Author Topic: The Lion, the Witch, the Wardrobe and Jeremy.  (Read 49952 times)

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Offline lookout

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Re: The Lion,the Witch,the Wardrobe and Jeremy..
« Reply #15 on: February 24, 2013, 11:01:AM »

Lookout, she wouldn't have needed to travel as far as Coggeshall, apart, that is, from how would would she have got there. The Essex marshes were said to be rife with covens during the 70/80s. I think Sheila's "witchery" was more cerebral than factual.

Yes,,April,,I would say so,,as she would have been taken in by anything that wasn't the norm because she wasn't thinking straight half the time and was looking for an outlet in some way.

Offline Patti

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Re: The Lion,the Witch,the Wardrobe and Jeremy..
« Reply #16 on: February 24, 2013, 11:06:AM »
I think June tidied up Sheila as there was a dishcloth on the sink which I don't associate with Sheila somehow. The tampon was cut with scissors and would be just the kind of thing Jeremy would do to match his schoolboy humour high on just getting rid of five people he despised.

Hi Steve :)

I don't think anyone would have tidied Sheila up, she was a grown woman. This is an assumption on your part and does not reflect poor Sheila at all...The one thing that lovely girl was famous for, was the way she looked after herself and kept herself neat and tidy... :) :) :)

Offline Steve_uk

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Re: The Lion,the Witch,the Wardrobe and Jeremy..
« Reply #17 on: February 24, 2013, 11:32:AM »
Hi Steve :)

I don't think anyone would have tidied Sheila up, she was a grown woman. This is an assumption on your part and does not reflect poor Sheila at all...The one thing that lovely girl was famous for, was the way she looked after herself and kept herself neat and tidy... :) :) :)
That's true when she was well,but she had her accident then left her underwear in the kitchen for all to see including Jeremy? I can't conceive of it working out that way. I think June intervened at some point and the practicality of the farmer's wife took over,hence the bloodstained underwear left to soak in buckets.

Offline Jane

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Re: The Lion,the Witch,the Wardrobe and Jeremy..
« Reply #18 on: February 24, 2013, 11:45:AM »
That's true when she was well,but she had her accident then left her underwear in the kitchen for all to see including Jeremy? I can't conceive of it working out that way. I think June intervened at some point and the practicality of the farmer's wife took over,hence the bloodstained underwear left to soak in buckets.


Perhaps you could try putting several items of clothes into a bucket full of water and invite someone to judge what they are without touching or removing them. The removal of blood is made easier by rinsing the garment under cold running water before soaking.

Offline lookout

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Re: The Lion,the Witch,the Wardrobe and Jeremy..
« Reply #19 on: February 24, 2013, 11:46:AM »
That's true when she was well,but she had her accident then left her underwear in the kitchen for all to see including Jeremy? I can't conceive of it working out that way. I think June intervened at some point and the practicality of the farmer's wife took over,hence the bloodstained underwear left to soak in buckets.


Another thing that annoys me,is the fact that the buckets of clothing weren't investigated,,as for sure it wouldn't have been all menstrual blood. That clothing was soaked on the night of the murders and nobody but Sheila would have known about the full reason they were soaking. Not just underwear either.

Offline Jane

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Re: The Lion,the Witch,the Wardrobe and Jeremy..
« Reply #20 on: February 24, 2013, 11:54:AM »

Another thing that annoys me,is the fact that the buckets of clothing weren't investigated,,as for sure it wouldn't have been all menstrual blood. That clothing was soaked on the night of the murders and nobody but Sheila would have known about the full reason they were soaking. Not just underwear either.


Lookout, if we follow that line of thinking, that bucket may NOT have just held the effect of a menstrual accident. I may already have held clothes that the boys had worn earlier and because it was there the knickers were simply added to it.

Offline lookout

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Re: The Lion,the Witch,the Wardrobe and Jeremy..
« Reply #21 on: February 24, 2013, 12:22:PM »

Lookout, if we follow that line of thinking, that bucket may NOT have just held the effect of a menstrual accident. I may already have held clothes that the boys had worn earlier and because it was there the knickers were simply added to it.

