Russia - worrying?

[gringo]

This is all bullshit.

You spout this spiel against NATO. You're a champagne socialist version of a NATO aggressor. You would be the first to moan if you lived under these oppressive regimes that NATO sought to change. You live a democracy. A country where we can speak what we like. Choose to believe in what we like. Wear what we like, sleep with whom we like and within constraints do what we like. You are putting US UK in the warcrime barriers with people like Saddam. You are so far out. You don't even know it. America, The UK are democracies. You know this. It's junior me even stating it out to you.

The Iraq war of 2003 was a depressing scenario. The Bush administration spoke in 2001 of an axis of evil between NK, Iran and Iraq. I didn't believe it at first. I never believe he had weapons of mass destruction. America claimed he did. None was found l. but I knew full well he had be disposed.

In an ideal world. I'd have preferred that a squad was sent in pre 2003 undercover and arrested Saddam and brought him before the Hague. I think that would have been the best option. And it would have saved a lot of bloodshed. Preferably he should have been disposed of in 1991. Not subjected to US sanctions. Because however crippling. The people of Iraq ultimately suffered and he still clung into power in the 12 year interim.

Saddam was a tyrant. A man who killed his own people. An appalling human rights abuse record. A man who invaded a neighbour to pifler monetary assets. He was a pillager. Iraq had long since wanted democracy. But was unsure how to go about it. It new no other from Faisal 2, Abdul quasim, then the Baathists.

It was a police state. Forced disappearances, murders, torture, hangings. Any opinion other than what Saddam wanted was punishable by death. Do you know Iraqi regular citizens could not even hold a passport?

Give me Blair anyday of the week. You don't know you are born

    Champagne socialist?
     Champagne? I'm more of a Marijuana Marxist, a cannabis communist if you like!

[gringo]

     NATO's crimes as demonstrated, in terms of victims, destruction, torture (Abu Ghraib and Guantanamo plus various "black sites") are magnitudes greater than Saddam's and still ongoing. By any objective metric Saddam's crimes are a fraction of the criminality of NATO.
     Saddam is long dead. NATO crimes, 377,000 and counting dead in Yemen, are occurring now. Why do you have no concern about that but are furious about decades old crimes of far less magnitude?
      Rattling on about the brutality of a long dead Saddam, to avoid talking about the brutality that you support.

[David1819]

    Champagne socialist?
     Champagne? I'm more of a Marijuana Marxist, a cannabis communist if you like!

That certainly explains a lot. Over exposure to mind altering substances.

[lookout]

I'll stick with plain old fags I think,lolol. No alcohol.

[ILB]

     NATO's crimes as demonstrated, in terms of victims, destruction, torture (Abu Ghraib and Guantanamo plus various "black sites") are magnitudes greater than Saddam's and still ongoing. By any objective metric Saddam's crimes are a fraction of the criminality of NATO.
     Saddam is long dead. NATO crimes, 377,000 and counting dead in Yemen, are occurring now. Why do you have no concern about that but are furious about decades old crimes of far less magnitude?
      Rattling on about the brutality of a long dead Saddam, to avoid talking about the brutality that you support.

Nobody supports brutality.

[ILB]

You supported the regime of Saddam Hussein

[gringo]

Nobody supports brutality.

    You have already unequivocally stated that you support all NATO invasions. That is not me paraphrasing you. "I back every NATO led invasion entirely." Are you suggesting that the invasions and consequences of these invasions weren't brutal? Yemen? not brutal? Iraq, falluja, Abu Ghraib? not brutal? Afghanistan? Guantanamo? Torture sites? not brutal? Millions dead? Many more millions displaced? Illness and hunger killing many more?
     You imagine that your support of these invasions doesn't, by any reasonable inference, also support the brutality unleashed by them?
     Of course you support brutality, you are just too cowardly to admit it so you hide behind faux concern.

     It is incoherent to unequivocally support "every NATO led invasion entirely" yet simultaneously claim that you don't support brutality.

    You supported the regime of Saddam Hussein

    No I didn't support Saddam Hussein, or any other Iraqi politician, leader. Why make this up? There is not a single statement of mine anywhere that supports your idiotic claim.

