Julie's allegation of a hitman

[susan]

Morning Lugg
of course if Jeremy had been guilty he would have kept tight control over who went in and out of the farmhouse.  The whole thing is laughable if it was not so serious.  Jeremy by is own innocence ended up serving life for crimes he did not commit.

[lookout]

Morning Lugg
of course if Jeremy had been guilty he would have kept tight control over who went in and out of the farmhouse.  The whole thing is laughable if it was not so serious.  Jeremy by is own innocence ended up serving life for crimes he did not commit.

Morning Susan,,,Jeremy would have been on pins at the thought of someone entering WHF.  In fact,,I'd go as far as to say that he'd have made some excuse of staying there " in case anyone broke in " knowing the place was empty. He'd have filled his boots if he'd been as greedy as he was painted,,jewellery would have been easy to stash in the pocket and nobody would have been any the wiser as to what was there.

[susan]

Morning lookout  had Jeremy been the deceitful cunning murderer that is suggested by some he would not have let anyone in the farmhouse never mind hand over the keys.  He would not have left the silencer behind he would not have discussed it with Julie beforehand then dump her I could go on and on but I would just be repeating what most of us know.

[Lugg]

Thats how i see it Caroline, my personnal view There are lots of conflicting bits of evidence, any one of which is capable of making you think, firstly "Oh yes, he did" and secondly "Oh, no he didn't."
One fact that everyone seems sure of is that there was a lot of confusion on the day itself - hardly surprisingly - and that the police investigation was very badly mishandled.  In the end Jeremy was convicted and was eventually told that he will serve his whole life in jail. Is the conviction safe? He is the only person in the country serving a whole-life sentence who has constantly protested his innocence.
The thing that always grabs me about this case is that I absolutely hate any kind of miscarriage of justice, and that's what haunts me about it too.
If I think back to 1985, I was twenty-six If I think of all the years - - all the things that have happened - - all the places I've been - - so much of my life has happened since that time.
I think that many people would say that the ages between twenty-four and fifty are the prime of life.
It would be horrible to think that Jeremy has missed this part of his life due to some miscarriage of justice.  I don't, of course, know whether or not there has been a miscarriage of justice here.
I think it's impossible for any of us to imagine how that would feel if there is?  Me i will be leaving the forum soon, i feel i have made some really good friends and i hope i have never upset anyone with my posts.  I admire everyone on this forum how they conduct themselves and hope it is kept that way and not become personnal and respect others views, this is mainly due to good moderation.  Just for the record me 70/30 guilt, mum 100 percent innocent dtitched up big time, uncle same view as mum, dad and wife just listen.  my special regards pete

Ralph, you leaving? Surely not? You will be missed. You have helped turn this forum into a sensible place for genuine debate. All the best mate.

[lookout]

When Julie realised that Matthews wasn't involved,,,had she actually said outright that it was Jeremy,,,seeing as she thought it was a two-man thing.?

[maggie]

I kind of understand June´s resentment towards Julie - what kind of a girl does a thing like that. Five dead people and you pose suggestively for money in a rag mag. Eww

I understand it too Alias.  Attitudes changed drastically in the 1980s.  Single parents became acceptable, words such as illegitimate and loose woman disappeared from acceptable  vocabularly and we became far more liberal as a nation. 
June and Neville as pillars of the church and farmers from rural England were no doubt behind the times and most probably held on to the morals of pre liberation England ie 1950s.  It's hardly surprising that they found Julie blatantly living with Jeremy a little difficult to deal with.  It was simply not what their class did!!

[maggie]

Altrincham,Cheshire lookout,a wealthy area surrounded not so far away by pockets of poverty and deprivation.

Steve, I have known a fair few people from Altincham in my youth.  That was before Julie Mugford's time.  Can't say I noticed them being niaive or particularly innocent.  Would say they were quite sophisticated.  The boys I knew from Manchester Grammer were far from unsophisticated but they were lovely

[Alias]

I understand it too Alias.  Attitudes changed drastically in the 1980s.  Single parents became acceptable, words such as illegitimate and loose woman disappeared from acceptable  vocabularly and we became far more liberal as a nation. 
June and Neville as pillars of the church and farmers from rural England were no doubt behind the times and most probably held on to the morals of pre liberation England ie 1950s.  It's hardly surprising that they found Julie blatantly living with Jeremy a little difficult to deal with.  It was simply not what their class did!!

