Author Topic: Russia - worrying?  (Read 365343 times)

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Offline David1819

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #660 on: September 25, 2021, 09:24:PM »
David, this is pretty accurate  ::)

A Conspiratard is someone who believes in stupid conspiracy theories despite overwhelming evidence to the contrary and generally lacks critical thinking skills.

https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=conspiratarded

Offline gringo

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #661 on: September 26, 2021, 01:45:AM »
Do you believe two decorated GRU veterans used fake names and fake passports just so they could fly over here to see Salisbury Cathedral one weekend as they claim?
    That was post 645, David.

     In my reply in the very next post, as I have patiently explained to you, it could be inferred quite easily that no I didn't believe that, but you didn't infer anything and repeated the question again.

     From my reply in post 650 which you have quoted but obviously not read/comprehended.

     "Note the word "either" at the end of that sentence. Your question was answered at the very beginning. To be clear, although it was already to those who understand inference, No."
   
     Later on from the same post,
    My initial response was just to write the single word, "no", but I thought I would take the opportunity afforded by your dumb and irrelevant question to pose some better ones and signpost the way to Salisbury resident and blogger Rob Slane's excellent website and archive of the ever evolving story.
    Again from the same post, 
   There you go, David. Answering No to your stupid question has zero effect on my "warped world view"

    At the end of the same post,

     By answering the way I did (which means no in case it isn't clear enough still for David with his comprehension problems)

 
     That post 650, was explaining to you, whilst deliberately piss taking admittedly, that I had already answered No by inference in post 646. The question was answered another 4 times (4 times!) explicitly in 650 as shown above.

     I asked if you were really that thick or piss taking(655) when you asked again in 653. Your reply was to ask again(657), at least confirming that it wasn't a piss take, or so I inferred.
     You add more questions when you can't even comprehend the answer to your first.
     To be clear, before I move on from your state approved propaganda;

     Your second question, if you could comprehend, was rendered irrelevant by the oft repeated answer to the first, also oft repeated, question. ie. the reason they didn't book a Cathedral tour was because they didn't go to visit the Cathedral, duh! Didn't need to ask, did you.

     The reasons for visiting Salisbury is unknowable, but as I posited some time ago in reply to you on this thread, it is likely that there was some meeting/drop set up between Skripal and the two Russians. The available evidence of the Russians visits to Salisbury and their movements are way more suggestive of this being the motive rather than some bizarre cack handed nerve agent attack. The Novichok story should be too idiotic for anyone to believe. Window shopping after a clear act of war and being booked on a regular flight. There is no evidence to even suggest that they went to Salisbury to smear Novichok on a door handle that would stand up in a talking shop, never mind an impartial court. Regardless, it is for those making the accusations to have credible evidence before any alibi is needed. 

    https://www.theblogmire.com/the-claim-that-cctv-shows-the-salisbury-poisoning-suspects-in-the-vicinity-of-mr-skripals-house-is-deeply-misleading/
   https://www.theblogmire.com/cctv-footage-shows-petrov-boshirov-close-to-the-skripals-only-its-not-at-mr-skripals-house/ 

     A couple from the archives of the Blogmire. showing the CCTV evidence for the contradictory idiocy that it is (which now has the highest accolade available on this forum). David's conspiritard label which is confirmation enough for everyone else to know it must be good.

     The CCTV coverage at the Skripal home, looking back, was assumed. He lived on the same road as his "D noticed" MI6 handler, Pablo Miller. It is a reasonable assumption made by many that Skripal and Miller's homes both had security(given their profession).
     The officially and unofficially disclosed CCTV and stills evidence does not in any way support the wild claims.
     Why was the roof and entire roof space replaced under view obscuring screens by workers in Hazmat due to supposed contamination? but not the door?
     Why was the bottle, supposedly found by Charlie Rowley, in unopened Cellophane wrap?
     Where is the opened bottle? Elsewhere? Did they have a cellophane wrapping machine with them?
     Do you consider it plausible that Yulia and Sergei both succumbed simultaneously but 4 hours after supposedly contacting a deadly nerve agent?
     Given their different genders, ages and weight, is it more likely that whatever they succumbed to was applied at the bench where they both, simultaneously collapsed?
     Why no word from Sergei, even to his mother, who he previously contacted weekly?
     Why only one stage managed appearance from Yulia? Where are they? Why no contact despite Yulia making clear in the one time she has spoken that she intended to return?
     What are the UK gov hiding?
     Are the Skripals political prisoners?

