Innocent Jeremy or Incompetent doctors? Medical Document from 2010 appeal.

[notsure]

You see how eay it is to distort what really happened!

jeremy did not have any influence one way or another in what police action was taken in the sense that he told them his dad called saying shiela had got the gun. Whatever was said they were going in sooner or later and i understand he begged them to go in.

i feel very sad seeing shiela in those photos . I have no experience of dead people and what they should or would look like.
We havent seen all the photos have we so maybe there are others that would prove she had been dead for hours and hours.maybe not !

[Adam]

You see how eay it is to distort what really happened!

jeremy did not have any influence one way or another in what police action was taken in the sense that he told them his dad called saying shiela had got the gun. Whatever was said they were going in sooner or later and i understand he begged them to go in.

i feel very sad seeing shiela in those photos . I have no experience of dead people and what they should or would look like.
We havent seen all the photos have we so maybe there are others that would prove she had been dead for hours and hours.maybe not !

He did have influence.

The police would only make a decision based on what Bamber said. He was the one who knew everyone and had received Neville's 'mysterious' phone call.

It must surely be protocol to get the raid team when guns are a possibility.

[guest154]

You see how eay it is to distort what really happened!

jeremy did not have any influence one way or another in what police action was taken in the sense that he told them his dad called saying shiela had got the gun. Whatever was said they were going in sooner or later and i understand he begged them to go in.

i feel very sad seeing shiela in those photos . I have no experience of dead people and what they should or would look like.
We havent seen all the photos have we so maybe there are others that would prove she had been dead for hours and hours.maybe not !

Perhaps that is why he spent so long looking through the phone book for the phone number to the police station, why he called Julie and why he drove over so slowly to WHF.

Wouldn't look good for Bamber if he and the police arrived within 10 minutes of him receiving the phone call from his Dad and all entered right away.

Gives a good reason for his delaying and stalling, because as you say he didn't know what the police would do once they arrived outside.

[Caroline]

You see how eay it is to distort what really happened!

jeremy did not have any influence one way or another in what police action was taken in the sense that he told them his dad called saying shiela had got the gun. Whatever was said they were going in sooner or later and i understand he begged them to go in.

i feel very sad seeing shiela in those photos . I have no experience of dead people and what they should or would look like.
We havent seen all the photos have we so maybe there are others that would prove she had been dead for hours and hours.maybe not !

As soon as he mentioned 'guns and crazy sister' he had a great deal of influence. Where is it stated that Jeremy 'begged' them to go in?

[lookout]

Probably on his original wit stat of the 7th and 8th of August.

[Caroline]

Probably on his original wit stat of the 7th and 8th of August.

Nope.

[lookout]

Nope.

Lomax's book ? I've definitely read it somewhere.

[scipio_usmc]

Lomax's book ? I've definitely read it somewhere.

He didn't beg them to do anything, in fact when they asked him if he would be able to calm her down he told them she would be apt to shoot him so he didn't want to assist them.  That scared them to the point they decided to call for armed help rather than do anything themselves.

He was very calm he didn't plead with them to do anything:

The 2002 Appeal decision says everything:

"Having walked to the house from the lane there was further conversation. The appellant told the police that Sheila Caffell could use a gun. He said they had gone target shooting together and she had used all the guns in the house before. In the light of what they were told the uniformed officers requested armed assistance before any attempt to search the house was made. The appellant dictated a list of the firearms kept at the house. He told the police that he had loaded the .22 automatic rifle the previous night because he thought he had heard rabbits outside. He said he had left the gun on the kitchen table with a full magazine and a box of ammunition nearby. Those who saw the appellant at the scene at that time described him as remarkably calm. At some stage during their conversations that morning PC Myall and the appellant spoke about motor cars. The appellant said that the Osea Road Caravan Site company, "would be able to stand him a Porsche" car at some point during the year."

After nearly 2 hours passed he asked them what they were doing:

"Armed officers from the Essex Police Tactical Firearms Unit arrived at the farm at about 5 a.m. There was further conversation with the appellant. At about 5.30 a.m. he said to PS Adams, "What if anything has happened in there, they are all the family I've got". He became visibly upset and asked to telephone his girlfriend, Julie Mugford, who was later driven to Essex from London."

Is this what you are referring to? 

[Adam]

He didn't beg them to do anything, in fact when they asked him if he would be able to calm her down he told them she would be apt to shoot him so he didn't want to assist them.  That scared them to the point they decided to call for armed help rather than do anything themselves.

He was very calm he didn't plead with them to do anything:

The 2002 Appeal decision says everything:

"Having walked to the house from the lane there was further conversation. The appellant told the police that Sheila Caffell could use a gun. He said they had gone target shooting together and she had used all the guns in the house before. In the light of what they were told the uniformed officers requested armed assistance before any attempt to search the house was made. The appellant dictated a list of the firearms kept at the house. He told the police that he had loaded the .22 automatic rifle the previous night because he thought he had heard rabbits outside. He said he had left the gun on the kitchen table with a full magazine and a box of ammunition nearby. Those who saw the appellant at the scene at that time described him as remarkably calm. At some stage during their conversations that morning PC Myall and the appellant spoke about motor cars. The appellant said that the Osea Road Caravan Site company, "would be able to stand him a Porsche" car at some point during the year."

After nearly 2 hours passed he asked them what they were doing:

"Armed officers from the Essex Police Tactical Firearms Unit arrived at the farm at about 5 a.m. There was further conversation with the appellant. At about 5.30 a.m. he said to PS Adams, "What if anything has happened in there, they are all the family I've got". He became visibly upset and asked to telephone his girlfriend, Julie Mugford, who was later driven to Essex from London."

Is this what you are referring to?

That is correct. Bamber said 'we don't get on at all. I don't like her and she doesn't like me'.

I don't know if that was before he called her a 'nutter', 'looney', 'do lally' and 'psychotic depressive'. And told the police she knew how to use the guns inside WHF. And told police about Neville's call.

Bamber did assist the police by drawing a diagram and telling the police of potential hiding places Sheila might be in. That would have been helpful if Sheila was alive and hiding inside WHF. She wasn't.

[maggie]

That is correct. Bamber said 'we don't get on at all. I don't like her and she doesn't like me'.

I don't know if that was before he called her a 'nutter', 'looney', 'do lally' and 'psychotic depressive'. And told the police she knew how to use the guns inside WHF. And told police about Neville's call.

Bamber did assist the police by drawing a diagram and telling the police of potential hiding places Sheila might be in. That would have been helpful if Sheila was alive and hiding inside WHF. She wasn't.

Adam, Just pointing out that there were other statements from police who took a slightly less extreme stance saying JB said he and his sister didn't get on very well, so which was the exact quote?  Just saying ...

[Caroline]

Adam, Just pointing out that there were other statements from police who took a slightly less extreme stance saying JB said he and his sister didn't get on very well, so which was the exact quote?  Just saying ...

Perhaps he said both, but to different officers which makes it worse.

[maggie]

Perhaps he said both, but to different officers which makes it worse.

Perhaps he did. just reminding Adam 

[lookout]

Dickinson Report is where it says that Jeremy had begged EP to go inside the farmhouse.

[Caroline]

Dickinson Report is where it says that Jeremy had begged EP to go inside the farmhouse.

Lots of things in the Dickinson report are incorrect.

[lookout]

Lots of things in the Dickinson report are incorrect.

Much the same as a lot of other things I imagine.