Statement of Ann Eaton 8th - 13th September 1985

[killingeve]

Oh forgot to add the authorities advised adoptive parents to "tell" at a young age and leave it at that.  Because of all the secrecy surrounding 'closed' adoptions there wouldn't have been much more to tell anyway.

[killingeve]

Hi NN, was this incident before or after you had been told you were adopted? Were parents told they musnt discuss the adoption with their children? Thst meant both parents and children were living a lie and that lie was bound to form a division between them. In my case ... blond mum of Asian children it was impossible to deceive even if Id wanted too.

Well in the winter and from a distance we probably all looked similar but in the summer, especially on hols, it was very noticeable we were not from the same gene pool    My adoptive parents although 100% white just happened to turn very dark brown in the sun.  My brother went a golden brown.  But I'm part Scottish and Irish so have very fair Celtic skin which as a child would burn rather than tan so there was little me all white and/or pink or red    I would get prickly heat rash too and my Mum would get worried as the holiday doctors said I had measels and my mum insisted it wasn't poss as I'd already had measels   

[Jane]

Hi Maggie

After I was told I had been adopted.  My Mum told me when I was very young I had no idea what it all meant.  Perhaps around the time I started school    I think she said something like my other Mother was unable to look after me and that I hadn't grown in her tummy    This was whilst she was bathing me.  I then remember going all through family members and asking if they were adopted.  When I kept hearing the word "No" I thought this doesn't sound good    Eventually I got to my Brother and she said "Yes" so I felt a little better that at least someone else was "adopted" whatever that meant.  .  I don't ever recall the subject being raised again...EVER!  Even though I was very young I seemed to understand that it was taboo and a once only conversation not to be referred to again.  I have never discussed it once with my Dad!

NaNu/Maggie, my experience was quite different. I don't recall being told, just always having known but unlike NaNu, it played a huge part of my everyday life in that I wasn't allowed to do certain things/say certain things/go to certain places/mix with certain people because I was adopted. It was a constant reminder that I wasn't part of the family I was supposed to fit exactly into. Being told, as an adult that I had always been treated "as if you were one of us" comfirmed my belief that I never had been. I do recall that my birth mother was referred to as my "real/proper mother". When I asked what had happened to her, I was told "she didn't want you." I think my adoptive mother must have been consumed by unnamed fears but she seemed to be faced with a task she had little stomach for in order to reap the benefits later.

[maggie]

Oh forgot to add the authorities advised adoptive parents to "tell" at a young age and leave it at that.  Because of all the secrecy surrounding 'closed' adoptions there wouldn't have been much more to tell anyway.

  Cannot understand why it was thought a good idea to encourage families to live a lie.  How could there ever be a decent relationship when great areas of truth were out of bounds?  We had no choice as the difference was sort of out there but can remember being surprised and flattered when someone thought my little ones were my natural children with an Asian father.  We spoke to them about where they came from and their natural mothers as far back as I can remember so it's always been an integral part of all our lives. I write to one of the mothers every few months.  I think if relationships are safe and secure and also relaxed the choice of the child whether or not to have a relationship with their natural mother as well shouldn't be a threat....imo

[lookout]

Brilliant post April 

Lookout and Mat both have birth children.  Therefore neither have experienced infertility and the loss that this brings about.  Neither were adopted via a 'closed' adoption and therefore did not lose their identity before having to assume another. 

I do not normally recount personal experiences instead I tend to discuss adoption on the forum in terms of research, studies and outcomes undertaken by professionals but the following is perhaps a good personal experience to illustrate the point.

