the gunshot resdue mystory.

[Caroline]

I'd definitely read somewhere that the dog had been trained in sniffing out gunpowder.
There'd have been no other reason for using a dog so far as I can see.

You read it on here no doubt, that doesn't make it a fact. Why would they need a dog to sniff out gun powder? The reason the dog was there is that they sometimes send in  a sentry dog if they feel the situation is too dangerous for an office. A 'crazy person' is unpredictable so the dog was there as another avenue if required. It seems pretty clear reading his statement that they realised pretty quickly that he wasn't required.

[lookout]

You read it on here no doubt, that doesn't make it a fact. Why would they need a dog to sniff out gun powder? The reason the dog was there is that they sometimes send in  a sentry dog if they feel the situation is too dangerous for an office. A 'crazy person' is unpredictable so the dog was there as another avenue if required. It seems pretty clear reading his statement that they realised pretty quickly that he wasn't required.

The dog would have been deployed because of the knowledge of arms kept at the farmhouse and because the tragedy had only just happened,for all anyone knew,there could still have been an armed person in and around the property,or someone who'd been responsible for having handled a gun.Zeus was a gun dog.

This was mentioned back in 2011/12 by either Curiousessex or HMEssex,both of who must have got their information from somewhere,maybe local to where they live,in Essex.

[nugnug]

I have covered this before.

Propellants used in rimfire ammunition at the time did not contain the typical ingredients that GSR testing would pick up on.

I have found some interesting information from two forensic text books I have.

Here is part of page 208 of the book Forensic Science From the Crime Scene to the Crime Lab by RICHARD SAFERSTEIN, PH.D. Forensic Science Consultant, Mt. Laurel


are so when the prosecution this ment Sheila couldent of fired the gun they completely misinformed the jury.

However, hand swabbing or the application of an adhesive cannot be
used to detect firings of most .22-caliber rim-fire ammunition. Such ammunition’s
primer may contain only barium or neither barium nor antimony


Here is an extract of page 101 of Current methods in forensic gunshot residue analysis by
A. J. Schwoeble and David L. Exline forensic scientists at RJ Lee Group


The manufactures of Remington rimfire ammunition is ELEY LTD

so that means the the proscution seriously missled the jury when they said lack of gunshot proved  shiela dident fire the gun.

[Caroline]

The dog would have been deployed because of the knowledge of arms kept at the farmhouse and because the tragedy had only just happened,for all anyone knew,there could still have been an armed person in and around the property,or someone who'd been responsible for having handled a gun.Zeus was a gun dog.

This was mentioned back in 2011/12 by either Curiousessex or HMEssex,both of who must have got their information from somewhere,maybe local to where they live,in Essex.

It wasn't a sniffer dog.

[lookout]

It wasn't a sniffer dog.

Who said ?

[Caroline]

Who said ?

There is only you saying it was. Find some proof because without it, your claim is baseless. There was no reason for a sniffer dog to be at a crime scene such as this.

[lookout]

There is only you saying it was. Find some proof because without it, your claim is baseless. There was no reason for a sniffer dog to be at a crime scene such as this.

I meant who said it wasn't a sniffer dog.
My reason for saying that it was,is obvious because of guns being involved.

[guest2181]

I have covered this before.

Propellants used in rimfire ammunition at the time did not contain the typical ingredients that GSR testing would pick up on.

I have found some interesting information from two forensic text books I have.

Here is part of page 208 of the book Forensic Science From the Crime Scene to the Crime Lab by RICHARD SAFERSTEIN, PH.D. Forensic Science Consultant, Mt. Laurel


However, hand swabbing or the application of an adhesive cannot be
used to detect firings of most .22-caliber rim-fire ammunition. Such ammunition’s
primer may contain only barium or neither barium nor antimony


Here is an extract of page 101 of Current methods in forensic gunshot residue analysis by
A. J. Schwoeble and David L. Exline forensic scientists at RJ Lee Group


The manufactures of Remington rimfire ammunition is ELEY LTD

Interestingly Eley apparently changed their primer in 1981 after filing a patent in the US (No. 4247494).

They added Barium.

Which certainly questions your assertions.

http://www.academia.edu/29257183/ON_A_POSSIBLE_SOURCE_OF_PHOSPHORUS_AND_CALCIUM_ASSOCIATED_WITH_GUNSHOT_RESIDUE

[Caroline]

I meant who said it wasn't a sniffer dog.
My reason for saying that it was,is obvious because of guns being involved.

No Lookout, your reasoning isn't obvious - what was the dog supposed to sniff out?

[lookout]

No Lookout, your reasoning isn't obvious - what was the dog supposed to sniff out?

As I said before about the thought that someone may have been hanging around the area of the farmhouse,as initially,nobody knew how things would pan out so the dog was used,at the mention of firearms because those dogs are trained to apprehend anyone who brandishes a weapon,or to sniff out a suspect who's handled one. JB wasn't fazed by it. If he'd had a hint of residue on him,the dog would have soon known.
Cadaver dogs along with blood and drug dogs as you know are specialist trained,as are gun dogs. 

[Caroline]

As I said before about the thought that someone may have been hanging around the area of the farmhouse,as initially,nobody knew how things would pan out so the dog was used,at the mention of firearms because those dogs are trained to apprehend anyone who brandishes a weapon,or to sniff out a suspect who's handled one. JB wasn't fazed by it. If he'd had a hint of residue on him,the dog would have soon known.
Cadaver dogs along with blood and drug dogs as you know are specialist trained,as are gun dogs.

Yes, there are all kinds of police dogs, they all do different things but there is no evidence that this dog was a sniffer dog. There would have been no reason for a sniffer dog to be at WHF that night.

[nugnug]

well I'm bloody confused now sniffer dogs.

[Adam]

The Navy Seals that killed Bin Laden had a trained dog with them.

[lookout]

well I'm bloody confused now sniffer dogs.

Fancy turning up with a dog anyway when there was an alleged " siege " going on  Shouldn't the TFU been following the police ? There were lives which could have been saved if the police hadn't been parked 200/300 yards away from the farmhouse.Why was that unless they'd already been told to " stay clear " ??
A lot of unnecessary time was wasted,which makes JB's " non-emergency " call pale into insignificance.

[guest7363]

Fancy turning up with a dog anyway when there was an alleged " siege " going on  Shouldn't the TFU been following the police ? There were lives which could have been saved if the police hadn't been parked 200/300 yards away from the farmhouse.Why was that unless they'd already been told to " stay clear " ??
A lot of unnecessary time was wasted,which makes JB's " non-emergency " call pale into insignificance.

   The firearms team was in Colchester at the time, they then had to head back to HQ and draw weapons then travel to WHF, the dog handler OFFERED to direct them to the scene, now in my book this all takes time?