The killlers

[Alias]

Jeremy had either read up about two shot suicides and knew it was possible. Or used common sense and assumed it would be believable that Sheila had shot herself twice with a weak rifle.

Either way he was not going deviate radically from the plan he had spent a long time on, at the last minute. After having to fire a second shot. The fake random burglar or psychopath options are both non starters.

I doubt he would have known about it and even if he did, it would have made him cautious and not toss a bloodied silencer into the cupboard.
He would also have known by the time he shot Sheila just how weak that rifle was. Both June and Nevill were up and about after having received several shots.
I think he would have picked the stronger firearm that was at the farm to kill Sheila with one shot.

[Jan]

Oh so now Jeremy can't fit through windows. Although he told the police and courts he could.

.

Read what I said. Before making rash comments.

[Alias]

.

Read what I said. Before making rash comments.

He doesn´t read what I write either, so...

[Adam]

f.  Yes I am aware of that . He said he had gone in and out of windows but never said one could be locked from the outside. That is why the courts said it did not have to be proven. Which means it never was. What I was saying is if they said one particular window was used for the exit , it would be relevant if he could not physically get out of that particular window.

He could get out of kitchen windows. It's in the police interview transcripts.

Even the OS and Jeremy do not argue this. Preferring to focus on Neville's call to the police. Oh dear.

[Jan]

He doesn´t read what I write either, so...

I think he would have got stuck in that rubbery wetsuit anyway

[Jane]

f.  Yes I am aware of that . He said he had gone in and out of windows but never said one could be locked from the outside. That is why the courts said it did not have to be proven. Which means it never was. What I was saying is if they said one particular window was used for the exit , it would be relevant if he could not physically get out of that particular window.

Are you saying that although he was found guilty, if the court said he got out of window A but it was discovered that he must have used window B because he couldn't fit through window A, the court's decision would have to be reversed?

[scipio_usmc]

f.  Yes I am aware of that . He said he had gone in and out of windows but never said one could be locked from the outside. That is why the courts said it did not have to be proven. Which means it never was. What I was saying is if they said one particular window was used for the exit , it would be relevant if he could not physically get out of that particular window.

The court said there was no need to prove beyond a reasonable doubt how he entered and exited because the only elements that need to be proven beyond a reasonable doubt are the essential elements of the crime.  All other issues including motive need only be established by a preponderance.  The family testified they were able to lock the kitchen window from the outside and a cop (Barlow) had the family demonstrate to him how it was able to be accomplished.  Showing he had the ability to get in and out was all they needed to prove, not to prove he definitely used a particular window or door. 

[Adam]

I doubt he would have known about it and even if he did, it would have made him cautious and not toss a bloodied silencer into the cupboard.
He would also have known by the time he shot Sheila just how weak that rifle was. Both June and Nevill were up and about after having received several shots.
I think he would have picked the stronger firearm that was at the farm to kill Sheila with one shot.

So Sheila in her rage changed guns. After her two re loads of course.

Two shot suicides happen. Especially with weak rifles. Jeremy either knew or suspected this. Anyway he had to fire a second shot to kill her.

[Jane]

He doesn´t read what I write either, so...

NO, Scipio is probably the only one of us he doesn't have on ignore.......................'course, what he doesn't realize is that most of us probably have HIM on ignore :D

[Alias]

What I find telling is that guilters were perfectly willing to accept that Jeremy could have ecited through that little window - nothing else. What other absurdities are guilters willing to accept? A two shot murder staged as a suicide to name one. 

[Jane]

I keep seeing this thing about "weak" rifles!!!!!!! It implies that it isn't worth giving house room to OR it's something you'd buy for a child to practice with!!! FFS!!! IT KILLED 5 PEOPLE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[scipio_usmc]

I doubt he would have known about it and even if he did, it would have made him cautious and not toss a bloodied silencer into the cupboard.
He would also have known by the time he shot Sheila just how weak that rifle was. Both June and Nevill were up and about after having received several shots.
I think he would have picked the stronger firearm that was at the farm to kill Sheila with one shot.

Yeah cause a crazy Sheila bent on killing everyone and herself would suddenly calm down rationally consider that the Aschutz might be too weak for 1 shot to kill her so made the decision to go seek out the 12 bore because she believed it would have a better chance of killing her on the first shot....

His goal was to frame a crazy SHeila

 

[Jan]

Are you saying that although he was found guilty, if the court said he got out of window A but it was discovered that he must have used window B because he couldn't fit through window A, the court's decision would have to be reversed?

No. What I am saying is that I find it very hard to understand that ruling . However many times I read it I don't really get it. As far as I can see that are admitting it was never proven a window could be or was locked from the outside on the night. And they did indicate that a certain window "could" have been the one used. But if he could not have got out of that window then why was that not queried.

[Jane]

What I find telling is that guilters were perfectly willing to accept that Jeremy could have ecited through that little window - nothing else. What other absurdities are guilters willing to accept? A two shot murder staged as a suicide to name one. 

I'm willing to accept he got out through A window and I don't think that's any more absurd than your suggestion that he could have made the crime scene look like a botched burglary.

[Adam]

What I find telling is that guilters were perfectly willing to accept that Jeremy could have ecited through that little window - nothing else. What other absurdities are guilters willing to accept? A two shot murder staged as a suicide to name one. 

You have to accept Jeremy is guilty Alias. Changing stance is hard but will make you look better than continuing to argue Bamber's innocence. April, Caroline and Susan all realised this after I joined.

You tried explaining how Sheila committed the massacre several months ago. It was ripped apart.

I commend you for trying. You wisely didn't resubmit when I provided the recent deadline. Lookout and Jan also wisely declined. Only David tried. Twice. Both summaries being ripped apart.

Now you are just arguing one point. That Sheila could have committed suicide herself with two shots. But Jeremy was stupid to attempt a framing attempt after two shots. So contradicting yourself.