Author Topic: Russia - worrying?  (Read 362663 times)

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Offline ngb1066

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #2325 on: January 24, 2023, 10:08:PM »
Joining into a non-aggression pact with Nazis. Negotiating to potentially become part of an alliance with Nazi's and showing approval for Hitler's night of the long knives, is not an entity that "opposed fascism and the Nazis throughout".

Nor does such entity attract fascist admirers. Such as Francis Yockey.

https://dergipark.org.tr/en/pub/rad/issue/23278/248454

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Francis_Parker_Yockey

You are seriously out of your depth.  You have no idea whatsoever. 


Offline ngb1066

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #2326 on: January 24, 2023, 10:09:PM »
    Barely any, if any, of David's posts on this thread have had any point other than childish trolling. His only point seems to be to run interference. He ruins the thread with his name calling, flag waving, meme laden idiocy. Never anything to add or any attempt at serious discussion. By a country mile-his posts on this thread are the least informative or interesting and most childish of all who post on it.
   

I agree entirely.


Offline Roch

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #2327 on: January 24, 2023, 10:12:PM »
Should Putin have pummelled housing estates, towns and cities? I think he lost any hope of any kind of moral argument for invading when Russia changed tactics. It's almost as if the Russians spat their dummy out because Ukraine didn't fold in the way it was supposed to right at the beginning. Brutal tactics bombarding dwellings. Turning whole apartment blocks in to burned out shells. That's my take on it. I think he's done a truly stupid thing for Russia in terms of global balance of power. The Americans must be creaming themselves. Pardon for using that expression but it looks to me that Russia is a shadow of what it was before Putin invaded.
« Last Edit: January 24, 2023, 10:13:PM by Roch »

Offline gringo

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #2328 on: January 24, 2023, 10:57:PM »
Should Putin have pummelled housing estates, towns and cities? I think he lost any hope of any kind of moral argument for invading when Russia changed tactics. It's almost as if the Russians spat their dummy out because Ukraine didn't fold in the way it was supposed to right at the beginning. Brutal tactics bombarding dwellings. Turning whole apartment blocks in to burned out shells. That's my take on it. I think he's done a truly stupid thing for Russia in terms of global balance of power. The Americans must be creaming themselves. Pardon for using that expression but it looks to me that Russia is a shadow of what it was before Putin invaded.
    None of that happened though, Roch. Former Presidential adviser Arestovych statements over the last few days have made pretty clear the lies being told by Ukraine/NATO and their compliant media. Outside of western media, these accusations don't exist.
     Arestovych admitted the lie about the Russian missile hitting an apartment block, owning up to it being Ukrainian air defence. This is the case every single time. Arestovych has had enough of the obvious lies and is openly calling them out. Russia do not, unlike Ukraine and NATO, target civilian populations. This is outright projection.
     Numbers, always a good guide, give a lie to the Russian brutality-targeting civilians projection from western propaganda outlets. Reuters (itself western propaganda) gave a number of 9,000 civilian deaths since the "invasion". Most of those, by any reasonable inference, would be of citizens loyal to Russia. Ukrainians have targeted civilians from the beginning. Terror being the age old tool of Nazis. Nazis gonna Nazi! It is NATO/Ukraine who run scorched earth policies.
     Take a look at the reconstruction of Mariupol by Russia, in a matter of months during hostilities, and then find me a city destroyed by NATO after "reconstruction".
     It is NATO who deliberately target civilians. They even film it-give it a name(Shock and Awe) and present it as entertainment. They have forfeited any right to be seen as honest witnesses to anything.
    Far from Russia being a "shadow of what it was"-Russia has demonstrated to the rest of the world that they are the pre-eminent world military power. It is NATO, in the eyes of the world, who are a shadow of what they once were.
    The world is at an epoch in history. The world order is being upended and no amount of western desperation can prevent it.   
    NATO bet the house on defeating Russia with unprecedented sanctions, propaganda and aggression. They believed their own propaganda, some still do, that Russia is weak. They lost the bet, we are watching that play out now. The result is not in doubt and nor are the trials for western war criminals.

Offline gringo

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #2329 on: January 25, 2023, 12:51:AM »
Should Putin have pummelled housing estates, towns and cities? I think he lost any hope of any kind of moral argument for invading when Russia changed tactics. It's almost as if the Russians spat their dummy out because Ukraine didn't fold in the way it was supposed to right at the beginning. Brutal tactics bombarding dwellings. Turning whole apartment blocks in to burned out shells. That's my take on it. I think he's done a truly stupid thing for Russia in terms of global balance of power. The Americans must be creaming themselves. Pardon for using that expression but it looks to me that Russia is a shadow of what it was before Putin invaded.
   From the same outlets, using the same sources that brought you;

   1)  A "Nurse" testifying in the UNSC that Iraqi troops threw babies from incubators(didn't happen-wasn't even a nurse but the Ambassador's daughter)
   2)  Gaddafi giving his soldiers Viagra to commit rapes(invented)
   3)  Saddam has weapons of mass destruction (lies)
   4)  Assad launching chemical weapon attacks on civilians(projection)
   5)  Russia launched an "unprovoked" invasion
   6)  Need I go on...

