Jeremy's assumptions about his sister's meds and relatives' opinions

[Adam]

Adam I thought not but do enjoy learning hehehe

I will be able to impress people with my knowledge over dinner.

[susan]

Don't kid yourself,Susan,he probably wears them.

Hahaha lookout nice one never thought of that wee willy winky what a thought

[susan]

I will be able to impress people with my knowledge over dinner.

Adam hope your dinner table is full

[gringo]

For 'the stooge'.  I cant 100% avoid your posts - as I can see them when I'm not logged in.  There is no quick-fix I'm afraid.  Though I can think of one particular quick-fix that I have already suggested.  BTW - which rock are you going to crawl under when the truth comes out?  I cant imagine we'll see much of you on here - as you will no longer have a purpose or role.

   Thanks for the links, Roch. Seems that "the stooge" hasn't seen them or chosen not to comment, probably because they support entirely what you have said.
     That it was members of the TFG, who as a group were unhappy with the position of Sheila's body, gun and bible in the video of photographs they viewed compared to the positions they recalled from the raid, is fairly indicative.
     Where it may be plausible that PC plod as an individual may be mistaken in recollecting the position of a gun, it is less believable that a Tactical Firearms Group would all collectively get this wrong and coincidentally get the same details wrong and in the same way.
     It does tend to lead in the direction that the Sheila's body and the gun have been re-staged by persons after the TFG have left. A concern seemingly shared by members of the TFG.
     What is also noticeable from the links provided is the unanimity amongst the TFG that they were dealing with a murder/suicide. 
       
     

[Adam]

For 'the stooge'.  I cant 100% avoid your posts - as I can see them when I'm not logged in.  There is no quick-fix I'm afraid.  Though I can think of one particular quick-fix that I have already suggested.  BTW - which rock are you going to crawl under when the truth comes out?  I cant imagine we'll see much of you on here - as you will no longer have a purpose or role.

Thanks. Don't know why you called me a stooge. I only asked for a source after you said one policeman said he saw Sheila without the rifle.

Either put me on ignore, or don't. Make up you're mind. It makes no difference to me as I will respond to you're posts as usual. Saying you're doing it & then responding to my posts is what Jan used to do. Pretending you have to read my posts when not logged in doesn't wash as you can stay logged in all the time. As I do. Or 'ignore' them when not logged in.

I couldn't read most of those sources & certainly saw nothing that said a policeman saw Sheila without the rifle. Not that it matters as the rifle was taken off Sheila after the photos were taken.

[Roch]

   Thanks for the links, Roch. Seems that "the stooge" hasn't seen them or chosen not to comment, probably because they support entirely what you have said.
     That it was members of the TFG, who as a group were unhappy with the position of Sheila's body, gun and bible in the video of photographs they viewed compared to the positions they recalled from the raid, is fairly indicative.
     Where it may be plausible that PC plod as an individual may be mistaken in recollecting the position of a gun, it is less believable that a Tactical Firearms Group would all collectively get this wrong and coincidentally get the same details wrong and in the same way.
     It does tend to lead in the direction that the Sheila's body and the gun have been re-staged by persons after the TFG have left. A concern seemingly shared by members of the TFG.
     What is also noticeable from the links provided is the unanimity amongst the TFG that they were dealing with a murder/suicide. 
       
   

It seems totally logical to assert that the TFG operation and/or its immediate aftermath experienced pretty serious complications. 

It is obvious that, after TFG had initially viewed the scene, police have either introduced a weapon to the scene or re-positioned a weapon that was originally at the side of Sheila's corpse, so that it has instead ended-up atop her corpse.   When you consider Jeremy Bamber has been in prison for over 30 years for leaving said rifle atop Sheila - it's pretty shocking.  Obviously when police introduced / moved the rifle, they could never have foresaw that it would result in the victim's brother being sent to prison.

