Author Topic: Statement of Ann Eaton 8th - 13th September 1985  (Read 115944 times)

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Offline ngb1066

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Re: Statement of Ann Eaton 8th - 13th September 1985
« Reply #510 on: May 01, 2013, 03:13:PM »
Thanks for clearing that up; so now we just need a disclaimer regarding females being illogical... 8)

I have already given that disclaimer - I never said what NN suggested.  She was joking as I am sure she will confirm.


Offline killingeve

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Re: Statement of Ann Eaton 8th - 13th September 1985
« Reply #511 on: May 01, 2013, 05:33:PM »
I have already given that disclaimer - I never said what NN suggested.  She was joking as I am sure she will confirm.

Absolutely NGB, I was just joking  :)

Offline ngb1066

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Re: Statement of Ann Eaton 8th - 13th September 1985
« Reply #512 on: May 02, 2013, 05:45:PM »
Must she though?? I'm not sure we actually have an offence of accessory after the fact anymore in this country and the nearest I can find (assisting an offender) requires a positive act rather than just a failure to say anything, as does perverting the course of justice. There is also an offence of concealing an offence, but that requires payment of some sort. I suppose the money he gave her for a holiday could amount to that, but it would be difficult to prove that that was the purpose. Was there anything in her early statements that was identified at trial or appeal as a deliberate lie?

Maybe NGB could help us out here, it'd be interesting to find out what the actual position would be.

I am sorry it has taken me so long to respond to your question.  I will try to deal with the key points and then apply that to Julie Mugford's position.

It is true that there the terms accessory before/after the fact are no longer used in English law (I say English rather than British or UK because I do not know if Scottish or Northern Irish law still uses the old terms).  These terms were replaced with the crime of aiding and abetting the principal offender in the commission of the crime.  Someone who aids and abets the principal is guilty of the same offence as the principal and is subject to the same penalties.  Law students are still taught the old case law on accessories as it still applies to aiding and abetting. 

In addition to the possibilty of prosecution for the main offence, someone who aids and abets may be guilty of other specific crimes, such as perverting the course of justice or assisting an offender.  Knowledge of an offence does not in itself amount to a criminal offence, nor does silence save in certain specific statutory cases, such as terrorism and money laundering. To be guilty there must be some positive assistance, whether that assistance was before the commission of the offence, during the commission of the offence or after.

In the present case Julie Mugford was at severe risk of being prosecuted for several serious offences, apart from the ones she specifically confessed to, namely the burglary at the Osea caravan park, the cheque frauds and the importation and supplying of drugs (for which she would have received a prison sentence and had her career as a teacher wrecked before it began).  The more serious offences were murder, perverting the course of justice and assisting an offender. If she is to be believed (and she cannot have it both ways), by her own admission she not only knew of Jeremy's plans for a considerable period before the murders, but also she provided sleeping tablets to Jeremy in order that he could see whether drugging his family as part of the murder plot was a viable option.  The fact that it was not viable does not make any difference.  On the day itself she was made aware that the murders were to take place but did not so much as protest, let alone take any steps which might have thwarted the plan.  If she is to be believed, Julie Mugford must have been in support of what was about to happen.  Further assistance was provided after the murders by expressing calming words to Jeremy during the 3.00/3.30 am telephone call.  When she arrived at WHF she provided comfort and encouragement to Jeremy in the knowledge of what he had done and this assisted Jeremy in his successful efforts to present himself to the police in a way which supported the proposition that Shela was responsible.  When interviewed by the police she gave an account to the police which backed up Jeremy's account.  Saying nothing is not an offence.  However saying something which does not include accurate details (for example of her conversations with Jeremy over the previous 24 hours) was providing positive assistance to Jeremy.

In case there is any misunderstanding I am not suggesting that I believe Julie Mugford's testimony.  However, the police did and on that basis she was at extreme risk of being charged with a very serious offence in addition to the ones to which she confessed.  The fear of that prosecution was in my view the major factor in persuading Julie Mugford to tell the police, eventually, what they wanted to hear.  She was trapped.  There was no turning back.  If she did not cooperate she was faced with the prospect of standing trial alongside Jeremy, facing a substantial prison term.  She did not come forward voluntarily.  She was in fact arrested and held in custody for a period and subjected to intense pressure.  The consent of the Director of Public Prosecutions had to be obtained to take the exceptional course of granting her immunity from prosecution in relation to all offences (with not even a formal caution, contrary to what was suggested at trial, meaning she had no criminal record whatsoever), upon the basis of her agreeing to be a prosecution witness.  It is a very sorry story indeed.

           
« Last Edit: May 05, 2013, 04:10:PM by ngb1066 »

Offline lookout

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Re: Statement of Ann Eaton 8th - 13th September 1985
« Reply #513 on: May 02, 2013, 05:56:PM »
Goodness me,,talk about being caught between the devil and the deep blue sea,,just which option would anyone have taken.? Get out of that one.