   The unsurpassed in history criminal brutality of the NATO war machine over the last decades is never called out by this media  They see no targeting of civilians by NATO ever. There have been no calls for those countries responsible for Fallujah/Raqqa/Mosul... to be banned from all international competition because of their war crimes. If a journalist does see these crimes, the same media then turn a blind eye as that journalist is jailed and persecuted(Assange, Craig Murray). They are the proverbial 3 wise monkeys. That is what their job is-misinforming anyone unfortunate enough to still take a blind bit of notice of people who have publicly demonstrated that they lie on behalf of power.
    You have surely noticed by now that anyone willing to speak truth to power is sidelined, censored and criminalised if they are too brave. All that is left is the soul-less dregs who are more than willing to "tell lies on behalf of power"
    Why do you imagine that their "reporting" on Ukraine is any more reliable than their previous "work"?
    They are paid stenographers. Their paymasters are the biggest criminal organisation in history.
   
« Last Edit: January 25, 2023, 01:04:AM by gringo »

Offline David1819

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #2330 on: January 25, 2023, 02:57:AM »
    Barely any, if any, of David's posts on this thread have had any point other than childish trolling. His only point seems to be to run interference. He ruins the thread with his name calling, flag waving, meme laden idiocy. Never anything to add or any attempt at serious discussion. By a country mile-his posts on this thread are the least informative or interesting and most childish of all who post on it.
   

For someone who made up claims about CCTV on Skripals front door,  posting links to the works of a convicted pedophile and paleo conservative creationists to support your claims. Claiming NATO are behind certain things that the Russians themselves don't deny doing. You are in no position to criticize me. If my posts are " least informative" then I wonder what that makes yours?  ???




Offline gringo

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #2331 on: January 25, 2023, 03:41:AM »
For someone who made up claims about CCTV on Skripals front door,  posting links to the works of a convicted pedophile and paleo conservative creationists to support your claims. Claiming NATO are behind certain things that the Russians themselves don't deny doing. You are in no position to criticize me. If my posts are " least informative" then I wonder what that makes yours?  ???
   Thank you for proving the point.

Barely any, if any, of David's posts on this thread have had any point other than childish trolling. His only point seems to be to run interference. He ruins the thread with his name calling, flag waving, meme laden idiocy. Never anything to add or any attempt at serious discussion. By a country mile-his posts on this thread are the least informative or interesting and most childish of all who post on it.
   Above is the rest of the post;
   If the cap fits, David.

   To address your name calling-running interference-flag waving idiocy. Not to mention your lack of attempt at serious discussion or passing on any interesting information.

    Scott Ritter is a former US Marine officer and later a UN weapons inspector. If you fail to see that he is an informed voice then more fool you.
    Andrei Raevsky(dismissed by you as a "paleo conservative creationist")-you pathetic child- is in fact a former military analyst with Swiss intelligence and then the UN Institute for Disarmament Research. His blog The Vineyard of The Saker is one of the best resources available for intelligent and informed geopolitical analysis. Plenty of excellent analysis from writers such as Pepe Escobar, Dmitri Orlov + many more. It's way over your head, David. Link to the Saker below;

https://thesaker.is/

    Your favourite source-Bellingcat(aka Eliot Higgins) is a former underwear salesman from Leicester who gained his knowledge of weapons from video games. His "fake citizen Open Source Intelligence analysis" is so obviously a MI6 front that it is a joke. His analysis always, by massive coincidence, agrees with whatever MI6 want you to believe. And anyway, as stated, his background gives him no expertise in the subjects he comments on. The media trumpeting of his "investigations" also give you a big clue as to who he really is.
    Ritter and Raevsky are experts and independent.
    As are commentators such as Colonel Douglas MacGregor, Andrei Martyanov.
     
   
   
   

Offline David1819

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #2332 on: January 25, 2023, 04:00:AM »
You are seriously out of your depth.  You have no idea whatsoever.

Half of my great grandparents (the Jewish side of my family) were from the USSR and one was on Soviet of Workers Deputies in Smolensk at one point. I listened to what my Grandmother had to say.

A childhood friend of mine had two grandparents from the Ukrainian SSR. I listened to what they had to say.

I have worked with several people who grew up in Yugoslavia, The Latvian SSR and the Polish People's Republic. I spoke with them a lot.

The Latvian guy once told me about the time he was a child and he had a poster of the band KISS on his wall, one day the KGB came into his room ripped it down. Now, a poster might no seem much but that was a rarity he couldn't have replaced. His story left an impression on me.