At about 9 yoa I went to the hairdressers with my adoptive mum.  My mum had her done and then I had mine done.  The hairdresser said to me, whilst cutting my hair and in the presence of my mum, that I had lovely thick wavy hair and that it was unlike my mum's so I must take after my dad.  My mum immediately said "oh yes she does".  I could see all sorts of emotions run across my mum's face.  I never said a word.  Why the lie?  Why the denial?  Why the secret?  Where did my hair come from?  Why was I unable to know?  I never mentioned the incident to my mum ever and vice-versa.  This was the charade which was played out 24/7 

NN,,speaking of hair/hairdressers,,,when in my early teens,I too had my " ringlets " cut off,,and my mother said she didn't know where my hair had come from. It was thick and fast-growing,and natural. Dads' hair was thinning and a different colour and mum was very dark,,and there was I---------------blonde.! So in point of fact,it's a question that a lot of mothers must ask. I used to always say that I wasn't born,,,I was invented, because I was so different from the rest of the family in pretty much every way. Even now,,I remain different from my brother.
My daughters aren't like me in character,,,but believe it or not,,people have thought that my step-daughter was my own,,as her characteristics are more like mine,than my own flesh and blood. We've always been close and I suppose because she was " there " before my own daughters were,,we'd already adopted a closeness anyway.It's also interesting to note that she has also shown as much,if not more love and affection too than my own ,outwardly also. So try and fathom that one out.

[Jane]

NN,,speaking of hair/hairdressers,,,when in my early teens,I too had my " ringlets " cut off,,and my mother said she didn't know where my hair had come from. It was thick and fast-growing,and natural. Dads' hair was thinning and a different colour and mum was very dark,,and there was I---------------blonde.! So in point of fact,it's a question that a lot of mothers must ask. I used to always say that I wasn't born,,,I was invented, because I was so different from the rest of the family in pretty much every way. Even now,,I remain different from my brother.
My daughters aren't like me in character,,,but believe it or not,,people have thought that my step-daughter was my own,,as her characteristics are more like mine,than my own flesh and blood. We've always been close and I suppose because she was " there " before my own daughters were,,we'd already adopted a closeness anyway.It's also interesting to note that she has also shown as much,if not more love and affection too than my own ,outwardly also. So try and fathom that one out.

Lookout, numerous people register surprise when they tell me how generous with their love and time are their children/grandchildren. IMO we reap what we sow and these people are being given back exactly what they always gave. Your relationship with your stepdaughter didn't just happen, lookout, you must have worked at it.

[maggie]

NaNu/Maggie, my experience was quite different. I don't recall being told, just always having known but unlike NaNu, it played a huge part of my everyday life in that I wasn't allowed to do certain things/say certain things/go to certain places/mix with certain people because I was adopted. It was a constant reminder that I wasn't part of the family I was supposed to fit exactly into. Being told, as an adult that I had always been treated "as if you were one of us" comfirmed my belief that I never had been. I do recall that my birth mother was referred to as my "real/proper mother". When I asked what had happened to her, I was told "she didn't want you." I think my adoptive mother must have been consumed by unnamed fears but she seemed to be faced with a task she had little stomach for in order to reap the benefits later.

April, at best your mother seemed to completely lack understanding and compassion of another human being, at worst she was a cruel and abusive person.  You have said before that she knew how to behave in public so I assume she was convincing enough to fool the Adoption Officer, in those days it was as much about matching eye colour etc as whether the parents were fit for purpose, so to speak. 
One of my kids is off on her hols in a week to get some sun and visit her family, her brother has held back his wedding party for her to be there and she'll meet more members of her natural family.  Doesn't bother me because our relationship stands alone as what it is and it doesn't really matter what she calls me, nothing will change what we have.  even so adoption is never ideal and adoptive children do always suffer even if integrated and secure within their family unit.  The pain from knowledge they were 'given away' (whatever the reason) never completely goes away imo   

[Jane]

April, at best your mother seemed to completely lack understanding and compassion of another human being, at worst she was a cruel and abusive person.  You have said before that she knew how to behave in public so I assume she was convincing enough to fool the Adoption Officer, in those days it was as much about matching eye colour etc as whether the parents were fit for purpose, so to speak. 
One of my kids is off on her hols in a week to get some sun and visit her family, her brother has held back his wedding party for her to be there and she'll meet more members of her natural family.  Doesn't bother me because our relationship stands alone as what it is and it doesn't really matter what she calls me, nothing will change what we have.  even so adoption is never ideal and adoptive children do always suffer even if integrated and secure within their family unit.  The pain from knowledge they were 'given away' (whatever the reason) never completely goes away imo   

