Reason to believe cops shot Sheila, and how her blood ended up inside Silencer!

[susan]

I don't agree with the OS that Bamber was framed because the police shot Sheila.

A month after the massacre no one was accusing the police of shooting Sheila. Espescially Bamber.

As said, the police had simply processed the forensic & circumstantial evidence. And Julie had come forward.

Adam please remind me what is the forensic evidence you refer to I have forgot

[Adam]

Adam my scenario is the best and it could change your stance on this case and you will be posting as JB innocent.  Be patient a wee bit longer it is nearly finished. I am busy just now researching happenings from 1745 this will be ongoing so will set it aside and get back to my Sheila scenario.

I am pleased you're scenario will be the best. There is already several plausible Bamber scenarios which match the crime scene. But no luck with Sheila.

Some supporters or former supporters refuse to submit one. Others post very brief ones such as 'by shooting them' or 'she shot them but I can't explain the phone calls'.

More detailed ones have had to be dismissed & David is now on his 5th attempt which has so far taken 5 months.

[Adam]

Adam please remind me what is the forensic evidence you refer to I have forgot

It is in the 'Forensic Evidence Library'.

[Roch]

A small group of officers were sympathetic to the relatives and not bothered about what went on at the farmhouse at that point? They didn't close ranks to stop top brass finding out about this 'thing'? Some even jumped ship but it still managed to hit top brass? So is this conspiracy with just a few officers or at the heart of EP as a whole - it's rather confusing. Also, if they wanted the evidence to fail, why include a blood filled silencer which if discovered would mean far more than something that happened at the farmhouse.  None of this rings true for me.

You might have misunderstood my post.  The top brass as far up as Simpson already know what happened in the farmhouse - i.e. Harris / Simpson.  So there would be no need for more junior officers to close ranks to prevent top brass from finding out. 

I dont know what you mean about officers jumping ship and hitting top brass?

I think people concentrate too much on who is at the 'heart' of any conspiracy. 

There are probably officers who knew exactly what happened in the farmhouse - who expressed concerns upon being shown videos of crime scene photos - but who were not prepared to take it any further than that.  It was not these officers' decison to prosecute JB. 

There are some investigative officers who knew what happened and it's been alleged other officers were not privy to the same level of knowledge at the outset.  Some officers arrived later than others.  Some officers were only required in a certain aspect of the case and will have concentrated on their duties.   Some officers will have viewed the crime scene close up while others enerting the farmhouse may have glanced without entering in to any detailed study.

Traditionally - EP have managed the case in a defensive manner i.e. Jeremy Bamber was convicted in a court of law - Jeremy Bamber has had access to the appeals process - Enquiries have not uncovered anything to suggest the conviction is wrong etc etc etc.  In that sense the conspiracy is wider. 

[guest7363]

You might have misunderstood my post.  The top brass as far up as Simpson already know what happened in the farmhouse - i.e. Harris / Simpson.  So there would be no need for more junior officers to close ranks to prevent top brass from finding out. 

I dont know what you mean about officers jumping ship and hitting top brass?

I think people concentrate too much on who is at the 'heart' of any conspiracy. 

There are probably officers who knew exactly what happened in the farmhouse - who expressed concerns upon being shown videos of crime scene photos - but who were not prepared to take it any further than that.  It was not these officers' decison to prosecute JB. 

There are some investigative officers who knew what happened and it's been alleged other officers were not privy to the same level of knowledge at the outset.  Some officers arrived later than others.  Some officers were only required in a certain aspect of the case and will have concentrated on their duties.   Some officers will have viewed the crime scene close up while others enerting the farmhouse may have glanced without entering in to any detailed study.

Traditionally - EP have managed the case in a defensive manner i.e. Jeremy Bamber was convicted in a court of law - Jeremy Bamber has had access to the appeals process - Enquiries have not uncovered anything to suggest the conviction is wrong etc etc etc.  In that sense the conspiracy is wider.

News travels very fast, we are led to believe that someone from the police shot Sheila while other police officers were in attendance, so from day one when it would not have mattered if the police shot the killer, easy to get out of or cover up, SHE CAME AT US WITH a gun, police shoot dead women who murdered her family, hero police shoot dead women who massacred her family EASY PEASY. 
Without any input from the family or anyone else they decided to change it to a suicide, it's easy, let's stage it so it looks like Sheila shot herself twice shall we.  So they went from police covering up shooting Sheila to Sheila shooting herself twice and  When they couldn't get away with this they had another idea, lets frame Bamber and everyone associated with the police went along with it or couldn't be bothered?

[Roch]

News travels very fast, we are led to believe that someone from the police shot Sheila while other police officers were in attendance, so from day one when it would not have mattered if the police shot the killer, easy to get out of or cover up, SHE CAME AT US WITH a gun, police shoot dead women who murdered her family, hero police shoot dead women who massacred her family EASY PEASY. 
Without any input from the family or anyone else they decided to change it to a suicide, it's easy, let's stage it so it looks like Sheila shot herself twice shall we.  So they went from police covering up shooting Sheila to Sheila shooting herself twice and  When they couldn't get away with this they had another idea, lets frame Bamber and everyone associated with the police went along with it or couldn't be bothered?

What has been suggested though Justice - is that an officer accidentally shot her with the anshutz (or another rifle).  Not a police weapon.  Not really easy to explain.   Or perhaps it might have been possible to explain, if police had decided to do so from the outset.