What first hand experiences from the USSR have you come across?

« Last Edit: January 25, 2023, 04:01:AM by David1819 »

Offline David1819

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #2333 on: January 25, 2023, 04:21:AM »
   Thank you for proving the point.

Barely any, if any, of David's posts on this thread have had any point other than childish trolling. His only point seems to be to run interference. He ruins the thread with his name calling, flag waving, meme laden idiocy. Never anything to add or any attempt at serious discussion. By a country mile-his posts on this thread are the least informative or interesting and most childish of all who post on it.
   Above is the rest of the post;
   If the cap fits, David.

   To address your name calling-running interference-flag waving idiocy. Not to mention your lack of attempt at serious discussion or passing on any interesting information.

    Scott Ritter is a former US Marine officer and later a UN weapons inspector. If you fail to see that he is an informed voice then more fool you.
    Andrei Raevsky(dismissed by you as a "paleo conservative creationist")-you pathetic child- is in fact a former military analyst with Swiss intelligence and then the UN Institute for Disarmament Research. His blog The Vineyard of The Saker is one of the best resources available for intelligent and informed geopolitical analysis. Plenty of excellent analysis from writers such as Pepe Escobar, Dmitri Orlov + many more. It's way over your head, David. Link to the Saker below;

https://thesaker.is/

    Your favourite source-Bellingcat(aka Eliot Higgins) is a former underwear salesman from Leicester who gained his knowledge of weapons from video games. His "fake citizen Open Source Intelligence analysis" is so obviously a MI6 front that it is a joke. His analysis always, by massive coincidence, agrees with whatever MI6 want you to believe. And anyway, as stated, his background gives him no expertise in the subjects he comments on. The media trumpeting of his "investigations" also give you a big clue as to who he really is.
    Ritter and Raevsky are experts and independent.
    As are commentators such as Colonel Douglas MacGregor, Andrei Martyanov.
   

Ritter declared in February that Russia will not invade Ukraine. After the invasion, Ritter said Ukraine will fall in a week. Ritter then got suspended from Twitter after claiming that the National Police of Ukraine is responsible for the Bucha massacre.

So why is a former U.S. Marine Corps intelligence officer peddling the line of Russian propaganda?
The most likely answer is that for a repeated sex offender (involving children) that has served time in prison, you have trouble finding employment.

Ritter works for and appears on Russia Today. And there is Russian money involved here. Everyone has a price.
« Last Edit: January 25, 2023, 04:38:AM by David1819 »

Offline gringo

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #2334 on: January 25, 2023, 04:23:AM »
Half of my great grandparents (the Jewish side of my family) were from the USSR and one was on Soviet of Workers Deputies in Smolensk at one point. I listened to what my Grandmother had to say.

A childhood friend of mine had two grandparents from the Ukrainian SSR. I listened to what they had to say.

I have worked with several people who grew up in Yugoslavia, The Latvian SSR and the Polish People's Republic. I spoke with them a lot.

The Latvian guy once told me about the time he was a child and he had a poster of the band KISS on his wall, one day the KGB came into his room ripped it down. Now, a poster might no seem much but that was a rarity he couldn't have replaced. His story left an impression on me.

What first hand experiences from the USSR have you come across?
   Brilliant, you have got the double and proved ngb's point as well as mine in your last post. "First hand experience"- you are unintentionally hilarious.
     You "listened to what your grandmother had to say". Did she pass this on from your great grandparents?
 A childhood friend had grandparents from the Ukraine SSR. You were a child and yet you still count this alleged talk with the grandparents of your friend as part of your "first hand" experience of knowledge of the USSR.
     You have "worked with people from Yugoslavia, Latvia and Poland" and "talked with them".
     It sounds to me as if you have a very well rounded and informed view of the Soviet Union, David. What gibberish-you prove your idiocy with every post.
     Maybe ngb can trump your "first hand experience" of the Soviet Union when it turns out he once had some Polish builders in and he knows a Russian guy at work.

Offline David1819

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #2335 on: January 25, 2023, 05:03:AM »
You "listened to what your grandmother had to say". Did she pass this on from your great grandparents?

Correct.

A childhood friend had grandparents from the Ukraine SSR. You were a child and yet you still count this alleged talk with the grandparents of your friend as part of your "first hand" experience of knowledge of the USSR.

No, I actually spoke with this grandparents.

You have "worked with people from Yugoslavia, Latvia and Poland" and "talked with them".

Correct. You obtain information from people by talking to them. Asking them about their experiences involves talking and listening. You should try it some day, you might learn something.

So, how many ordinary people from the USSR/Warsaw pact you ever met and learned from their experiences?
« Last Edit: January 25, 2023, 05:07:AM by David1819 »

Offline gringo

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #2336 on: January 25, 2023, 12:48:PM »
Correct.

