The murder of 14 year-old schoolgirl Jodi Jones near Edinburgh on 30 June 2003

[nugnug]

If my theory is correct and the t-shirt belonged to the killer it leaves the possibility that other items were to.

This would explain a lot.

Definitely explain.
1. The change in description from the initial blue jeans/blue hoodie to the clothes found at the crime scene.
2. Why the bra was not contaminated by Jodis blood.
3. Why no one was ever seen covered in blood from the crime scene.
4. The over emphasis on the borrowing of clothes between siblings.
5. The DNA samples of blood and semen from an identified male.
6. The t-shirt not being cut at the arms to allow removal.
7. The lack of blood on the torso if the killer realised that had the victim worn the t-shirt then front and back would be covered in blood so possibly used the t-shirt to clean the body.

Potentially explain.
1. Why AW took to washing the day after her granddaughter was murdered and some of those clothes that were washed belonged to Jodi .
2. Why Jodi was intent on seeing Luke earlier than was their normal routine.
3. Why all the clothes at the crime scene appear to be linked by singular sperm cells.
4.

Loosely explain.
1. If there was a clear and present danger to Jodi could stocky man have been sent to protect Jody and not as thought be a threat to her.

Can anyone add to this?

jodi was heading towards roans dyke now everybody assumed that she was on thr way to see luke but who else did she know that lived near there i can think of 2 people.

[sandra L]

if she was going to get some canabis where would she have gone i asume to see jof but  was anywhere else she culd of got it.

This was the day of the 8 bar - JF and JoJ walked down from AW's to JuJ's before lunchtime with 8 oz of cannabis. I imagine that was something of an event for those who got their supplies from JF. (It appears never to have been recovered by police).

At some point that afternoon (from the statements, I'd say between 12 and 2pm) JF cut a piece to take "to his mother and her partner." Because his statements are all over the place, there is one that suggests he went to his mother's from YW's, not from JuJ's house - could he have left some cannabis at YW's to be picked up later?

Also, this is the evening JF "forgot" to go back to see JoJ at six o'clock. He forgot there were 8 ozs of cannabis there, within 4 - 6 hours of leaving it there? The 8oz wasn't for JoJ's personal use, because JF cut a piece to take to his mother and her partner. What, exactly was going on with that?

I don't use cannabis, never have, so I've no idea how much 8oz of cannabis resin would have been worth in 2003. But Jof, GD and JoJ were all on benefits, so not rolling with cash. I'm assuming they got it "on tick" to sell, but from whom? JF continued to sell cannabis right under the noses of police for another 10 months - Luke's conviction for cannabis should have been chucked out as entrapment - the police were watching his every move, they knew from early July 2003 that he and other teenagers got their cannabis from JF, and not once, in all that time, was he ever charged for being involved with drugs.

Six o'clock was Jodi's regular meeting time with Luke and other friends.(Luke couldn't get there much before 6 because he cooked dinner for his mum coming in at around 5.15pm every day, then had to eat and get to Woodburn or Easthouses.)

Coincidentally, that was the time JF was supposed to go back to see JoJ.

[sandra L]

If my theory is correct and the t-shirt belonged to the killer it leaves the possibility that other items were to.

This would explain a lot.

Definitely explain.
1. The change in description from the initial blue jeans/blue hoodie to the clothes found at the crime scene.

This was AB's initial description, which JuJ appeared to agree with because she had no idea what Jodi was wearing. But it's also close to the description of the school uniform colours for Newbattle High, which was literally a few yards away from AB's claimed sighting - there's really nothing to say this sighting was of Jodi.

2. Why the bra was not contaminated by Jodis blood.

That's an odd one, I agree. There was a "contact" stain on the clasp area of the bra - I can't remember if this was claimed to be Jodi's blood or a "no reportable result" but I think we'd have to conclude that it wasn't Jodi who deposited that stain, especially given the pristine nature of the bra when it was found. Also, and this has always seemed strange to me, the other clothes (underwear, t shirt, hoodie) were "strewn around" - basically just thrown down wherever they landed, but the bra was neatly folded.
 

3. Why no one was ever seen covered in blood from the crime scene.

It would be one explanation, yes. But the network of tracks and cycle paths in the area mean the killer could have travelled a fair distance without ever emerging onto "public" areas. Rape Kit man Allan Roberts, for example, was claimed to have admitted to Jodi's murder while he was on remand awaiting trial for an attack on another woman in Musselburgh. It is possible to get from Easthouses to Musselburgh without emerging onto proper roads or paths, simply by following the river.

4. The over emphasis on the borrowing of clothes between siblings.

Again, the whole borrowed clothes thing is very strange and definitely seems contrived.

5. The DNA samples of blood and semen from an identified male.

There's something intrinsically wrong about the way this was explained away - what police force, in a massive murder investigation, tried to come up with "innocent explanations" for this? Some of the other recovered partial DNA matches, however, do not fit this individual's profile, so there would have to be an explanation for their presence.

6. The t-shirt not being cut at the arms to allow removal.

Not sure what you mean by this- I can't remember exactly how the t shirt was cut, but from memory, it was an upside down L shaped cut - again a strange thing to do  if the cutting of the t shirt was intended to aid removal.