The bible has also ended up mostly covering a very distinctive bloodstain - one suggestion being a pool of blood from Sheila having been placed in the recovery position.   I think the Dickinson report suggests that the bible may have been accidentally re-positioned by a TFG member opening one of the doors - however it seems a convenient coincidence, that the door just happened to push the bible over the distinctive bloodstain!  Not forgetting the bloodied palm print - Which, for some inextricable reason police have not wanted to include in the case against Jeremy. 
 
I'm not sure what they're getting at re position of head / table but there is a picture in the archive which demonstrates the trajectory of shots is not in line with the positioning of Sheila's head / neck wounds.

[lookout]

What EP should have done after Jeremy had " blamed " his sister and the relatives had " blamed " Jeremy,would/should have been to have investigated and documented Sheila's social history,medical history and mental history.They failed to do this.
Predeterminal circumstances are vital in determining the causes and manner of the death/s,as well as documentation of medical intervention.
The investigator should always document known circumstances and medical intervention preceding death.
The mental history should have consisted of behavioural issues,hospitalisation and medications. Any documented history of suicide attempts,ideations and or gestures.
Documented health professionals,psychiatrists,psychologists,counsellors and those who treated the decedent.  Obtain relevant records.
This information then assists the investigator to evaluate the state of mind of the decedent and contributes to the cause,manner and circumstances of death.

The easiest thing in the world is to point a finger at the last man standing,though how EP could possibly have done so without a scrap of evidence to have proved he was the murderer I fail to understand.

[Steve_uk]

It seems totally logical to assert that the TFG operation and/or its immediate aftermath experienced pretty serious complications. 

It is obvious that, after TFG had initially viewed the scene, police have either introduced a weapon to the scene or re-positioned a weapon that was originally at the side of Sheila's corpse, so that it has instead ended-up atop her corpse.   When you consider Jeremy Bamber has been in prison for over 30 years for leaving said rifle atop Sheila - it's pretty shocking.  Obviously when police introduced / moved the rifle, they could never have foresaw that it would result in the victim's brother being sent to prison.

The bible has also ended up mostly covering a very distinctive bloodstain - one suggestion being a pool of blood from Sheila having been placed in the recovery position.   I think the Dickinson report suggests that the bible may have been accidentally re-positioned by a TFG member opening one of the doors - however it seems a convenient coincidence, that the door just happened to push the bible over the distinctive bloodstain!  Not forgetting the bloodied palm print - Which, for some inextricable reason police have not wanted to include in the case against Jeremy. 
 
I'm not sure what they're getting at re position of head / table but there is a picture in the archive which demonstrates the trajectory of shots is not in line with the positioning of Sheila's head / neck wounds.

From what I read Police have admitted moving the rifle from atop Sheila's body to the windowsill and back. As for the bible, I can't see what a palm print from Sheila would prove, even if it did exist.

[Adam]

From what I read Police have admitted moving the rifle from atop Sheila's body to the windowsill and back. As for the bible, I can't see what a palm print from Sheila would prove, even if it did exist.

Where does it say the police moved the rifle to the window and then back on Sheila ?

The police did agree they moved Sheila's lower arm slightly after the first photograph. This was to show marks on her. The photo's show this.

[Steve_uk]

Where does it say the police moved the rifle to the window and then back on Sheila ?

The police did agree they moved Sheila's lower arm slightly after the first photograph. This was to show marks on her. The photo's show this.

I'm sure it's somewhere-will check. It's when PC Bird photographed the gun by the window, or so I thought.

[Roch]

From what I read Police have admitted moving the rifle from atop Sheila's body to the windowsill and back. As for the bible, I can't see what a palm print from Sheila would prove, even if it did exist.

Steve - what members of the raid team are trying to express here - is that when they discovered Sheila upstairs (approximately 2 hours before police photography began) - there was no rifle atop her body.  There was probably a rifle at her side (as noted by one TFG member and PI Miller).  It was not positioned directly over her corpse, as seen in the crime scene photographs.  This was done later, after TFG had discovered, witnessed and mentally noted the scene (hence their concerns upon being later shown a video of crime scene photos). 