No, I actually spoke with this grandparents.

Correct. You obtain information from people by talking to them. Asking them about their experiences involves talking and listening. You should try it some day, you might learn something.

So, how many ordinary people from the USSR/Warsaw pact you ever met and learned from their experiences?
   You are full of shit. The entirety of your knowledge displayed on this thread would fit on the back of a standard stamp and still leave room for the Lord's Prayer. Conversations as a child with your gran, a friends gran and some work colleagues!?- explains your complete ignorance if that is the source of your "knowledge".
    All you do is post memes, ad-hom attacks and misinformation. Crap about lack of flushing toilets. Is that what they told you? What did you ask? You have displayed zero insight or knowledge in the entirety of this thread. Everyone knows people from the former USSR-it isn't the basis for a knowledge base of geopolitics.
    These conversations that you allegedly had to give you your "extensive!?" knowledge of the USSR cannot have been much more than some bitchfest about "commies" and "Stalin" because that is all you post. You know nothing and prove it yourself with your insult-laden, meme heavy, flag waving childish nonsense.
     
     

Offline nugnug

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #2337 on: January 25, 2023, 01:41:PM »
when we have died in a nuclear war will it really matter.

Offline David1819

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #2338 on: January 25, 2023, 01:52:PM »
   You are full of shit. The entirety of your knowledge displayed on this thread would fit on the back of a standard stamp and still leave room for the Lord's Prayer. Conversations as a child with your gran, a friends gran and some work colleagues!?- explains your complete ignorance if that is the source of your "knowledge".
    All you do is post memes, ad-hom attacks and misinformation. Crap about lack of flushing toilets. Is that what they told you? What did you ask? You have displayed zero insight or knowledge in the entirety of this thread. Everyone knows people from the former USSR-it isn't the basis for a knowledge base of geopolitics.
    These conversations that you allegedly had to give you your "extensive!?" knowledge of the USSR cannot have been much more than some bitchfest about "commies" and "Stalin" because that is all you post. You know nothing and prove it yourself with your insult-laden, meme heavy, flag waving childish nonsense.
     
   

Getting salty now are we?

So, you decided to form a view on a highly censored and concealed society, based not on the experiences with those who lived in it as everyday people. But instead you based it primarily on its governments propaganda made for foreign consumption?  :))  :))


I now realise that I have answered my own question as to how many everyday people from behind the Iron curtain you and NGB have met. The answer is likely zero, because if you had got to known such people and heard of their experiences, you simply would not hold the views that you do.




Offline gringo

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #2339 on: January 25, 2023, 02:32:PM »
Getting salty now are we?

So, you decided to form a view on a highly censored and concealed society, based not on the experiences with those who lived in it as everyday people. But instead you based it primarily on its governments propaganda made for foreign consumption?  :))  :))


I now realise that I have answered my own question as to how many everyday people from behind the Iron curtain you and NGB have met. The answer is likely zero, because if you had got to known such people and heard of their experiences, you simply would not hold the views that you do.
   Based on your childhood interactions with a gran who never lived there but heard from her parents and some mates grandparents-you believe that to be extensive first hand knowledge of the Soviet Union.
     Chrystia Freeland, the Deputy PM of Canada-home apparently to the largest Ukrainian diaspora outside of Russia is of similar background. Anyway, Freeland is very outspoken against Russia and a leading voice for arming Ukraine. She is very much a war-hawk and the likely next PM.
     Much of her hatred for all things Russia no doubt comes from her own grandparents who she has spoken very fondly of. See below;

    On Jan. 26, 2022, in the midst of Russia’s preparations to invade Ukraine, Canada’s Deputy Prime Minister Chrystia Freeland issued a statement outlining why Canada—home to the largest Ukrainian diaspora outside Russia—would support Ukraine unconditionally, outlining a Manichean view of a “struggle between democracy and authoritarianism.” “Canadians—our own parents and grandparents—fought and died,” she continued, “to establish a rules-based international order during and after the Second World War.”

Freeland’s Ukrainian grandfather on her mother’s side, Michael Chomiak, did nothing of the sort. During the War, he edited Krakivski Visti, a Nazi propaganda rag in occupied Krakow that was printed on a press confiscated from a Jewish newspaper. Freeland, of course, is not her grandfather, nor is she responsible for his actions. But she is responsible for bringing him up at every opportunity to portray him as a liberal democrat who profoundly influenced her politics.


    Full article here;
https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/news/articles/chrystia-freeland-needs-to-come-clean-about-her-nazi-collaborationist-grandfather

    The backgrounds of many of the current war-hawks have similar interesting backgrounds. Direct descendants of the fascists from WW2 who were welcomed into the west. Their grandchildren now wielding power and attempting to finish what their fascist grandparents started. Strange bedfellows you keep.