7. The lack of blood on the torso if the killer realised that had the victim worn the t-shirt then front and back would be covered in blood so possibly used the t-shirt to clean the body.

Yes, but I'd have expected smears to be left behind - there were none. The torso was completely blood free.

Potentially explain.

1. Why AW took to washing the day after her granddaughter was murdered and some of those clothes that were washed belonged to Jodi

Potentially, yes. AW doing the washing meant that SK, JF and JoJ's clothes were all being bundled together with all of the females in the family, so any cross-contamination of any items would have an innocent explanation.

2. Why Jodi was intent on seeing Luke earlier than was their normal routine.

We don't know that she was. According to JuJ, she was telling Jodi to be quiet, shoo and go out around 4pm, just after Jodi came in from school. But she also said originally that Jodi left around 5.30, before changing the time to 4.50. Luke said Jodi texted that she would be down "later."

3. Why all the clothes at the crime scene appear to be linked by singular sperm cells.

Not all the sperm cells have been proven to originate from the same source, though.

Loosely explain.
1. If there was a clear and present danger to Jodi could stocky man have been sent to protect Jody and not as thought be a threat to her.

Depends who stocky man was. If he was unpredictable, that might not have been the best idea?

These are just my immediate thoughts on your points - as always, I'm open to any new thoughts or ideas that might lead to some understanding of what really happened.

[gordo30]

If my theory is correct and the t-shirt belonged to the killer it leaves the possibility that other items were to.

This would explain a lot.

Definitely explain.
1. The change in description from the initial blue jeans/blue hoodie to the clothes found at the crime scene.

This was AB's initial description, which JuJ appeared to agree with because she had no idea what Jodi was wearing. But it's also close to the description of the school uniform colours for Newbattle High, which was literally a few yards away from AB's claimed sighting - there's really nothing to say this sighting was of Jodi.

Ok I think this can be moved to loosely explain as the police believed the AB sighting was that of Jodi and if JUJ agreed then surely Jodi must have owned clothes of a similar description and again surely JuJ must have looked to see if these posssible clothes were still in the house or not, in light of the possibility that the sighting could have been Jodi then I feel it's still relevant to my theory.

What was the description that the two independent witnesses that saw Jodi later on give to what she was wearing?

[marty]

If it was the killers t shirt, surely you would have to have the killers dna

[nugnug]

if it was the killers t shirt wouldent the killer have to be roughly the same size her in order for it to be mistaken for her hers.

[nugnug]

If it was the killers t shirt, surely you would have to have the killers dna

i would of thought so to.

[gordo30]

Without knowing who all the samples belong to there's no way of knowing if the killers DNA is there or not.

[nugnug]

im sure it actully is there.

[gordo30]

Quote

    2. Why the bra was not contaminated by Jodis blood.


That's an odd one, I agree. There was a "contact" stain on the clasp area of the bra - I can't remember if this was claimed to be Jodi's blood or a "no reportable result" but I think we'd have to conclude that it wasn't Jodi who deposited that stain, especially given the pristine nature of the bra when it was found. Also, and this has always seemed strange to me, the other clothes (underwear, t shirt, hoodie) were "strewn around" - basically just thrown down wherever they landed, but the bra was neatly folded.

This is the main reason I feel that the t-shirt is the killers, theres no way the  bra  was worn when the throat injuries were performed, If she wasnt wearing her bra then she couldn't have been wearing a t-shirt also.
The bra being folded is strange but there does appear to be two modes of action at the crime scene, one where we have anger and violence and one more methodical where we have bra's folded, shoes being placed neatly together and accurate post mortem injuries.
Theres also the possiblity that the killer never handled the bra and shoes as no blood was transferred from the hands that surely would have been covered in blood.

[gordo30]

Quote

    3. Why no one was ever seen covered in blood from the crime scene.

It would be one explanation, yes. But the network of tracks and cycle paths in the area mean the killer could have travelled a fair distance without ever emerging onto "public" areas. Rape Kit man Allan Roberts, for example, was claimed to have admitted to Jodi's murder while he was on remand awaiting trial for an attack on another woman in Musselburgh. It is possible to get from Easthouses to Musselburgh without emerging onto proper roads or paths, simply by following the river.

I agree that it was possible but the probablity that the killer was someone who didn't know Jodi or whp lived outside the area is remote, most of the people Jodi knew stayed in the area housing developments and would have had to emerge into a public thoroughfare at some point. If faced with being able to get there without being seen and the choice of changing clothes to enable to get home then im sure they would choose to do so.

[gordo30]

if it was the killers t shirt wouldent the killer have to be roughly the same size her in order for it to be mistaken for her hers.

Exactly mate but thats not too far out when you consider Jodi liked to wear things baggy so many of her clothes would fit someone relatively the same size as her. The reason why the bra and shoes couldn't be anyone else's apart from Jodi's is there defined by size.

[nugnug]

well it would her mothers incorrect description of the t shirt she was wearing.

but if that was the killers t shirt what happend to her t shirt.

[gordo30]

Mate the killer wore it

[marty]

I would have thought there would be a complete DNA sample on the t shirt if it was the killers. All the ruff stuff, sweating, saliva and so on. Probably numerous samples.