   
 
« Last Edit: September 26, 2021, 01:47:AM by gringo »

Offline gringo

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #662 on: September 26, 2021, 02:55:AM »
Gringo do you know Tony Kevin by any chance..https://youtu.be/XpMNoeIuEys
   I am unsure whether you are asking this in good faith but will assume so and answer.
     I didn't know Tony Kevin until I watched the video that you linked to and decided to research him further. The blatant propaganda, unsupported claims and outright lies in the video cannot be taken seriously. Tony Kevin was the only adult in a room full of children. His experience speaks volumes. The rest of it was just a series of not credible people making wild claims. One of the talking heads was the infamous Bill Browder. If you don't know who Bill Browder is, he is the person responsible for the "evidence" that led to the world wide and wide ranging Magnitsky Act sanctions on Russia. The Magnitsky Act is named after Bill Browder's supposed "lawyer" who was, according to Browder, beaten to death in his cell in Russia.
      Browder solicited Andrei Nekrasov a Russian film maker and Putin critic to make a film of Magnitsky's alleged murder and the alleged theft of hundreds of millions of dollars by corrupt police. Nekrasov had previously made a film accusing the Russian State of the Litvinenko poisoning and was in no way friendly towards Putin and the Russian gov.
    The two hour long film is an absolute eye opener. It is available on the link below;

    https://dlive.tv/v/majes.tytyty+1eqNuaKOm

   A youtube link to the same film below, if you prefer, but certainly up until a couple of years ago links to this film would always be fairly quickly removed after legal bullying by Browder
   
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=snbepDSmA-4&ab_channel=AGS363

 It is riveting and split into two natural parts as Nekrasov investigates and reaches uncomfortable, for him, conclusions.

     Once you see Browder on camera having to answer questions to a committee, his evasiveness and lack of recollection. Well watch it to see exactly what an unconvincing liar he is. There are many absolutely stunning revelations in the film. The transcription of Russian records presented as truth in the Senate and EU parliaments were utterly false transcriptions and said the opposite of what was claimed in many cases. Nekrasov as a Russian speaker read the originals and was stunned. He spoke to officials and told them but they didn't want to know. It really is eye opening.
 

 

   

     
« Last Edit: September 26, 2021, 03:02:AM by gringo »

Offline David1819

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #663 on: September 26, 2021, 01:19:PM »
?Where are they? Why no contact despite Yulia making clear in the one time she has spoken that she intended to return?
     What are the UK gov hiding?
     Are the Skripals political prisoners?

   

They have been put into a witness protection program. Why should their safety be compromised because a few conspiratards on the Internet want to know?

Offline David1819

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #664 on: September 26, 2021, 01:22:PM »
The CCTV coverage at the Skripal home, looking back, was assumed.

In other words, you made it up.

Offline gringo

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #665 on: September 26, 2021, 01:39:PM »
     The narrative arc of history. An excellent piece on the Saker Blog which covers Middle Eastern history over a century or so, remarkably rich in detail whilst brief enough to in 5 or 10 minutes. The role of UK intelligence throughout(with names) is revealing. For a brief history it is excellent
      https://thesaker.is/who-really-runs-the-middle-east/


Offline nugnug

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #666 on: September 26, 2021, 02:27:PM »
why  thefuck anyone would belive a word the bbc says i dont know there proven liars.

Offline gringo

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #667 on: September 26, 2021, 05:12:PM »
    A really good summation of the entire Skripal hoax. Two years on.... He lists the 40 most absurd/impossible claims made by the UK gov. and Met Police. The piece is a good summing up of the whole. A recurring theme in everything is what is rapidly becoming the less hidden hand of UK intel. Time and time again; Our spies are not what they used to be;
      Sean Connery as James Bond in Dr. No. More like Leslie Neilsen as Dick Steele in Spy Hard

     https://www.theblogmire.com/the-salisbury-poisonings-two-years-on-a-riddle-wrapped-in-a-cover-up-inside-a-hoax/
« Last Edit: September 26, 2021, 05:44:PM by gringo »

Offline David1819

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #668 on: September 26, 2021, 05:18:PM »
    A really good summation of the entire Skripal hoax. Two years on.... He lists the 40 most absurd/impossible claims made by the UK gov. and Met Police.

No, he has produced a Gish Gallop. Something nobody with a valid argument would resort to.

"The Gish Gallop is the fallacious debate tactic of drowning your opponent in a flood of individually-weak arguments in order to prevent rebuttal of the whole argument collection without great effort. The Gish Gallop is a belt-fed version of the on the spot fallacy, as it's unreasonable for anyone to have a well-composed answer immediately available to every argument present in the Gallop. The Gish Gallop is named after creationist Duane Gish, who often abused it.

