Familiar Portrait?

[maggie]

Initially,he'd have hung on to that arrogant air that surrounded him,and we all know that it re-appeared when he was questioned by the police. I would say that a lot of public school educated people are like this to the point of appearing unapproachable. Sadly,common sense doesn't prevail always.

We hear over and over again that JB was arrogant but was he or was he rather a very confident person due to his upbringing and Public School education?  Some people may have misinterpreted him due to their own lack of confidence?  Just a thought.

[Jane]

A bit of a contradiction in terms---- " cruel picture " and " it was expected of her ".

I don't understand. Could you elaborate, please.

[susan]

We hear over and over again that JB was arrogant but was he or was he rather a very confident person due to his upbringing and Public School education?  Some people may have misinterpreted him due to their own lack of confidence?  Just a thought.

Maggie Jeremy's House Master said Jeremy was arrogant and a loner and tended to bully the younger boys all in Colin's book

[Jane]

Well of course but without proof he behaved in a grandiose manner, surely all we have is supposition?

Nor is there proof that he is/was anything like the personality Lookout insists he is/was. I will go further and suggest that there is even LESS proof. 

[Caroline]

Jeremy worked as a waiter in little chef on the A12, Not exactly typical of a grandiose psychopath

What is typical of a grandiose psychopath?

[Caroline]

Well of course but without proof he behaved in a grandiose manner, surely all we have is supposition?

Most of what is said here is supposition.

[Caroline]

Actually, the comment at the start of the thread was said about someone else not Jeremy bit it certainly fits.

The following contains a quote from his old headmaster and a remark from one of his old school friends.

"Those who knew Bamber at school, noticed his need to express his superiority."

"He was a rather prickly sort of boy" His headmaster at Gresham's, Mr. Logie Bruce-Lockhart, was to recall. "I believe some of the bys found him irritating, in that he could be a relentless tease. I think he showed at touch of arrogance at a very young age"

"A former school friend, John Fielding, remembered Bamber being a bit of an oddball"

(Quote from Murder Casebook 1990, page 224)

[Jane]

Actually, the comment at the start of the thread was said about someone else not Jeremy bit it certainly fits.

The following contains a quote from his old headmaster and a remark from one of his old school friends.

"Those who knew Bamber at school, noticed his need to express his superiority."

"He was a rather prickly sort of boy" His headmaster at Gresham's, Mr. Logie Bruce-Lockhart, was to recall. "I believe some of the bys found him irritating, in that he could be a relentless tease. I think he showed at touch of arrogance at a very young age"

"A former school friend, John Fielding, remembered Bamber being a bit of an oddball"

(Quote from Murder Casebook 1990, page 224)

Caroline, I have yet to come across anyone of those who knew him pre murders who supports the description Lookout paints of him. Come to think of it, I've yet to meet anyone who knew June to describe her the way Lookout does.

[maggie]

Most of what is said here is supposition.

Of course it is but there are limits imo.

I do agree with April that June has got a really bad press from some and she doesn't deserve to be the scapegoat for Sheila's illness and other dysfunction in the family.  Sheila's illness possibly distorted her understanding of June, it is often the case that PS can cause hatred of a close family member for no apparent reason and I believe we should take Sheila' attitude to June with a pinch of salt.

[susan]

Of course it is but there are limits imo.

I do agree with April that June has got a really bad press from some and she doesn't deserve to be the scapegoat for Sheila's illness and other dysfunction in the family.  Sheila's illness possibly distorted her understanding of June, it is often the case that PS can cause hatred of a close family member for no apparent reason and I believe we should take Sheila' attitude to June with a pinch of salt.

Maggie I will not quote Colin's book but he talks differently about June and Sheila and their relationship and he does not speak well of June at all but I cannot comment as I did not know June but I cannot see why Colin would make it up and he does not have a good word to say about her and his boys hated going to WHF because of her and her attitude He did not blame June for Sheila's illness.

[maggie]

Maggie I will not quote Colin's book but he talks differently about June and Sheila and their relationship and he does not speak well of June at all but I cannot comment as I did not know June but I cannot see why Colin would make it up and he does not have a good word to say about her and his boys hated going to WHF because of her and her attitude He did not blame June for Sheila's illness.

I am trying to say that Sheila's attitude to June may have been distorted by her illness and this may have been passed on to the boys.  Of course I have no more idea than anyone else what the real truth was but am just putting my thoughts forward as a possibility.

[Alias]

Maggie I will not quote Colin's book but he talks differently about June and Sheila and their relationship and he does not speak well of June at all but I cannot comment as I did not know June but I cannot see why Colin would make it up and he does not have a good word to say about her and his boys hated going to WHF because of her and her attitude He did not blame June for Sheila's illness.

Susan, I think in a way he did. He didn´t think that Sheila was actually mentally ill, but rather "carried" June´s illness for the whole family. A strange dynamics, but it does happen. Of course I don´t know if that was the case, but Colin believed it might be.

[Caroline]

Of course it is but there are limits imo.

I do agree with April that June has got a really bad press from some and she doesn't deserve to be the scapegoat for Sheila's illness and other dysfunction in the family.  Sheila's illness possibly distorted her understanding of June, it is often the case that PS can cause hatred of a close family member for no apparent reason and I believe we should take Sheila' attitude to June with a pinch of salt.

What limits? I think if guilty, Jeremy has to be a psychopath and as a convicted murderer and the subject of the forum his personality pre and post murders is up for debate.

It certainly your prerogative to take things with a 'pinch of salt' but other people might think the relationship that either Jeremy or Sheila had with June, might be key and it is relevant to the debate (as long as people can back up their argument and not make wild claims).

[susan]

I am trying to say that Sheila's attitude to June may have been distorted by her illness and this may have been passed on to the boys.  Of course I have no more idea than anyone else what the real truth was but am just putting my thoughts forward as a possibility.

Maggie
I think the boys did not like going to the farm as they were made to pray too much not just bed time prayers  and she was rather critical of them but the boys really loved Ralph as did Sheila.

[maggie]

What limits? I think if guilty, Jeremy has to be a psychopath and as a convicted murderer and the subject of the forum his personality pre and post murders is up for debate.

It certainly your prerogative to take things with a 'pinch of salt' but other people might think the relationship that either Jeremy or Sheila had with June, might be key and it is relevant to the debate (as long as people can back up their argument and not make wild claims).

Thank you for that Caroline, think I can work all that out for myself and I am quite open to other people's arguments and attitudes.
I have always said I believe Jeremey would have to have been a psychopath to have carried out the murders, which is why I continue to question.