Therefore - the crime scene was staged by police officers who acted after TFG operation had finished but before police official photography had began. 

Jeremy Bamber has been in prison for over 30 years based on a crime scene staged by police.

With regard to the bloodied palm print on the bible: At which point during a masscare carried out by Jeremy Bamber - did one of his victims reach for the bible with a bloodied palm?  It makes more sense to imagine Sheila, in a moment of respite after the killings, to have picked up the bible her self - with a bloodied palm.

[Adam]

I'm sure it's somewhere-will check. It's when PC Bird photographed the gun by the window, or so I thought.

I recommend you or someone else finds the source. Otherwise it didn't happen.

Guliters saying the police took the rifle off Sheila, then put it back on her for the photographs will have supporters getting very excited.with conspiracy theories. 

[JackiePreece]

It seems totally logical to assert that the TFG operation and/or its immediate aftermath experienced pretty serious complications. 

It is obvious that, after TFG had initially viewed the scene, police have either introduced a weapon to the scene or re-positioned a weapon that was originally at the side of Sheila's corpse, so that it has instead ended-up atop her corpse.   When you consider Jeremy Bamber has been in prison for over 30 years for leaving said rifle atop Sheila - it's pretty shocking.  Obviously when police introduced / moved the rifle, they could never have foresaw that it would result in the victim's brother being sent to prison.

The bible has also ended up mostly covering a very distinctive bloodstain - one suggestion being a pool of blood from Sheila having been placed in the recovery position.   I think the Dickinson report suggests that the bible may have been accidentally re-positioned by a TFG member opening one of the doors - however it seems a convenient coincidence, that the door just happened to push the bible over the distinctive bloodstain!  Not forgetting the bloodied palm print - Which, for some inextricable reason police have not wanted to include in the case against Jeremy. 
 
I'm not sure what they're getting at re position of head / table but there is a picture in the archive which demonstrates the trajectory of shots is not in line with the positioning of Sheila's head / neck wounds.

Thank you Roch all this important information is being fed to a very famous documentary maker

But to do this case any justice there has to be a series not a one of programme

[Roch]

Thank you Roch all this important information is being fed to a very famous documentary maker

But to do this case any justice there has to be a series not a one of programme

A decent documentary on this case could have wiped-out the prosecuton's case several years ago.  But to go that indepth - you need something of the qaulity of 'Rough Justice'. That kind of program hasn't been commissioned for a long time. The angle they used to take was very questioning and critical.  That just doesn't happen in modern programs of that length. 

The police and prosecution have always been able to rely on the relatives crying 'murderer'.  It's a tactic they have used to great effect to impede the truth and protect the staus quo.

[Steve_uk]

Steve - what members of the raid team are trying to express here - is that when they discovered Sheila upstairs (approximately 2 hours before police photography began) - there was no rifle atop her body.  There was probably a rifle at her side (as noted by one TFG member and PI Miller).  It was not positioned directly over her corpse, as seen in the crime scene photographs.  This was done later, after TFG had discovered, witnessed and mentally noted the scene (hence their concerns upon being later shown a video of crime scene photos). 

Therefore - the crime scene was staged by police officers who acted after TFG operation had finished but before police official photography had began. 

Jeremy Bamber has been in prison for over 30 years based on a crime scene staged by police.

With regard to the bloodied palm print on the bible: At which point during a masscare carried out by Jeremy Bamber - did one of his victims reach for the bible with a bloodied palm?  It makes more sense to imagine Sheila, in a moment of respite after the killings, to have picked up the bible her self - with a bloodied palm.

I seem to recall a video with retired Mick Gradwell from the Lancashire Police mentioning the movement of the rifle, but I was unaware it was deliberately staged, just removed and put back. As for the bible it could easily have been an accoutrement of Sheila's which she brought to the master bedroom on Jeremy's suggestion or was in situ already, and which became bloody upon discharge of the rifle when she wiped her jaw involuntarily after the first shot. I can't see that on its own the exhibit is proof of her exclusive involvement.