Maggie, being told one was "given away" wasn't exactly a huge confidence booster :D :D :D

[maggie]

NN,,speaking of hair/hairdressers,,,when in my early teens,I too had my " ringlets " cut off,,and my mother said she didn't know where my hair had come from. It was thick and fast-growing,and natural. Dads' hair was thinning and a different colour and mum was very dark,,and there was I---------------blonde.! So in point of fact,it's a question that a lot of mothers must ask. I used to always say that I wasn't born,,,I was invented, because I was so different from the rest of the family in pretty much every way. Even now,,I remain different from my brother.
My daughters aren't like me in character,,,but believe it or not,,people have thought that my step-daughter was my own,,as her characteristics are more like mine,than my own flesh and blood. We've always been close and I suppose because she was " there " before my own daughters were,,we'd already adopted a closeness anyway.It's also interesting to note that she has also shown as much,if not more love and affection too than my own ,outwardly also. So try and fathom that one out.

Hi lookout, does your step daughter remember her mum?  I think it's very starange for children to have a huge hole in their knowledge of where they came from  which makes it difficult for them to know who they are.  I do believe we all need to some extent to know where we come from, some more than others but also I believe having to live a lie with a whole area that can't be discussed is pretty damaging for any relationship. imo ASlso agree with April, you obviously loved her unconditionally and that's all a child really needs.  She's now giving that love back and I'm sure you deserve it.

[maggie]

Maggie, being told one was "given away" wasn't exactly a huge confidence booster :D :D :D

I would imagine being told your natural mum didn't want you wasn't that good either april.  Even with my two that is the issue which is the hardest for them to come to terms with.  They know the reasons..ie. culture, extreme poverty etc.  They have spent time in that culture and therefore understand the difficulties women face but still, there is a lingering ?resentment?hurt? towards them for what they did.  They were always told the truth about their mother's situations, that by giving them for adoption they gave them opportunity and it was all done because they loved them enough to make the effort instead of abandoning them, literally but it doesn't really wash...that old primal wound still smarts.

[lookout]

Hi lookout, does your step daughter remember her mum?  I think it's very starange for children to have a huge hole in their knowledge of where they came from  which makes it difficult for them to know who they are.  I do believe we all need to some extent to know where we come from, some more than others but also I believe having to live a lie with a whole area that can't be discussed is pretty damaging for any relationship. imo ASlso agree with April, you obviously loved her unconditionally and that's all a child really needs.  She's now giving that love back and I'm sure you deserve it.

Maggie,,yes,,my step-daughter remembers her mum.In fact when the childrens' dad gained custody of the two children,,the mother refused to sign to the fact that she was allowed access to the children,,she liked her booze too much to bother. However,as the children got older,I didn't once forbid them to see her if they so wished,,but they didn't appear interested and were quite affected when they were old enough to realise that she actually " didn't want them ",,,but as the years went by,they'd realised that they still had their dad,,who was more important to them.
When we learned of their mothers death in the early 90's,,I'd suggested they went to her funeral which of course out of courtesy,they did.

[ngb1066]

Miss Bridget

I disagree.

Wit stat 8th Aug

He told me he had supper with his parents during the conversation that evening and that he had a "pleasant as could be expected day due to harvesting".  He did not make any more mention of the family.

Wit stat 8th/9th Sep

Jeremy did not mention to me about killing his family until Tuesday 6th August 1985...

...I said to him "You sound pissed off".  He said, "I have been thinking on the tractor and the crime will have to be tonight or never".

Look on the bright side you might end up having humble pie for supper instead of worms 

I asked NGB for his input but he said he likes to see women fight it out    He said he finds their illogical approach to legal matters endearing 

I hope I do not have to make clear that I said no such thing!  I have been busy so have not have time to respond to PMs.  I will try to catch up this afternoon.  I will also post a response to Bridget's original question on this. 

   

[ngb1066]

In other words, he doesn´t know.... 

Oh yes I do...!  More later.

[susan]

ngb1066  thought you would

[Alias]

Oh yes I do...!  More later.

Thanks for clearing that up; so now we just need a disclaimer regarding females being illogical...