Well, even today what Julie did with that posing on the back of a massive tragedy is really unacceptable I think. It is morally objectionable at any time!

Ralf, please don´t leave, you make some good points. I like your stance and your honesty. A fence sitter myself.

[maggie]

Well, even today what Julie did with that posing on the back of a massive tragedy is really unacceptable I think. It is morally objectionable at any time!

Ralf, please don´t leave, you make some good points. I like your stance and your honesty. A fence sitter mmyself.

I agree that is still unacceptable and yuck.   I think she should have been more aware and understanding of Ralph and June's attitudes in the early 1980s, also.  She seemed lacking in compassion for anyone but herself. imo

[Lugg]

I understand it too Alias.  Attitudes changed drastically in the 1980s.  Single parents became acceptable, words such as illegitimate and loose woman disappeared from acceptable  vocabularly and we became far more liberal as a nation. 
June and Neville as pillars of the church and farmers from rural England were no doubt behind the times and most probably held on to the morals of pre liberation England ie 1950s.  It's hardly surprising that they found Julie blatantly living with Jeremy a little difficult to deal with.  It was simply not what their class did!!

I personally think that the article itself and the pictures she posed for reflect her true nature. I that she cheapened the subject and detracted from the seriousness of the crime she was supposed to found so despicable. Where was the sorrry and regret that she had hooked up with such a supposedly wicked man? On the cantrary she revelled in her notoriety as the "beast's" girlfriend. Either she knew precisely what she was doing? Or she was one of the worst dumbasses that every walked the face of the Earth? Unfortunately whichever choice you make hardly shows her as a gilded rose.

[lookout]

Lugg,,there was also her acting ability when faced as a prosecution witness. Nearly falling in a heap as the tears flowed. Oh,,the drama of it all,,,until questioned by the defence,,then all change. Tears vanished,and the outpouring of accusations and lies just rolled off her tongue.
And Jeremy was supposed to have been the actor.?

[Jane]

I agree that is still unacceptable and yuck.   I think she should have been more aware and understanding of Ralph and June's attitudes in the early 1980s, also.  She seemed lacking in compassion for anyone but herself. imo

Maggkie hi. Just back from a somewhat liquid lunch, but still sober enough to understand that there was nothing about Julie's behaviour which suggested that she had thoughts/compassion for anyone other than herself. Not for one moment could she have considered that she was making money off the back of someone elses tragedy. It was all about how she had suffered. Try looking at histrionic personality disorder.

[Jane]

Lugg,,there was also her acting ability when faced as a prosecution witness. Nearly falling in a heap as the tears flowed. Oh,,the drama of it all,,,until questioned by the defence,,then all change. Tears vanished,and the outpouring of accusations and lies just rolled off her tongue.
And Jeremy was supposed to have been the actor.?

Lookout, I too wondered how it was possible for her to bawl and snivel her way through defence questioning and yet speak with articulate clarity when questioned by prosecution. I think she enjoyed being centre stage. Have you ever looked at histrionic personality disorder?

[maggie]

Maggkie hi. Just back from a somewhat liquid lunch, but still sober enough to understand that there was nothing about Julie's behaviour which suggested that she had thoughts/compassion for anyone other than herself. Not for one moment could she have considered that she was making money off the back of someone elses tragedy. It was all about how she had suffered. Try looking at histrionic personality disorder.

I have looked April and I see exactly what you are getting at.  Have thought for a while there was something 'wrong' with her emotions or lack of them.........very interesting

[susan]

Hello april don't know what histrionic personality disorder is but bet she has got it.  She certainly as some disorder with the way she behaved I cannot find words to describe what I feel for her.  Hope she reads the forum.   I would like to see a retrial and her back here on the stand.