Jeremy got to scene (whf) much faster than people give him credit for...

[jim ignatowski]

Hi Lookout
I agree - JB was left hanging on the phone - I'm sure that I've seen/read a reference to a period of 3 minutes
Jim

Hi Lookout
The reference to 3 mins is within the cross examination of PC West
Jim

[Steve_uk]

Jeremy didn't say that Ralf told him she had gone crazy WITH the gun. The quote is "Please come over, Your sister has gone crazy and has the gun" which is quite different.

He may also have wanted to delay getting to the farm first because he was AFRAID of what he might find or that he simply didn't know what he would do if he got there first. In unique and stressful situations people don't behave in ways you might expect, they are afraid of making a mistake and making the situation worse. Read up on the 'bystander effect'. Just because he didn't act in a way that 'you' think appropriate doesn't make his a killer!!

But Caroline the telephone conversation ends abruptly as supposedly Sheila places a well manicured nail on the handset,thereby relinquishing one hand from the gun she is threatening Nevill with. It's completely ridiculous that a tired young woman on her way to bed then overcomes Nevill leaving no fingerprints on the gun for Police to find once they enter the farm.

[Caroline R]

He would. An innocent man would say, Something is wrong at the farm.
Julie´s accounts of those phone calls are false. I don´t believe her one bit.
[/quote

Me either but she does corroborate him saying "Something is wrong at the farm". Having just been told earlier that "Tonights the night", she then just goes back to bed? Doesn't Jim find that strange? 

[maggie]

But Caroline the telephone conversation ends abruptly as supposedly Sheila places a well manicured nail on the handset,thereby relinquishing one hand from the gun she is threatening Nevill with. It's completely ridiculous that a tired young woman on her way to bed then overcomes Nevill leaving no fingerprints on the gun for Police to find once they enter the farm.

Steve, it's far more likely that Ralph depressed the cradle before phoning the police or dropping the receiver and racing upstairs due to commotion up there.  The 'well maicured finger' on the cradle is like a scene out of a 2nd rate film.

[Patti]

Hi Patti
I did a google search and got a distance of 3-4 miles- however, I'm quite prepared to accept your distances are more accurate
That said, we'd surely agree that JB would be expected to take the shorter route and, of course, there would have been very little, if any, traffic on the road at that time of night.
I'm not sure of the configuration of the route but I'd like to think that I would have covered the distance in about 5 mins
Jim

Hi Jim

5.4 miles on bendy roads at night time....in 5 minutes.  I guess he knew the bends well, so I could deducted a couple of minutes, but can't halve it I'm afraid, not even for you. Even at 8 minutes, it still leaves him 7 minutes to get ready, lock up, get into his car and off.  Notice I am still working with 15 minutes and, still selling it...lol

Night Jim/All 

[Caroline R]

But Caroline the telephone conversation ends abruptly as supposedly Sheila places a well manicured nail on the handset,thereby relinquishing one hand from the gun she is threatening Nevill with. It's completely ridiculous that a tired young woman on her way to bed then overcomes Nevill leaving no fingerprints on the gun for Police to find once they enter the farm.

Says who? Please point out the statement or document that alludes to the above - regardless of whether her hands were well manicured or not? Also, there is NO EVIDENCE that the rifle was wiped clean of prints!!

[jim ignatowski]

And that's you 'opinion' which you are entitled to. What I don't understand is - as JB is serving a whole life tariff or as you so eloquently put it "rotting in hell" - why are you here? You have exactly what you want so why the fascination in the case?

Hi Caroline
I've long since taken an interest in miscarriage of justice cases
I stumbled accross this site and you will know that I have very strong views about this case
5 people were obliterated
I would consider it to be an appalling miscarriage of justice if JB was ever let free from incarceration
I'm here to try to correct some of what I consider to be the myths/misconceptions/fantasies surrounding JB
5 people were obliterated and I consider life to be far too precious to stand idly by
Jim

[Caroline R]

Hi Caroline
I've long since taken an interest in miscarriage of justice cases
I stumbled accross this site and you will know that I have very strong views about this case
5 people were obliterated
I would consider it to be an appalling miscarriage of justice if JB was ever let free from incarceration
I'm here to try to correct some of what I consider to be the myths/misconceptions/fantasies surrounding JB
5 people were obliterated and I consider life to be far too precious to stand idly by
Jim

Hi Jim,
But you're not correcting misconceptions, you are looking for things to support your already held beliefs. Read the case files (not just books or opinion). It's all very well wanting to 'correct' myths (and I'm all for that) but don't get sucked into perpetuating them.

[Alias]

He would. An innocent man would say, Something is wrong at the farm.
Julie´s accounts of those phone calls are false. I don´t believe her one bit.
[/quote

Me either but she does corroborate him saying "Something is wrong at the farm". Having just been told earlier that "Tonights the night", she then just goes back to bed? Doesn't Jim find that strange? 

Jim, did you see Caroline´s question for you. It is a bit hidden inside a quote.

[lookout]

Hi Lookout
The reference to 3 mins is within the cross examination of PC West
Jim

Jim,,,apparently,,according to curiousessex March 18th 2011,,Jeremy was kept hanging on for 11 minutes.
Notes were detailed from Ann Eaton.
The thread is called " The Master File."

[jim ignatowski]

He would. An innocent man would say, Something is wrong at the farm.
Julie´s accounts of those phone calls are false. I don´t believe her one bit.
[/quote

Me either but she does corroborate him saying "Something is wrong at the farm". Having just been told earlier that "Tonights the night", she then just goes back to bed? Doesn't Jim find that strange? 

Hi Caroline
Sorry, but I didn't notice your question
I haven't recently read Jm's account of the tel call and, in all fairness, I do find it strange that, having , according to JM being informed by JB that "tonight's the night", she apparently didn't query the position with JB
Jim

[-Harters-]

Hi Jim

5.4 miles on bendy roads at night time....in 5 minutes.  I guess he knew the bends well, so I could deducted a couple of minutes, but can't halve it I'm afraid, not even for you. Even at 8 minutes, it still leaves him 7 minutes to get ready, lock up, get into his car and off.  Notice I am still working with 15 minutes and, still selling it...lol

Night Jim/All 

It's not 5 minutes though, it's 3 minutes.

Car CA07 arrived at 3:48 and JB arrived a couple of minutes later.

That's 3:50, not 3:52 right? Which is a mere three minutes after Mike is saying he finished his call to the police. Not possible.

[-Harters-]

I thought you were arguing about why it took him so long to get to WHF?

I wasn't, the length of time for the journey makes little difference to anything.

However, the sole reason for Mike trying to sell the idea to people that JB didn't call the police until 3:36, is to try and introduce a call from Neville to the police 10 minutes earlier. That is pure fiction.

If people were truly honest with themselves then I'm sure they agree.

[Caroline R]

I wasn't, the length of time for the journey makes little difference to anything.

However, the sole reason for Mike trying to sell the idea to people that JB didn't call the police until 3:36, is to try and introduce a call from Neville to the police 10 minutes earlier. That is pure fiction.

If people were truly honest with themselves then I'm sure they agree.

Whatever the reason behind it, West himself stated that the call came in at 03:36.

[-Harters-]

Whatever the reason behind it, West himself stated that the call came in at 03:36.

But he called Bonnett at 3:26 whilst JB was on hold.

It is well and truly established completely beyond doubt that JB called at 3:26.