 

[Adam]

Adam my scenario is the best and it could change your stance on this case and you will be posting as JB innocent.  Be patient a wee bit longer it is nearly finished. I am busy just now researching happenings from 1745 this will be ongoing so will set it aside and get back to my Sheila scenario.

Hopefully Susan will provide her scenario shortly. It was due on Saturday but didn't arrive,  without an explanation. Which was disappointing. No future date has been given which again is disappointing.

Not sure why the time 17.45am is being investigated. Sheila committed the massacre between 3.10am/3.36am - 3.48am

[Adam]

Susan's scenario could be the last chance after Buddy's & Lucy's scenario's this month were dismissed. It will indeed need to be 'the best'
 
There is no way Nugs or Lookout will ever provide one. I've no confidence David's 5th attempt he's been working on for 5 months will be sufficient as the other four were so appalling. Mike's not going to elaborate from 'by shooting them' & Roch's not going to elaborate from 'Sheila shot them but I can't explain the phone calls'.

[Caroline]

You might have misunderstood my post.  The top brass as far up as Simpson already know what happened in the farmhouse - i.e. Harris / Simpson.  So there would be no need for more junior officers to close ranks to prevent top brass from finding out. 

I dont know what you mean about officers jumping ship and hitting top brass?

I think people concentrate too much on who is at the 'heart' of any conspiracy. 

There are probably officers who knew exactly what happened in the farmhouse - who expressed concerns upon being shown videos of crime scene photos - but who were not prepared to take it any further than that.  It was not these officers' decison to prosecute JB. 

There are some investigative officers who knew what happened and it's been alleged other officers were not privy to the same level of knowledge at the outset.  Some officers arrived later than others.  Some officers were only required in a certain aspect of the case and will have concentrated on their duties.   Some officers will have viewed the crime scene close up while others enerting the farmhouse may have glanced without entering in to any detailed study.

Traditionally - EP have managed the case in a defensive manner i.e. Jeremy Bamber was convicted in a court of law - Jeremy Bamber has had access to the appeals process - Enquiries have not uncovered anything to suggest the conviction is wrong etc etc etc.  In that sense the conspiracy is wider.

The comment about jumping ship came from you, not sure what you meant by it?

I don't think it mattered what weapon was used to shoot Sheila, if there was a struggle then it's quite easy to see how she might have been shot. I don't think this would warrant any kind of cover up I don't but this as a theory at all.

[David1819]

What has been suggested though Justice - is that an officer accidentally shot her with the anshutz (or another rifle).  Not a police weapon.  Not really easy to explain.   Or perhaps it might have been possible to explain, if police had decided to do so from the outset.

The bloodstains on her nightie show that both wounds were inflicted while Sheila was sitting upwards.

Another big problem for this theory is the trajectories as Sheila would be lying flat.

The whole theory originates from Dr Craig being incompetent and not doing his job properly.

[Roch]

The comment about jumping ship came from you, not sure what you meant by it?

I don't think it mattered what weapon was used to shoot Sheila, if there was a struggle then it's quite easy to see how she might have been shot. I don't think this would warrant any kind of cover up I don't but this as a theory at all.

Yeah, I meant simply that officers went along with the change in direction, on account of it being the wishes of their second in command (of the force).

I think we will have to wait and see if anything else is put forward to advance the theory that the police were responsible in some way for either shot, whether as part of a struggle or by accident.  Officially JB has always sought to argue that Sheila shot her self twice.  MT claimed that Jeremy took this line because it was deemed to be the 'path of least resistance' regarding EP / authorities.

[Caroline]

Yeah, I meant simply that officers went along with the change in direction, on account of it being the wishes of their second in command (of the force).

I think we will have to wait and see if anything else is put forward to advance the theory that the police were responsible in some way for either shot, whether as part of a struggle or by accident.  Officially JB has always sought to argue that Sheila shot her self twice.  MT claimed that Jeremy took this line because it was deemed to be the 'path of least resistance' regarding EP / authorities.

Well, Jeremy said that he doesn't hole with MT's theories because he 'speculates' too much. If there were any truth in the police shooting Sheila, Jeremy would be more clued up than most.

[Roch]

The bloodstains on her nightie show that both wounds were inflicted while Sheila was sitting upwards.

Another big problem for this theory is the trajectories as Sheila would be lying flat.

The whole theory originates from Dr Craig being incompetent and not doing his job properly.

Can you demonstrate 100% that both shots can only have been received while she was sitting upwards?  No pressure like 

[David1819]

Can you demonstrate 100% that both shots can only have been received while she was sitting upwards?  No pressure like 

COA section 45.
Dr Vanezis gave evidence that the nature of the blood stains to the nightdress suggested that Sheila Caffell was sitting up when she received both injuries. After the second injury she would have immediately fallen back.

We only have photos of the nightdress in the crime scene photos. Its rather scrunched up but if you look closely can see two distinct streams of blood running parallel to the wounds.

Then we have the blood stain on Sheila's neck.
http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,7805.msg369805.html#msg369805

[Roch]

COA section 45.
Dr Vanezis gave evidence that the nature of the blood stains to the nightdress suggested that Sheila Caffell was sitting up when she received both injuries. After the second injury she would have immediately fallen back.

We only have photos of the nightdress in the crime scene photos. Its rather scrunched up but if you look closely can see two distinct streams of blood running parallel to the wounds.

Then we have the blood stain on Sheila's neck.
http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,7805.msg369805.html#msg369805

It's a pity we cant sit the figure on the left up - so as to see what it looks like regarding angles / trajectories.