Offline killingeve

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Re: Statement of Ann Eaton 8th - 13th September 1985
« Reply #514 on: May 02, 2013, 06:04:PM »
Thank you NGB  :)


Offline susan

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Re: Statement of Ann Eaton 8th - 13th September 1985
« Reply #515 on: May 02, 2013, 06:18:PM »
Hi lookout we have to admit she did not look too stressed out that poor Jeremy was being sent to prison for life but she did her pose and got her blood money of £25.000.  I often wonder what she would have done or said to him if he had been found innocent.

Offline killingeve

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Re: Statement of Ann Eaton 8th - 13th September 1985
« Reply #516 on: May 02, 2013, 06:23:PM »
Hi lookout we have to admit she did not look too stressed out that poor Jeremy was being sent to prison for life but she did her pose and got her blood money of £25.000.  I often wonder what she would have done or said to him if he had been found innocent.

Fancy a shag for old times sake?

Offline susan

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Re: Statement of Ann Eaton 8th - 13th September 1985
« Reply #517 on: May 02, 2013, 06:27:PM »
Hi N/N  was that an offer prefer an hairy Scotsman than a Nun however naughty she is ;D ;D ;D ;D
« Last Edit: May 02, 2013, 06:30:PM by susan »

Offline lookout

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Re: Statement of Ann Eaton 8th - 13th September 1985
« Reply #518 on: May 02, 2013, 06:39:PM »
Hi lookout we have to admit she did not look too stressed out that poor Jeremy was being sent to prison for life but she did her pose and got her blood money of £25.000.  I often wonder what she would have done or said to him if he had been found innocent.


I just don't know,Susan.

Offline killingeve

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Re: Statement of Ann Eaton 8th - 13th September 1985
« Reply #519 on: May 02, 2013, 06:56:PM »
Hi N/N  was that an offer prefer an hairy Scotsman than a Nun however naughty she is ;D ;D ;D ;D

Get the hairy Scotsman body groomed:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fz6rvXLpxvo

Poor NGB has spent hours drafting the above and now we've reduced it to tawdriness

Offline Bridget

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Re: Statement of Ann Eaton 8th - 13th September 1985
« Reply #520 on: May 02, 2013, 06:57:PM »
Yes, thank you NGB, much appreciated.

So what you are saying basically is that whilst there is no requirement to volunteer the information at all, to volunteer incomplete (although in itself accurate) and thereby misleading information could be seen as a positive act and may well be an offence, am I understanding that correctly?

Did they actually grant her immunity, or was there a decision (however it was arrived at) that it wouldn't be in the public interest to prosecute?




« Last Edit: May 02, 2013, 06:59:PM by Bridget »
....just cos I eat worms...

Offline killingeve

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Re: Statement of Ann Eaton 8th - 13th September 1985
« Reply #521 on: May 02, 2013, 07:01:PM »
Yes, thank you NGB, much appreciated.

So what you are saying basically is that whilst there is no requirement to volunteer the information at all, to volunteer incomplete (although in itself accurate) and thereby misleading information could be seen as a positive act and may well be an offence, am I understanding that correctly?

Did they actually grant her immunity, or was there a decision (however it was arrived at) that it wouldn't be in the public interest to prosecute?

Miss Bridget

Dinner is served


Offline Patti

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Re: Statement of Ann Eaton 8th - 13th September 1985
« Reply #522 on: May 02, 2013, 07:01:PM »
I am sorry it has taken me so long to respond to your question.  I will try to deal with the key points and then apply that to Julie Mugford's position.

It is true that there the terms accessory before/after the fact are no longer used in English law (I say English rather than British or UK because I do not know if Scottish or Northern Irish law still uses the old terms).  These terms were replaced with the crime of aiding and abetting the principal offender in the commission of the crime.  Someone who aids and abets the principal is guilty of the same offence as the principal and is subject to the same penalties.  Law students are still taught the old case law on accessories as it still applies to aiding and abetting. 

In addition to the possibilty of prosecution for the main offence, someone who aids and abets may be guilty of other specific crimes, such as perverting the course of justice or assisting an offender.  Knowledge of an offence does not in itself amount to a criminal offence, nor does silence save in certain specific statutory cases, such as terrorism and money laundering. To be guilty there must be some positive assistance, whether that assistance was before the commission of the offence, during the commission of the offence or after.

In the present case Julie Mugford was at severe risk of being prosecuted for several serious offences, apart from the ones she specically confessed to, namely the burglary at the Osea caravan park, the cheque frauds and the importation and supplying of drugs (for which she would have received a prison sentence and had her career as a teacher wrecked before it began).  The more serious offences were murder, perverting the course of justice and assiting an offender. If she is to be believed (and she cannot have it both ways), by her own admission she not only knew of Jeremy's plans for a considerable period before the murders, but also she provided sleeping tablets to Jeremy in order that he could see whether drugging his family as part of the murder plot was a viable option.  The fact that it was not viable does not make any difference.  On the day itself she was made aware that the murders were to take place but did not so much as protest, let alone take any steps which might have thwarted the plan.  If she is to be believed, Julie Mugford must have been in support of what was about to happen.  Further assistance was provided after the murders by expressing calming words to Jeremy during the 3.00/3.30 am telephone call.  When she arrived at WHF she provided comfort and encouragement to Jeremy in the knowledge of what he had done and this assisted Jeremy in his successful efforts to present himself to the police in a way which supported the proposition that Shela was responsible.  When interviewed by the police she gave an account to the police which backed up Jeremy's account.  Saying nothing is not an offence.  However saying something which does not include accurate details (for example of her conversations with Jeremy over the previous 24 hours) was providing positive assistance to Jeremy.

