The 3 o'clock phone calls & what Mugford knew.

[Jan]

Julie M. volunteered to identify the bodies. As far as I remember, Jeremy said he couldn´t do it, it would be too much for him, Ann Eaton said that she wouldn´t be able to tell the twins apart, so Julie did it. I don´t think anyone else from the family was in the picture at all.
Julie also wanted to go back inside to see the bodies again - she hadn´t got the "message" she wanted. According to Ann Eaton (who was waiting in her car outside the morgue), Julie seemed calm about the whole thing when she returned, lit a cigarette and wondered why the bodies´ heads had been shaved.

thanks that does explain things . I was not thinking that some of the other relatives may not have known the twins that well.

[nugnug]

Julie M. volunteered to identify the bodies. As far as I remember, Jeremy said he couldn´t do it, it would be too much for him, Ann Eaton said that she wouldn´t be able to tell the twins apart, so Julie did it. I don´t think anyone else from the family was in the picture at all.
Julie also wanted to go back inside to see the bodies again - she hadn´t got the "message" she wanted. According to Ann Eaton (who was waiting in her car outside the morgue), Julie seemed calm about the whole thing when she returned, lit a cigarette and wondered why the bodies´ heads had been shaved.

so she calmly and wit no emotion when in and looked at the bodies of the children that she later cliamed her boyfriend had just murdered.

[lookout]

Didn't JM also " speak " to Sheila ? Something about being spiritual ? I wonder what she asked

[Alias]

so she calmly and wit no emotion when in and looked at the bodies of the children that she later cliamed her boyfriend had just murdered.

It seems like it. I have never heard anything about her being overly upset by this.
There are many things that make me think that Julie Mugford had some issues - mental issues. This obviously, secondly her attempting to smother Jeremy and finally her attempt to stab a teddy bear she had gotten as a gift from Brett, Jeremy´s friend. All three episodes are worrying and certainly not normal for a young girl.
Oh, not to mention burglary (with Jeremy - can´t deny that), cheque fraud (without Jeremy) and drug dealing (without Jeremy).
This girl was out of control, seriously!!

[maggie]

It seems like it. I have never heard anything about her being overly upset by this.
There are many things that make me think that Julie Mugford had some issues - mental issues. This obviously, secondly her attempting to smother Jeremy and finally her attempt to stab a teddy bear she had gotten as a gift from Brett, Jeremy´s friend. All three episodes are worrying and certainly not normal for a young girl.
Oh, not to mention burglary (with Jeremy - can´t deny that), cheque fraud (without Jeremy) and drug dealing (without Jeremy).
This girl was out of control, seriously!!

Sorry I have to keep agreeing with you Alias but you speak such good sense. I have wondered for a long time whether, when people are accusing Jeremy Bamber of personality disorders they are maybe looking in the wrong direction.

[Alias]

Sorry I have to keep agreeing with you Alias but you speak such good sense. I have wondered for a long time whether, when people are accusing Jeremy Bamber of personality disorders they are maybe looking in the wrong direction.

Well, I don´t mind that you agree!
Steve says we come down on her like a ton of bricks, but come on, no matter from which angle you look at this case, Julie does not come out of it smelling like roses.

[Jan]

I know I will get picked up on this comment - so I will say IMO

I was about the same age as JM in the 80s and I know you should not judge someone your own morals but I would have been extremely distressed to have to do ID on the victims and personally even at that age I never would have accepted money from a newspaper for any story to do with such a tragic case. I also could never have stood up in court and lied ( if that is what she did do)

So together with the comments above she does seem to have some issues.

[Alias]

I know I will get picked up on this comment - so I will say IMO

I was about the same age as JM in the 80s and I know you should not judge someone your own morals but I would have been extremely distressed to have to do ID on the victims and personally even at that age I never would have accepted money from a newspaper for any story to do with such a tragic case. I also could never have stood up in court and lied ( if that is what she did do)

So together with the comments above she does seem to have some issues.

When she chose to pose for money in a sexual manner on the back of a family tragedy including the murders of two little innocent boys - even after having SEEN them dead, it should have become crystal clear to anyone and everyone that there was something seriously wrong with her!

[lookout]

I know I will get picked up on this comment - so I will say IMO

I was about the same age as JM in the 80s and I know you should not judge someone your own morals but I would have been extremely distressed to have to do ID on the victims and personally even at that age I never would have accepted money from a newspaper for any story to do with such a tragic case. I also could never have stood up in court and lied ( if that is what she did do)

So together with the comments above she does seem to have some issues.

I understand what you said Janus. During my training as a nurse,I was on a childrens' ward,though granted,I was younger at 16,and unfortunately witnessed the death of a 9 year old girl who'd died from yellow jaundice. I was beside myself and wondered if this career was for me. Sister in charge called me into her office for a talk,and told me that even after years,no member of staff ever got used to losing a young patient and all continued to cry,,which made me feel better and not a failure. Sister said it was perfectly normal and it was her way,believe it or not,,of spotting emotion,which I never fully understood until I did psychiatric nursing where I didn't see emotion and remembered what sister had told me.
So work that one out.

[Martin]

Susan Battersby said the phone rang at around 3.12am. Or even earlier as she had her phone 10 minutes fast so she could have a lay in. She has no reason to lie. This is a long time before the other phone calls.

The police interview with Bamber in Wilkes book states that Mugford knew about the kitchen fight & bible. At the time this has not been reported in the media. If correct it can only mean
one thing.

I see what you mean. If Julie Mugford knows that the police found Sheila’s body on the bed with a bible on her chest, it means that she knows that it must have been the police who stage managed it on the floor.

[Reader]

I was about the same age as JM in the 80s

Only in the 80s?

[Caroline R]

Only in the 80s?

  !!

[Jan]

Only in the 80s?

  no I am much younger now! wine preserves one very well thank you.

[Jane]

  no I am much younger now! wine preserves one very well thank you.

I'll drink to that

[Jan]

A question

I can see from JM statements on here that she said that JB had clearly told her about the hit man that he had arranged and how the killings were done - but by the time this had come to court of course this had been discounted completely . Then I can see in the newspaper interview she says that JB never admitted his guilt - not to her or in court. So is her actual court transcript on here anywhere ? I am just wondering what her story was at the time of the trial because it was obviously very instrumental in the judgement .