Russia - worrying?

[David1819]

   Based on your childhood interactions with a gran who never lived there but heard from her parents and some mates grandparents-you believe that to be extensive first hand knowledge of the Soviet Union.

So, you are saying that people who lived and grew up in Soviet union don't have first hand knowledge of the Soviet Union?  The very place they grew up in and who lived and worked in its very institutions? 

You remind me of Malcom Caldwell. A Tankie like yourself, he was rubbishing the Cambodian refugees claims of a genocide taking place. Went to Cambodia and was murdered by Pol Pots henchmen.

[Roch]

David, I hope you have booby trapped your Nebraskan homestead, in case any sleeper cell Russians are instructed to pay a visit.

[gringo]

So, you are saying that people who lived and grew up in Soviet union don't have first hand knowledge of the Soviet Union? The very place they grew up in and who lived and worked in its very institutions? 

You remind me of Malcom Caldwell. A Tankie like yourself, he was rubbishing the Cambodian refugees claims of a genocide taking place. Went to Cambodia and was murdered by Pol Pots henchmen.

    Learn to read and comprehend. I am saying that the people that you claim to have had conversations with all share the same views as Chrystia Freeland (grand-daughter of Nazi propagandist, Michael Chomiak) who considers her Nazi collaborating fascist grand-father to be a freedom fighter for liberal rules based international order;
  "our own parents and grandparents—fought and died to establish a rules-based international order during and after the Second World War.”

   Freeland’s Ukrainian grandfather on her mother’s side, Michael Chomiak, did nothing of the sort. During the War, he edited Krakivski Visti, a Nazi propaganda rag in occupied Krakow that was printed on a press confiscated from a Jewish newspaper.

    You share the views of fascists.

[ngb1066]

I now realise that I have answered my own question as to how many everyday people from behind the Iron curtain you and NGB have met. The answer is likely zero, because if you had got to known such people and heard of their experiences, you simply would not hold the views that you do.

I have in fact met quite a few people who lived in the USSR and other eastern European countries you describe using the Cold War term "iron curtain".  I also knew people from the UK who regularly visited those countries and in some cases worked there.  I also know people who had a lot of experience of China, Vietnam and Cuba.  I have had many interesting discussions over many years about life and politics in those countries, with positive and negative aspects openly discussed.  It was nothing like the simplistic caricature you present as part of your CIA inspired propaganda.

[ngb1066]

   
Maybe ngb can trump your "first hand experience" of the Soviet Union when it turns out he once had some Polish builders in and he knows a Russian guy at work.

I thought it was a secret?  Who told you gringo?  This is a serious security breach and there will be consequences!

[nugnug]

ive met  mostly poles  and hungrians  who hated the comunist system  i met an east german who thought it was great and a czech who  dident like it at the time  but on reflection thought it wasnt that bad

[David1819]

    Learn to read and comprehend. I am saying that the people that you claim to have had conversations with all share the same views as Chrystia Freeland (grand-daughter of Nazi propagandist, Michael Chomiak) who considers her Nazi collaborating fascist grand-father to be a freedom fighter for liberal rules based international order;
  "our own parents and grandparents—fought and died to establish a rules-based international order during and after the Second World War.”

   Freeland’s Ukrainian grandfather on her mother’s side, Michael Chomiak, did nothing of the sort. During the War, he edited Krakivski Visti, a Nazi propaganda rag in occupied Krakow that was printed on a press confiscated from a Jewish newspaper.

    You share the views of fascists.

Right, so my Jewish forefather's from the USSR would consider a Nazi collaborating fascist a freedom fighter. That would explain why I can find my family surname in documents naming detainees at Auschwitz concentration camp. It all makes sense now.

[David1819]

David, I hope you have booby trapped your Nebraskan homestead, in case any sleeper cell Russians are instructed to pay a visit.

I'm in Moscow right now.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iQdx8SSVg_U

[gringo]

ive met  mostly poles  and hungrians  who hated the comunist system  i met an east german who thought it was great and a czech who  dident like it at the time  but on reflection thought it wasnt that bad

   

I have in fact met quite a few people who lived in the USSR and other eastern European countries you describe using the Cold War term "iron curtain".  I also knew people from the UK who regularly visited those countries and in some cases worked there.  I also know people who had a lot of experience of China, Vietnam and Cuba.  I have had many interesting discussions over many years about life and politics in those countries, with positive and negative aspects openly discussed.  It was nothing like the simplistic caricature you present as part of your CIA inspired propaganda.

    Some have good recollections-some bad. Probably everyone has met people from former USSR. David mixes in very partisan circles. Despite this "knowledge" he has yet to post any information about USSR. Most of what he post is idiotic gifs, youtube videos by amateurish, ill informed, war porn addicted hacks and assessments by obvious intel fronts such as Bellingcat and ISW (institute for the Study of War). He obviously didn't learn much "first hand" knowledge.

   

[Steve_uk]

The nature of evil..https://youtu.be/t--pNU9ZfVE

[gringo]

Right, so my Jewish forefather's from the USSR would consider a Nazi collaborating fascist a freedom fighter. That would explain why I can find my family surname in documents naming detainees at Auschwitz concentration camp. It all makes sense now.