[ILB]

Do you believe Saddam Hussein was right to be disposed?

It's a simple question

[ILB]

Nobody supports brutality.

    You have already unequivocally stated that you support all NATO invasions. That is not me paraphrasing you. "I back every NATO led invasion entirely." Are you suggesting that the invasions and consequences of these invasions weren't brutal? Yemen? not brutal? Iraq, falluja, Abu Ghraib? not brutal? Afghanistan? Guantanamo? Torture sites? not brutal? Millions dead? Many more millions displaced? Illness and hunger killing many more?
     You imagine that your support of these invasions doesn't, by any reasonable inference, also support the brutality unleashed by them?
     Of course you support brutality, you are just too cowardly to admit it so you hide behind faux concern.

     It is incoherent to unequivocally support "every NATO led invasion entirely" yet simultaneously claim that you don't support brutality.

    You supported the regime of Saddam Hussein

    No I didn't support Saddam Hussein, or any other Iraqi politician, leader. Why make this up? There is not a single statement of mine anywhere that supports your idiotic claim.

I support NATO invasions in view of ridding despot evil dictators.

[ILB]

In 1991 after kuwait the US backed NATO invasion has more than ample power to go direct to Baghdad and remove Saddam and his two wanker sons. But they chose not to and instead used no fly zones and crippled the Iraqi economy to drown him out. He survived another 12 years. Which is much more than he ought

[ILB]

Saddam invaded his wealthy neighbour his tiny neighbour to pillage the little country. With limited military defence. To pillage its vast wealth. To help himself out because he was crippled with debt via the Iran Iraq war.

[lookout]

I was against the hunting and slaying of Saddam Hussein. What he did in his own country was his business and nobody should have interfered. Interfering causes wars.

What have we suffered since 2003 ? Terrorist attacks and a noticable suppression of our freedom by allowing many terrorists into this country ! This is my main concern as I've watched 13,000 illegal immigrants coming from God knows where, into this country, assisted by our own armed forces ?? What are they fleeing from when they've passed many countries, including France, where there are NO wars etc ? Then are smuggled here, truly insane. Putin must be laughing his head of at such a weak country as ours.

I'm not worried about other countries or how they're run, it's this country which concerns me most when we have to kow-tow to those who don't even have passports or papers ! It makes me sick. MP's know this is going on yet do nothing about it. Watch "TW Media Online" and weep at the loss of this country !!
I fear for the futures of my great-grandchildren !

[ILB]

I was against the hunting and slaying of Saddam Hussein. What he did in his own country was his business and nobody should have interfered. Interfering causes wars.

What have we suffered since 2003 ? Terrorist attacks and a noticable suppression of our freedom by allowing many terrorists into this country ! This is my main concern as I've watched 13,000 illegal immigrants coming from God knows where, into this country, assisted by our own armed forces ?? What are they fleeing from when they've passed many countries, including France, where there are NO wars etc ? Then are smuggled here, truly insane. Putin must be laughing his head of at such a weak country as ours.

I'm not worried about other countries or how they're run, it's this country which concerns me most when we have to kow-tow to those who don't even have passports or papers ! It makes me sick. MP's know this is going on yet do nothing about it. Watch "TW Media Online" and weep at the loss of this country !!
I fear for the futures of my great-grandchildren !

We had to get rid of Saddam. Iraq needed the foundations of a democracy.

If we hadn't we would have got qusay Hussein ( the heir apparent was originally Uday but he was deemed to be unsuitable by Saddam due to his erratic and vile ways) ( which tells you all you need to know)

Saddam was lucky to get a trial and a fair hearing. Justice which he denied for many many others

[David1819]

In 1991 after kuwait the US backed NATO invasion has more than ample power to go direct to Baghdad and remove Saddam and his two wanker sons. But they chose not to and instead used no fly zones and crippled the Iraqi economy to drown him out. He survived another 12 years. Which is much more than he ought

It was a UN coalition that involved Bangladesh, Saudi Arabia, Syria and Egypt also.

[ILB]

It was a UN coalition that involved Bangladesh, Saudi Arabia, Syria and Egypt also.

Apologies your absolutely correct David