April,,,there were also day clothes of Sheilas' which she could possibly have changed from at some point during the night/early morning. Not sure of the boys clothes though,as I'd have thought they'd have been in the laundry basket in the bathroom.

Offline Bridget

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Re: The Lion,the Witch,the Wardrobe and Jeremy..
« Reply #22 on: February 24, 2013, 12:27:PM »
April,,,there were also day clothes of Sheilas' which she could possibly have changed from at some point during the night/early morning. Not sure of the boys clothes though,as I'd have thought they'd have been in the laundry basket in the bathroom.

Two pairs of knickers and a pair of jogging bottoms, all Sheila's if I recall correctly.
....just cos I eat worms...

Offline lookout

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Re: The Lion,the Witch,the Wardrobe and Jeremy..
« Reply #23 on: February 24, 2013, 12:32:PM »
Two pairs of knickers and a pair of jogging bottoms, all Sheila's if I recall correctly.



That's right,Bridget.

Offline maggie

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Re: The Lion,the Witch,the Wardrobe and Jeremy..
« Reply #24 on: February 24, 2013, 12:38:PM »
That's true when she was well,but she had her accident then left her underwear in the kitchen for all to see including Jeremy? I can't conceive of it working out that way. I think June intervened at some point and the practicality of the farmer's wife took over,hence the bloodstained underwear left to soak in buckets.
Steve, I simply cannot agree with you. Sheila would never have let her mum anywhere near her if she had an accident like that.  She was a grown woman who had borne twins. June may have stayed home that evening because Sheila was unwell and in a mess and very withdrawn, she told Pamela Boutflour that Sheila had no interest in the twins, well someone had to put them to bed etc.  Ralph couldn't do it as it was harvest time....makes much more sense to me steve. :)

Offline Bridget

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Re: The Lion,the Witch,the Wardrobe and Jeremy..
« Reply #25 on: February 24, 2013, 12:40:PM »
Steve, I simply cannot agree with you. Sheila would never have let her mum anywhere near her if she had an accident like that.  She was a grown woman who had borne twins. June may have stayed home that evening because Sheila was unwell and in a mess and very withdrawn, she told Pamela Boutflour that Sheila had no interest in the twins, well someone had to put them to bed etc.  Ralph couldn't do it as it was harvest time....makes much more sense to me steve. :)

I agree. Dishcloth lol
....just cos I eat worms...

Offline Steve_uk

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Re: The Lion,the Witch,the Wardrobe and Jeremy..
« Reply #26 on: February 24, 2013, 01:21:PM »
All monotonous tripe without a single shred of evidence. You know what is worse than a downright lie? A half truth and an implication.
Lugg let me give you another chance to respond since your contributions thus far have reached another nadir in self-expression:

1) Jeremy told the relatives he removed the silencer and the sights from the rifle because otherwise it wouldn't fit back into the gun cupboard. This is factually untrue. The real reason was that Jeremy primed the gun for murder knowing that Sheila could not possibly have loaded a magazine into the weapon.

2) As I suspected and confirmed to myself this weekend in Ann Eaton's statement she claims that a kitchen window was always left ajar for the cats to climb in through,so it's a mystery solved as to how Jeremy entered the property that morning.

3) There had been a struggle of some kind in the kitchen during which a ceiling light was smashed and cereal bowls were broken,remains of which were found in the rubbish bin. This should not be confused with the damage the Raid Team caused when entering the kitchen that morning.

4) Jeremy played every trick in the book to delay entry to White House Farm probably praying that Sheila had in fact bled to death as he necessarily needed to shoot her only once to make it look like suicide and the two shots did make it look clumsy. He told the Police Sheila had been indulging in target practice and Ann Eaton that she has been having gun lessons,both complete lies.

5) He perpetuated a lie that June was going to take the twins off Sheila due to her carelessness in looking after them. This was out of character for June who at that stage in her life was not fit to take any big decisions on behalf of anyone and would not have wished to antagonize her children in any way. At most in my opinion it would be Nevill who would suggest some day care for his grandchildren by some local girls in the village to stop any work from looking after them falling on June.