In case there is any misunderstanding I am not suggesting that I believe Julie Mugford's testimony.  However, the police did and on that basis she was at extreme risk of being charged with a very serious offence in addition to the ones to which she confessed.  The fear of that prosecution was in my view the major factor in persuading Julie Mugford to tell the police, eventually, what they wanted to hear.  She was trapped.  There was no turning back.  If she did not cooperate she was faced with the prospect of standing trial alongside Jeremy, facing a substantial prison term.  She did not come forward voluntarily.  She was in fact arrested and held in custody for a period and subjected to intense pressure.  The consent of the Director of Public Prosecutions had to be obtained to take the exceptional course of granting her immunity from prosecution in relation to all offences (with not even a formal caution, contrary to what was suggested at trial, meaning she had no criminal record whatsoever), upon the basis of her agreeing to be a proscution witness.  It is a very sorry story indeed.

           

Hi NGB :)

OK, I don't know much about law, but its true she was not prosecuted 27 years ago, but what if new evidence came to light? What if the law changed? Could she be prosecuted for something she was given immunity for 27 years later on? Just askin!  ;D ;D ;D ;D

Offline Bridget

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Re: Statement of Ann Eaton 8th - 13th September 1985
« Reply #523 on: May 02, 2013, 07:05:PM »
Miss Bridget

Dinner is served

You have a terrible habit of reading into my posts things which I haven't actually said.
....just cos I eat worms...

Offline Alias

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Re: Statement of Ann Eaton 8th - 13th September 1985
« Reply #524 on: May 02, 2013, 07:08:PM »
I am sorry it has taken me so long to respond to your question.  I will try to deal with the key points and then apply that to Julie Mugford's position.

It is true that there the terms accessory before/after the fact are no longer used in English law (I say English rather than British or UK because I do not know if Scottish or Northern Irish law still uses the old terms).  These terms were replaced with the crime of aiding and abetting the principal offender in the commission of the crime.  Someone who aids and abets the principal is guilty of the same offence as the principal and is subject to the same penalties.  Law students are still taught the old case law on accessories as it still applies to aiding and abetting. 

In addition to the possibilty of prosecution for the main offence, someone who aids and abets may be guilty of other specific crimes, such as perverting the course of justice or assisting an offender.  Knowledge of an offence does not in itself amount to a criminal offence, nor does silence save in certain specific statutory cases, such as terrorism and money laundering. To be guilty there must be some positive assistance, whether that assistance was before the commission of the offence, during the commission of the offence or after.

In the present case Julie Mugford was at severe risk of being prosecuted for several serious offences, apart from the ones she specically confessed to, namely the burglary at the Osea caravan park, the cheque frauds and the importation and supplying of drugs (for which she would have received a prison sentence and had her career as a teacher wrecked before it began).  The more serious offences were murder, perverting the course of justice and assiting an offender. If she is to be believed (and she cannot have it both ways), by her own admission she not only knew of Jeremy's plans for a considerable period before the murders, but also she provided sleeping tablets to Jeremy in order that he could see whether drugging his family as part of the murder plot was a viable option.  The fact that it was not viable does not make any difference.  On the day itself she was made aware that the murders were to take place but did not so much as protest, let alone take any steps which might have thwarted the plan.  If she is to be believed, Julie Mugford must have been in support of what was about to happen.  Further assistance was provided after the murders by expressing calming words to Jeremy during the 3.00/3.30 am telephone call.  When she arrived at WHF she provided comfort and encouragement to Jeremy in the knowledge of what he had done and this assisted Jeremy in his successful efforts to present himself to the police in a way which supported the proposition that Shela was responsible.  When interviewed by the police she gave an account to the police which backed up Jeremy's account.  Saying nothing is not an offence.  However saying something which does not include accurate details (for example of her conversations with Jeremy over the previous 24 hours) was providing positive assistance to Jeremy.

In case there is any misunderstanding I am not suggesting that I believe Julie Mugford's testimony.  However, the police did and on that basis she was at extreme risk of being charged with a very serious offence in addition to the ones to which she confessed.  The fear of that prosecution was in my view the major factor in persuading Julie Mugford to tell the police, eventually, what they wanted to hear.  She was trapped.  There was no turning back.  If she did not cooperate she was faced with the prospect of standing trial alongside Jeremy, facing a substantial prison term.  She did not come forward voluntarily.  She was in fact arrested and held in custody for a period and subjected to intense pressure.  The consent of the Director of Public Prosecutions had to be obtained to take the exceptional course of granting her immunity from prosecution in relation to all offences (with not even a formal caution, contrary to what was suggested at trial, meaning she had no criminal record whatsoever), upon the basis of her agreeing to be a proscution witness.  It is a very sorry story indeed.

           

Brilliant post, thanks from me too.