mean long term misery for the sufferer and their family. So my heart goes out to you and your relation.
My relation had a breakdown after using cannabis, which a friend at school gave her. She was admitted to a psychiatric unit when she was just 16. Following a few months of treatment, my relation, who was still very ill, told her family and those treating her that she wished to leave the unit in order to live with a 58 year old fellow patient who had been a drug addict for many years and who had been grooming her in the unit.
Though her family saw this as a symptom of my relation's illness and the influence of this much older man as abusive, her psychologist stated that this meant she was recovering, her family's concerns were brushed aside and both patients were released at the same time to begin living together - though thankfully not for long. So I share your deep concern about the poor judgement of some mental health professionals.
