How would you react ?

[Jan]

If you have never fired a gun before, is it possible to work out how to manually chamber the first round ?

We do not 100% know she had not fired a gun before - I thought Anne said Jeremy had tried to teach her?
Jeremy said she had gone out shooting with her father.

[Jan]

It's not impossible for her to use. She just had no experience with guns.

To expect her to chamber and re load twice, while Neville is a quivering wreak ringing Jeremy is ridiculous.

Jeremy choose that rifle as it is used for shooting rabbits. Something Jeremy claimed he had loaded it for and left it within easy access for a crazy Sheila.

Anyway Jeremy didn't think Sheila's gun experience would ever be investigated.

So you are saying that Jeremy lied through his teeth about everything about Sheila and did not expect to be investigated?

And can you clarify your comment about Jeremy chose the weapon to shoot rabbits? So are you saying he would not know the power and that it would be so successful in killing humans ? I don't know quite what you are getting at?

[guest154]

Colin says in his book that Sheila´s condition always deteriorated dramatically whenever she went to WHF, NO MATTER THE MEDICATION. He clearly states that.
But of course, don´t believe a man who knew the people involved.

Of course not Alias,when there are people on this site who know better 
June told Pamela that night that she was very worried about Sheila's health just before they all died.  Whatever happened that night one of the few facts we do know about that night is that June told her sister at about 10pm that she was very worried about Sheila's behaviour and wanted to speak to her the next day about it.

and he was her husband so i think he would know her better than most people.

Yes he would know them better than people here, he also believe Jeremy guilty & has said why he doesn't think Sheila is guilty. Wouldn't be a case of you three picking and choosing to give Colin credit one moment and then dismiss him in the other, would it?

[Adam]

Hopefully Scipio will answer.

If it is not possible. It's a body blow for Jeremy's supporters. They then have to rely that Sheila knew all about the murder rifle. Which had recently been purchased.

[scipio_usmc]

Of course not Alias,when there are people on this site who know better 
June told Pamela that night that she was very worried about Sheila's health just before they all died.  Whatever happened that night one of the few facts we do know about that night is that June told her sister at about 10pm that she was very worried about Sheila's behaviour and wanted to speak to her the next day about it.

Others on this site choose to be objective instead of taking the biased view Alias and you choose to take.

The actual claims was that Sheila didn't like being preached to about her sinful lifestyle and that such preaching is why she would be unhappy after her visits.  Colin said that Sheila found God and was bonding with June over religion and they had a better relationship after he second hospital stay.

Biased Jeremy supporters look at conditions in the past instead of the situation at the time of the murders just like supporters keep raising the thoughts she had PRIOR to her 1983 treatment.  After that she had no delusions about her family.  Biased people ignore that and keep bringing up the delusions she had before her treatment to try to say this means she would have the delusions at the time of the murders. 

If people want to fool themselves with such it is no sweat off anyone else's back but when you try to use such as an argument to sway others it fails unless the people you are trying to sway are also biased and thus want to wear the same blinders.  An effective advocate can't afford to wear blinders because making arguments that are invalid will not work on a broad scale.

[maggie]

We do not 100% know she had not fired a gun before - I thought Anne said Jeremy had tried to teach her?
Jeremy said she had gone out shooting with her father.

We do know she used to go on shooting parties and act as a beater so she had no objection to blood sports.  Of course we don't know either way but you would think it's highly possible she had used a gun before at one of the shooting parties or at some other time, it was a way of life on farms wasn't it Jan??

[nugnug]

he dident think jeremy was guilty from the word go it was only after jeremy was charged untill then he thought sheila did it so he dident think she couldent use a gun.

[Jan]

Who do you think Sheila shot first ?

David said she shot the twins first. Neville waking up and seeing her standing by the twins with the rifle. Neville then abandoned everyone to run downstairs to ring Jeremy.

Adam - the only reason you keep going back to this is whether guilty or innocent no poster can answer who was shot first . The sequence has never been proved and never can be unless as you say JB confesses. So it is a bit of a no brainer really . Each time you ask it we will ask you where Sheila was when her boys were being shot , how she got to the room and how apparently she did not try and defend herself  at all when someone made her lie down and  be shot in the way she was.

[Alias]

Yes he would know them better than people here, he also believe Jeremy guilty & has said why he doesn't think Sheila is guilty. Wouldn't be a case of you three picking and choosing to give Colin credit one moment and then dismiss him in the other, would it?

I can´t answer for "us three", only for myself, but it must have been a tremendous relief for Colin that Jeremy was convicted, since it took away the responsibility and probably guilt he must have felt.
"She finally did it" - was Colin´s first reaction to the tragedy.

[guest154]

I can´t answer for "us three", only for myself, but it must have been a tremendous relief for Colin that Jeremy was convicted, since it took away the responsibility and probably guilt he must have felt.
"She finally did it" - was Colin´s first reaction to the tragedy.

You can't answer for Nugs or Maggie, but you seem to be able to read Colins mind?

[nugnug]

We do know he used to go on shooting arties and act as a beater so she had no objection to blood sports.  Of course we don't know either way but you would think it's highly possible she had used a gun before at one of the shooting parties or t some other time, it was a way of life on farms wasn't it Jan??

if it was true she couldent use a colin would of known it wasnt straght away but he dident.

[Adam]

So you are saying that Jeremy lied through his teeth about everything about Sheila and did not expect to be investigated?

And can you clarify your comment about Jeremy chose the weapon to shoot rabbits? So are you saying he would not know the power and that it would be so successful in killing humans ? I don't know quite what you are getting at?

He told Julie he was 'watertight' and it was an 'open and shut case'. He wasn't investigated for a long time afterwards. When the relatives found the silencer and Julie came forward.

He choose a weapon that he could claim he left out earlier in the evening. Saying he fully loaded it after seeing rabbits. However human head shots with the same rifle are also lethal.

[Jane]

Of course not Alias,when there are people on this site who know better 
June told Pamela that night that she was very worried about Sheila's health just before they all died.  Whatever happened that night one of the few facts we do know about that night is that June told her sister at about 10pm that she was very worried about Sheila's behaviour and wanted to speak to her the next day about it.

I've never argued with ANY of you regarding Sheila's emotional and mental health. IMO, that she was not being monitored after her meds being adjusted was a potential recipe for disaster and that's just about the chemicals. Her emotional state was something other. She wasn't having regular counselling and the meds, unless they turned her into a zombie, wouldn't have helped that. June had every right to feel concerned. She was an emotional mess which makes it FAR to easy to pin the murders on her but how COULD she have done it? Where were all the bloodied clothes? Yes, she could have showered. Yes, she could have washed her hair, but WHERE were the clothes she wore?

 I'll bet she'd never loaded a gun in her life. If she'd EVER used one, someone would probably have loaded it for her -I believe it to be customary at shoots- so IMO, it goes without saying that she wouldn't have been able to load a weapon she'd never seen before, but she made a very convenient scape-goat.

[guest154]

if it was true she couldent use a colin would of known it wasnt straght away but he dident.

When he was initially told - he had no reason to not believe what he was hearing, why would he at that point? It was natural to accept what he was being told. It was only in the time afterwards that he, and everyone else began to realise what had actually happened.

[Adam]

I can´t answer for "us three", only for myself, but it must have been a tremendous relief for Colin that Jeremy was convicted, since it took away the responsibility and probably guilt he must have felt.
"She finally did it" - was Colin´s first reaction to the tragedy.

Had Sheila been threatening to kill Neville, June, Nicolas, Daniel and herself ?

It's not surprising Jeremy said to Liz Rimmington 'I'm the only one who knew Sheila was going back to the nut house'.