   I would hope not. You, however, are currently supporting the forces who consider Stepan Bandera, who was a "Nazi collaborating fascist", to be a freedom fighter though. This is undeniable. Bandera ideology is whitewashed by our media and governments.
    Those in power most responsible for the provocations against Russia are the descendants and spiritual heirs of the Nazis.

    Victoria Nuland (Under secretary of State for political affairs and a leading architect of the war)also has Jewish grandparents from Ukraine, but that fact doesn't mean that she isn't a war-mongering fascist supporting criminal. She is the one who expressed early in the hostilities that she was concerned that Russia would get control of their "biological research facilities" in Ukraine. She is steeped in war mongering throughout her career. See link below;

http://www.ronpaulinstitute.org/archives/featured-articles/2021/february/11/why-victoria-nuland-is-dangerous-and-should-not-be-confirmed/

     Her husband Robert Kagan, also with Jewish grandparents from the former USSR, is also an anti-Russian war hawk, currently supporting Nazi worshipping fascists
    Kagan's  and Nuland's sister in law is Kimberly Kagan spouse of Frederick Kagan.
    Kimberley Kagan, along with retired US general Jack Keane are the founders of ISW(Instiute for the Study of War). This "institute" is nothing more than a front for war-mongering NATO criminals. Quoted and relied upon for "information" by our media and the likes of David, as if it is some neutral legitimate institute.
    All with the same backgrounds. The ethnicity of their forebears does not give them a free pass on holding fascist ideology now. Nor does yours.
   

[David1819]

   I would hope not. You, however, are currently supporting the forces who consider Stepan Bandera, who was a "Nazi collaborating fascist", to be a freedom fighter though. This is undeniable. Bandera ideology is whitewashed by our media and governments.
    Those in power most responsible for the provocations against Russia are the descendants and spiritual heirs of the Nazis.

The people you bring up do not represent the whole of Ukraine. A country full of Nazi's does not elect a Jewish comedian into office with a 73% landslide. Pay a visit to Neo-Nazi forums and see what they have to say about Zelensky.

Meanwhile, Below is Dmitry Utkin. Retired Russian military and now in the Wagner group. He has the Nazi SS symbols tattooed on his shoulders and a Nazi Eagle tattoo on his chest. I wonder what his ideology is?

If you want to bring up bad apples by finding a few Nazis and then apply their views to the entire country or side they are fighting for, two can play at that game.

[gringo]

                              The ISW (Institute for the Study of War

Dr. Kimberly Kagan founded ISW in May 2007, as U.S. forces undertook a daring new counterinsurgency strategy to reverse the grim security situation on the ground in Iraq . Frustrated with the prevailing lack of accurate information documenting developments on the ground in Iraq and the detrimental effect of biased reporting on policymakers, Dr. Kagan established ISW to provide real-time, independent, and open-source analysis of ongoing military operations and insurgent attacks in Iraq. General Jack Keane (U.S. Army, Ret.), the Chairman of ISW’s board, also played a central role in developing the intellectual foundation for this change of strategy in Iraq, and supported the formation of the Institute in 2007.

   The above is from the ISW-themselves-from their home page.
   For those incapable of reading between the lines (no names), below is the translation into straight talking truth-prior to translation into the spin above.

    ISW spin; as U.S. forces undertook a daring new counterinsurgency strategy to reverse the grim security situation on the ground in Iraq .
    Translation; U.S. Forces undertook brutal and criminally punitive crimes in order to quell citizen resistance to their brutal and savage invasion.
    ISW spin; Frustrated with the lack of accurate information documenting developments on the ground in Iraq
    Translation; Frustrated with the accurate information documenting US/NATO crimes and brutality on the ground...
     ISW spin; Dr. Kagan established ISW to provide real-time, independent, and open-source analysis of ongoing military operations
     Translation; ISW was established by Kagan in collaboration with US military to put a pretend neutral front by creating an independent sounding direct mouth-piece.

     

[gringo]

The people you bring up do not represent the whole of Ukraine. A country full of Nazi's does not elect a Jewish comedian into office with a 73% landslide. Pay a visit to Neo-Nazi forums and see what they have to say about Zelensky.

Meanwhile, Below is Dmitry Utkin. Retired Russian military and now in the Wagner group. He has the Nazi SS symbols tattooed on his shoulders and a Nazi Eagle tattoo on his chest. I wonder what his ideology is?

If you want to bring up bad apples by finding a few Nazis and then apply their views to the entire country or side they are fighting for, two can play at that game.

   These people are at the top of the decision making processes of their countries. Nuland, Kagan, Freeland. The list goes on. They are supporting fascists now and calling them anti-fascists. They have whitewashed Azov and regard them as cuddly freedom fighting heroes.
    Their views apply to the entire country when they are driving the aggression.

[ngb1066]

The nature of evil..https://youtu.be/t--pNU9ZfVE

He was a very reactionary and seriously unbalanced character.  Some of his views were very hard to acknowledge.