Gish Gallops are almost always performed with numerous other logical fallacies baked in. The myriad of component arguments constituting the Gallop may typically intersperse a few perfectly uncontroversial claims — the basic validity of which are intended to lend undue credence to the Gallop at large — with a devious hodgepodge of half-truths, outright lies, red herrings and straw men — which, if not rebutted as the fallacies they are, pile up into egregious problems for the refuter."

http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Gish_Gallop

Offline David1819

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #669 on: September 26, 2021, 05:33:PM »
This comes as no surprise. The guy running theblogmire also believes in zombies and denies evolution.  :))

https://www.theblogmire.com/the-wonders-of-the-resurrection/

https://www.theblogmire.com/lamb-spamb-or-octopamb/

Offline gringo

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #670 on: September 26, 2021, 05:42:PM »
No, he has produced a Gish Gallop. Something nobody with a valid argument would resort to.

"The Gish Gallop is the fallacious debate tactic of drowning your opponent in a flood of individually-weak arguments in order to prevent rebuttal of the whole argument collection without great effort. The Gish Gallop is a belt-fed version of the on the spot fallacy, as it's unreasonable for anyone to have a well-composed answer immediately available to every argument present in the Gallop. The Gish Gallop is named after creationist Duane Gish, who often abused it.

Gish Gallops are almost always performed with numerous other logical fallacies baked in. The myriad of component arguments constituting the Gallop may typically intersperse a few perfectly uncontroversial claims — the basic validity of which are intended to lend undue credence to the Gallop at large — with a devious hodgepodge of half-truths, outright lies, red herrings and straw men — which, if not rebutted as the fallacies they are, pile up into egregious problems for the refuter."

http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Gish_Gallop
    There are dozens of articles on the blog following the drama on the ground in real time. Anyone can read and see whether they think Rob Slane or David has valid arguments. The last article was a summary of two years worth of reporting hence the list. This was stated. Dismissing it as Gish Gallop demonstrates your lack of anything of value to add.
     You have got nothing to add. You are just shouting from the sidelines.

Offline David1819

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #671 on: September 26, 2021, 06:29:PM »
This comes as no surprise. The guy running theblogmire also believes in zombies and denies evolution.  :))

https://www.theblogmire.com/the-wonders-of-the-resurrection/

https://www.theblogmire.com/lamb-spamb-or-octopamb/

Gringo do you believe in zombies and creationism since the theblogmire is a proponent of such ideas?
« Last Edit: September 26, 2021, 06:30:PM by David1819 »

Offline nugnug

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #672 on: September 26, 2021, 07:08:PM »
Gringo do you believe in zombies and creationism since the theblogmire is a proponent of such ideas?

so what if it does being wrong about one thing doesnt make you wrong about everything.

Offline David1819

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #673 on: September 26, 2021, 07:29:PM »
so what if it does being wrong about one thing doesnt make you wrong about everything.

Its not one thing. More or less everything on that blog is wrong. It demonstrates that the author bases his claims on faith and sentiment, and not on objective observation. Anything on that blog that turns out to be factual is a case of a broken clock being right twice a day.

Its a classic case of crank magnetism. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crank_(person)#Crank_magnetism

Much like Roch gets his ideas from a guy who claims aliens abduct sheep and Bush destroyed the twin towers with a space laser. Gringo gets his ideas from a guy who believes in Zombies and that a super natural being got a 400 year old to build a giant floating zoo prior to flooding the planet.

Offline Roch

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #674 on: September 26, 2021, 09:50:PM »
Its not one thing. More or less everything on that blog is wrong. It demonstrates that the author bases his claims on faith and sentiment, and not on objective observation. Anything on that blog that turns out to be factual is a case of a broken clock being right twice a day.

Its a classic case of crank magnetism. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crank_(person)#Crank_magnetism

Much like Roch gets his ideas from a guy who claims aliens abduct sheep and Bush destroyed the twin towers with a space laser. Gringo gets his ideas from a guy who believes in Zombies and that a super natural being got a 400 year old to build a giant floating zoo prior to flooding the planet.

Your interpretation of a person's belief cannot impact upon CCTV footage or mobile phone images which show two different individuals, in two different sets of clothes, with two different walks, two different physiques and two different bags. Neither can it impact upon UK intelligence's ability to set and spring a trap to embarrass and sanction Russia. Nor can it impact on a plane being 'filmed' seeping in to a massive solid building, with its nose cone coming out the other side by accident 🤣
« Last Edit: September 26, 2021, 10:17:PM by Roch »