6) Jeremy told Ann Eaton that first morning that Sheila was on the "hard stuff",another blatant lie as can be checked by the toxicology test results. Ann said there were no needle marks on Sheila to which Jeremy replied there "were more sophisticated ways of telling,such as cutting through fatty tissue".

7) Jeremy made a remark to Ann Eaton about the Osea Road caravan business after one of their meetings:"It will be yours and mine in two years time..just you wait and see".

8)Had Jeremy timed the Police response to his telephone call on a stopwatch? Ann Eaton had seen Jeremy with one and it suggests Jeremy did a dummy run on the bicycle before the murders to check out the timings. In any case Jeremy gave himself an extra ten minutes clean up time by claiming to look up the Chelmsford Police number rather than by simply dialling 999 as any sensible person would.

9) Jeremy never speculated as to the workings of the murders,he never discussed them with his relatives,he never expressed any grief for the victims behind closed doors or remorse about leaving the gun out: on the contrary all his actions confirmed only that monetary considerations were in the forefront of his mind."I keep seeing their faces and they are all smiling happy faces" Jeremy told Ann and could have added "because I have put them out of their misery".

10)Jeremy's body language sitting in Nevill's chair,confident and cocky as he assumed control,valuing his parents' heirlooms only in monetary terms:"Do you want to come in and see the goodies..when I come into this room I like to see my things"..the five bodies a distant memory as Jeremy went through the charade of being led through the house by Ann Eaton and at a loss to know how to react,because he felt no pain for any of the victims he killed.

« Last Edit: February 24, 2013, 01:24:PM by Steve_uk »

Offline Steve_uk

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Re: The Lion,the Witch,the Wardrobe and Jeremy..
« Reply #27 on: February 24, 2013, 01:29:PM »

Perhaps you could try putting several items of clothes into a bucket full of water and invite someone to judge what they are without touching or removing them. The removal of blood is made easier by rinsing the garment under cold running water before soaking.
Sheila wasn't in a fit state to know what she was doing,hence the accident in the first place. Once she had come round after her second stay in hospital she could write a legible and coherent letter to Ann Eaton in which she asked for discretion as to her whereabouts,thus possibly expressing shame and embarrassment in her predicament as she felt all too well the stigma associated with mental illness.

Were she in a fit state that Tuesday night or Wednesday morning she would not have left her bloodstained knickers soaking in a bucket for all and sundry to gawp at,but would have washed them herself in the bathroom and took them in her own bedroom to dry off.

Offline Steve_uk

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Re: The Lion,the Witch,the Wardrobe and Jeremy..
« Reply #28 on: February 24, 2013, 01:31:PM »
April,,,there were also day clothes of Sheilas' which she could possibly have changed from at some point during the night/early morning. Not sure of the boys clothes though,as I'd have thought they'd have been in the laundry basket in the bathroom.
There was one dress of Sheila's which Ann Eaton did keep. Far from destroying or tampering with evidence it was the relatives who tried as much as possible to preserve the crime scene.

Offline Steve_uk

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Re: The Lion,the Witch,the Wardrobe and Jeremy..
« Reply #29 on: February 24, 2013, 01:38:PM »
Steve, I simply cannot agree with you. Sheila would never have let her mum anywhere near her if she had an accident like that.  She was a grown woman who had borne twins. June may have stayed home that evening because Sheila was unwell and in a mess and very withdrawn, she told Pamela Boutflour that Sheila had no interest in the twins, well someone had to put them to bed etc.  Ralph couldn't do it as it was harvest time....makes much more sense to me steve. :)

Sheila wasn't in a fit state to make any decisions for herself or the twins. It took her all her time to take them to Paddington Recreation Ground and back to the house. It was the same at White House Farm those last few days when it was Nevill reading Little Red Hen to the twins with Sheila in attendance but in a world of her own. She was guilty only of omission,of exhaustion as the events from Saturday night had caught up with her,and she was really only fit for lying in bed to recuperate from the side-effects of her medication and involving herself with her children in the company of others but not in a position to have care and control on her own.