Colin said he would have killed June

[Caroline]

Have just looked in the archives and there are2 buckets near the little oven where the phone was supposed to have been hidden, we don't know if they are clothes buckets or cleaning buckets but a you say anyone would expect any buckets in the kitchen would have been kicked over during the violent confrontation in the kitchen.  I wish I could remember who told me or where I read the buckets were moved into the kitchen.

They are the clothes buckets.

[maggie]

They are the clothes buckets.

I remember an argument about these buckets but it's so long ago cannot remember any more.  Did you ever hear that the buckets were originally in the laundry, which is why they weren't kicked over during the 'battle' in the kitchen?

[scipio_usmc]

I remember an argument about these buckets but it's so long ago cannot remember any more.  Did you ever hear that the buckets were originally in the laundry, which is why they weren't kicked over during the 'battle' in the kitchen?

Various people said they were moved and I initially believed they were right but it turns the buckets are in the crime scene photos in the kitchen so such people were wrong.  They were not kicked over because they are in the corner. They were out of the way so no one would trip on them while walking around the kitchen.  This ended up saving them from getting spilled during the struggle. The struggle took place on the other side of the kitchen so that obviously helped as well.

[maggie]

Various people said they were moved and I initially believed they were right but it turns the buckets are in the crime scene photos in the kitchen so such people were wrong.  They were not kicked over because they are in the corner. They were out of the way so no one would trip on them while walking around the kitchen.  This ended up saving them from getting spilled during the struggle. The struggle took place on the other side of the kitchen so that obviously helped as well.

I knew you'd say that    I have no idea where the buckets were to start with but it's true they're in the crime scene photos.  I used to argue they were in the kitchen but was told or read they were originally most definitely by the washing machine ....  now I have no idea and in the end it doesn't make much difference imo.

[Jane]

I remember an argument about these buckets but it's so long ago cannot remember any more.  Did you ever hear that the buckets were originally in the laundry, which is why they weren't kicked over during the 'battle' in the kitchen?

It's quite interesting, re the buckets. We know that it was June's habit to soak very soiled items before washing them but they could not have been large items because there's a limit to what can be stuffed into a bucket of water without the water spilling.

[maggie]

It's quite interesting, re the buckets. We know that it was June's habit to soak very soiled items before washing them but they could not have been large items because there's a limit to what can be stuffed into a bucket of water without the water spilling.

Very true, scipio seems to live in a world of stained, soaking clothes according to some of his posts.  I have very little memory of EVER soaking anything.  We are all different though and should imagine June would be into soaking, it's a wonder she didn't have an old tin bath for the purpose??

[scipio_usmc]

Yes, I see from post 142 that you introduced panties into a conversation in which neither Jan, Maggie nor I had mentioned them. You then used the fact that -according to you, but without substantiation- Sheila had put the boys' trousers into soak as proof of her interest in them, after which I found details of JUNE'S habit of soaking very soiled clothes prior to putting them in the washing machine.............................................however, the original conversation had been about Sheila's psychological and emotional state,and that, having looked at her relationship with June -or perhaps I should change that to June's relationship with her- PLUS listening to what was said by her friends, male and female, her ex husband, her consultant, Freddie, even Jeremy!!!! I believe her to have been depressed, because she was displaying what, in my understanding, are classic symptoms, and for daring to employ the intelligence learned from the job I was trained for, from your position of apparently knowing much more than I, you called me IGNORANT

I simply made a factual inference. The housekeeper claimed June would soak clothing in buckets and leave them in the laundry area.  She said Sheila would leave her panties in the kitchen soaking though.  Sheila's panties were soaking in the kitchen. Next to them were children's pants soaking.  The logical inference is Sheila not only soaked her panties but the pant since June would leave such in the laundry area if she had soaked them.

I also pointed out that Jeremy complained that Sheila took the boys to visit him as he was using the tractor.  his shows she at least spent some time with them on the farm.  Thus saying she spent no time with them at all and totally ignored them fully doesn't work.

We don't know how much time she spent with them at WHF but it makes little difference she did obviously spend some and obviously had some interest in them not none at all.   

[scipio_usmc]

I knew you'd say that    I have no idea where the buckets were to start with but it's true they're in the crime scene photos.  I used to argue they were in the kitchen but was told or read they were originally most definitely by the washing machine ....  now I have no idea and in the end it doesn't make much difference imo.

The police crime scene photos show they were in the kitchen by the sink.  Thus that is were when the police entered.  The claims they were in the back kitchen turned out to be wrong.  Photos taken to show the state of things i their ordinary state were misconstrued as crime scene photos and resulted in the false claim that they were in the back kitchen when police raided the house and subsequently moved to the kitchen by someone. 

Some Jeremy supporters suggest that after the murders Sheila soaked the pants and panties and other clothing she had worn while committing the crimes.  They argue the clothing being in the kitchen supports such because June would not have permitted it.  This is why the location is significant.  If they were not in the kitchen this argument evaporates.  Some rejected the claims for this reason, they said the buckets were found in the back kitchen laundry area and relied on photos showing the ordinary state of things which they misconstrued as crime scene photos.

The crime scene photos are important for another reason, they confirm only 2 buckets are there.  Some supporters suggest there were more buckets with additional clothing Sheila wore.  The photos show there were only 2 buckets though. So the best they can argue is maybe the two buckets had additional clothing beyond the panties and trousers.  Such speculation means little though since it is rank speculation and Eaton insists they only had the blood stained panties and dirty trousers.

[lookout]

Then Stan Jones took it as read from AE when she told him that it was menstrual blood in one bucket because " it smelled different " from normal blood. What sort of a person would have fallen for that ?
As he stood there with a pair of canvas shoes under his arm and told AE not to say anything.

Makes you wonder doesn't it ?

[lookout]

I had heard that the canvas shoes were quite bloodied. Were they Jeremy's size 

[scipio_usmc]

Then Stan Jones took it as read from AE when she told him that it was menstrual blood in one bucket because " it smelled different " from normal blood. What sort of a person would have fallen for that ?
As he stood there with a pair of canvas shoes under his arm and told AE not to say anything.

Makes you wonder doesn't it ?

Police took it as menstrual blood because the crotch area of the panties were stained and no one had any wounds in their crotch that could have caused such stains. 

[scipio_usmc]

I had heard that the canvas shoes were quite bloodied. Were they Jeremy's size 

What canvas shoes

[lookout]

What canvas shoes

Exactly-----------this is why Stan Jones picked them up smartish from out of the bedroom and told AE " you didn't see them,so be sure to say this in court ".They were Sheila's which she obviously wore on the night of the murders. They were never seen again. 

[maggie]

I had heard that the canvas shoes were quite bloodied. Were they Jeremy's size 

The shopkeeper who served June and Sheila earlier in the day said Sheila was wearing black canvas shoes.

[lookout]

The shopkeeper who served June and Sheila earlier in the day said Sheila was wearing black canvas shoes.

That's right Maggie. There'd have been enough blood on them for testing.