13 bullet cases in m/bedroom, yet no follower plate mark found on them...

[mike tesko]

Stating so doesn't make her right.  She stated the green/white corner was to her right but that is impossible unless she was at the green/black containment site. 

Have you got any idea who you are trying to undermine, or even how much time and effort I have put into trying to arrive at the truth? I am streets ahead of you, I have looked at and considered what you are promoting, years ago...

Good luck in your mission to arrive at the truth, you are  really a very long way off...

[Jan]

"You are ignoring that if she had been in front of the house there are 3 windows that she could have been referring to and there would be no way to isolate which of the 3 she meant.  So you would not be able to establish she meant the master bedroom window.



great point skippy - that's why you cant isolate she meant the box room either!

[scipio_usmc]

I do not accept that I have lost any debate on these matters, no-one has argued or challenged what I have been saying in any sort of depth, so I once again disagree with what you are intent on wrongly promoting...

You don't have to admit it anymore than Saddam hiding in a hole in the ground refusing to admit defeat prevented the Iraqi military from having been defeated.

The simple facts are that Jeapes replaced men who were at the white containment site.  DIFFERENT officers were at the white/red containment site including a person who she said was at the position to her right.   She described being at the corner of a barn which fits the white containment location but not the red/white.  She claimed she saw the raid team enter which is on;y possible if she had been at the white containment site.  She claimed she was on the side facing the kitchen windows which means the white containment site.

Your admission you lost is not necessary to establish you lost I established it with the objective evidence.

 

[scipio_usmc]

"You are ignoring that if she had been in front of the house there are 3 windows that she could have been referring to and there would be no way to isolate which of the 3 she meant.  So you would not be able to establish she meant the master bedroom window.



great point skippy - that's why you cant isolate she meant the box room either!

She wasn't at the front of the house though.  She was at the side facing the kitchen and there is on;y one window there clad in gray.  The whole reason she used the description she did is because only one window fit the bill the box room window.

There are 2 possibilities:

1) she incorrectly thought the kitchen door was the front of the house

or

2) she was at the front of the house and incorrectly thought the dining room was the kitchen.

By looking at all the available evidence it is clear she wasn't a the front of the house.  The descriptions she provided of being by the corner of a barn apply to the white side not the front.  The officers she relieved were at the white side not the front.  She said she saw the raid team enter and they entered the kitchen door not the front.  We know for a fact other officers were in the front.

You have to ignore all the available evidence to pretend it is possible that she was at the front of the house and thought the dining room was the kitchen. 

[mike tesko]

You don't have to admit it anymore than Saddam hiding in a hole in the ground refusing to admit defeat prevented the Iraqi military from having been defeated.

Please, don't you dare try to go down that road - there were no weapons of mass destruction, now shut the fuck up...

[mike tesko]

Saddam Hussain, was executed, he did not die screaming, he did not plea for his life to be spared, he died, with dignity. How many other world leaders would have left this world, in the same manner, as Saddam did?

[mike tesko]

The simple facts are that Jeapes replaced men who were at the white containment site.  DIFFERENT officers were at the white/red containment site including a person who she said was at the position to her right.   She described being at the corner of a barn which fits the white containment location but not the red/white.  She claimed she saw the raid team enter which is on;y possible if she had been at the white containment site.  She claimed she was on the side facing the kitchen windows which means the white containment site.

Your admission you lost is not necessary to establish you lost I established it with the objective evidence.

You have established "FUCK ALL"...

[scipio_usmc]

You have established "FUCK ALL"...

Mildinhall was actually in the front of the house in the red/white position with Brown and Moule joined shortly thereafter.  In fact Moule is the only one who stayed there and was covering the position alone while the raid team was inside.

Mildinhall's statement is extremely detailed and highly useful:





It is crystal clear that he has accurately described the red/white location and what the building would look like from that location.  He also correctly identifies the white location.  He notes from the red/white location he could only hear the raid team not see them enter.  Jeapes described the white side of the building and the description of being by the barn likewise fits the white side.  The people she relieved had been on the white side.  She said she saw the raid team enter so was clearly on the white side.

Furthermore, the dining room light wasn't on the kitchen light was the one that was on.

There is no question Jeapes misidentified her location when she wrote red/white she meant white.  She also messed up by calling the location to her right the green/white location, the location to her right was the red/white location where Mildinhall, Brown and Moule were prior to Brown and Mildinhall moving to the white containment site with Jeapes.   

[Alias]

I understand Mike, he is defending someone he thinks is innocent, but what on earth are all of you people doing charachter assassinating Jeremy Bamber who is already behind bars with the harshest sentence possible.
What is it about?

[Steve_uk]

I understand Mike, he is defending someone he thinks is innocent, but what on earth are all of you people doing charachter assassinating Jeremy Bamber who is already behind bars with the harshest sentence possible.
What is it about?

It's just about trying to understand how such a young man could be driven to murder five people in cold blood,or if you consider him innocent why so many have conspired against him for so long. I'm not against conspiracy theories and believe me the Establishment can play as dirty as anyone..

[Alias]

It's just about trying to understand how such a young man could be driven to murder five people in cold blood,or if you consider him innocent why so many have conspired against him for so long. I'm not against conspiracy theories and believe me the Establishment can play as dirty as anyone..

Steve, it happened thirty years ago. I agree, it is an interesting case, we are still dicussing it. But Jeremy had the harshest sentence possible, so why is there still a need to "kill" him further? What is that about?

[mike tesko]

By reference to the following "google map image", it becomes increasingly obvious where WPC Jeapes was stood (2) , or generally stood at the time she spotted the rifle leaning against the upper floor window (RED SIDE), how she could see the front door of the farmhouse (RED SIDE), and the dining room window beyond the front door (RED SIDE), whilst at the same time from a similar location, have been able to see the rear farmhouse door on WHITE SIDE:-

[mike tesko]

At the time of Jeapes sighting of the rifle leaning against the upper floor window, she was generally in location 2, covering WHITE / RED SIDES at one and the same time. From there she could see the following features on RED SIDE, Main bedroom window on upper floor with the anshuzt rifle leaning against it, the prominently positioned front door, and the downstairs ground floor window to the right of the front door, which she thought was the kitchen window, but which in fact was the dining room window. At the same general time, she could see on the WHITE SIDE of the building to her left, the rear external door via which the raid team would eventually smash down and enter into the farmhouse. I doubt from her vantage point on the corner of WHITE / RED that she would have even been able to see the main kitchen window, because of the acute angle or the view afforded her from there...

Because she couldn't see the main kitchen window from the corner of WHITE / RED, there can be no possibility that she could have mistaken the front door (RED SIDE) and the dining room window (also on RED SIDE), with the rear door (WHITE SIDE), and the main kitchen window (also on WHITE SIDE), because from her vantage point at the corner of WHITE / RED, she could not even see the main kitchen window to her left, on the right side of the rear door on WHITE SIDE, to allow her to make such a mistake...

[Jane]

Steve, it happened thirty years ago. I agree, it is an interesting case, we are still dicussing it. But Jeremy had the harshest sentence possible, so why is there still a need to "kill" him further? What is that about?

It IS an interesting case about which there is no middle ground. Jeremy is either innocent or guilty. Those who believe him to be innocent think up every reason under the sun to make it so OR search for the elusive loophole which will get him out on a technicality. This is countered by those who believe he's guilty and they answer the more extreme claims with reasons WHY the harsh sentence was justified and should remain. It's generally known as debate.

[mike tesko]

All the key evidence relied upon to secure the convictions for murder were dodgy by anybodies standards...