If Sheila Did It

[lebaleb]

The rucked up nightdress is easily explained. Shiela first sat on the floor leaning against the bedside cabinet. Read the bible, then shuffled forward to get into a lying position. Maybe?

[clifford]

are we missing the point that Sheila s body was supposed to have been moved. If this was the case it would explain why the night dress was rucked up. some one could have pulled the body by the feet.

[Kaldin]

I don't think the rucked up nightdress is relevant. It could have got that way by her sitting on the floor regardless of who shot her.

[clifford]

I was only making the point that people are saying that Sheila would not have wished to be found with her nightdress rucked up.

[TheBrilliantMistake]

If Sheila went to so much care to wash, re-dress etc, why no underwear? Why lay down in such a way that her nightdress was rucked up underneath her?
That doesn't fit with her laying herself out, Ophelia style.

I cannot offer an explanation at this stage as to why she was not wearing underwear when found by the police but what I will say is I don't believe her nightdress would be in such a position when or if she shot herself. I don't believe she was found "Ophelia style". Do you not find it strange that June was also photographed in this position? I find it highly unlikely that either of them would have fallen in these respective postions after being shot.

There is speculation that June managed to pull herself up by holding on to the door,  then slid back down against it, presumably to topple over, or receive the final forehead shot and be pushed aside into that position.

It's the way their legs are dead straight - I dunno, there's something odd about it all.

It's odd I agree, but odd 'either way'.
If she shot herself, I can see her sitting in a 'proper' manner, legs parallel etc, but her final resting position seems rather odd that she was neither sat up (back to the bedside table, or lying down with enough room for head)

If she was murdered and placed then that's a logic reason for straight legs, but the head angle still looks questionable for someone putting a body in place.

I do wonder what the effect of recoil and impact would be on her head position, IF she lay down with just enough headroom, then pulled the trigger... maybe this would cause the awkward tilt of the head?

[lebaleb]

It's pointless speculating about what she was or wasn't wearing. People having delusions often walk about naked or strangely dressed, they don't realise they are.

[chelmsey]

It's pointless speculating about what she was or wasn't wearing. People having delusions often walk about naked or strangely dressed, they don't realise they are.

Absolutely.But youd think that if Sheila was having her period,then shed at least be wearing some knickers? Also,there was a pair of jogging bottoms soaking in the bucket and evidence that the shower had been used.Maybe she got caught short,went off for a shower whilst her mother put the item in to soak.Its just the kind of thing a 61 year old woman would do.

[Dr Pal]

Sheila was also wearing a petticoat which became heavily bloodstained, according to Mike Tesko. There is a thread on this forum with a link to a photograph of this petticoat but unfortunately the link no longer works. I have asked Mike at least three times if he could repost the photograph but I have had no response.

Aside from that, I would like to submit a further theory from a women's point of view lol. Maybe Sheila was fully clothed whilst committing the four murders but then washed and changed into her nightdress before committing suicide. I have read that sufferers of paranoid schizophrenia do undertake such ritualistic behaviour. This could also account for the lack of forensic evidence found upon her body.

She must have manicured all her nails too and done all this to frame Bamber..All this is nonsense I'm afraid.
Remember Bamber says she was unconscious in the Kitchen, so all this she must have done behind the backs of a house full of Police and not one of them Knowing or hearing anything.

[Dr Pal]

Possible i suppose but if Neville phoned Jeremy sometime around  3.30am (ish) and said sheila had a gun (no mention that she had shot anyone at this point ) and then police arrived before 4am i dont see she would have time to shoot her whole family, clean up the guns and then wash and change. Yeh the police didnt enter the house till 7am but if my hiuse was surrounded by armed police i wouldnt bother having a wash iz be watching exactly what was going off and not getti g distracted for even a second.

The police didn't enter the house until 7.35am. That gives Sheila 4 hours to finish the murders, wash, change and then kill herself.

There was an open phone line being monitured and no sounds were heard.
They would have head two shotds dont you think.

There was an open phone line being monitored and no sounds were heard.
They would have head two shots don't you think as well.

[TheBrilliantMistake]

Either Sheila shot them all naked, or she miraculously disposed of her stained clothes, changed into a nightdress and shot herself.

[TheBrilliantMistake]

Possible i suppose but if Neville phoned Jeremy sometime around  3.30am (ish) and said sheila had a gun (no mention that she had shot anyone at this point ) and then police arrived before 4am i dont see she would have time to shoot her whole family, clean up the guns and then wash and change. Yeh the police didnt enter the house till 7am but if my hiuse was surrounded by armed police i wouldnt bother having a wash iz be watching exactly what was going off and not getti g distracted for even a second.

The police didn't enter the house until 7.35am. That gives Sheila 4 hours to finish the murders, wash, change and then kill herself.

There was an open phone line being monitured and no sounds were heard.
They would have head two shotds dont you think.

There was an open phone line being monitored and no sounds were heard.
They would have head two shots don't you think as well.

We've established that shot with the silencer are incredibly quiet, without, would be unlikely to be heard if the shots where upstairs and the phone in the kitchen.

[Dr Pal]

Possible i suppose but if Neville phoned Jeremy sometime around  3.30am (ish) and said sheila had a gun (no mention that she had shot anyone at this point ) and then police arrived before 4am i dont see she would have time to shoot her whole family, clean up the guns and then wash and change. Yeh the police didnt enter the house till 7am but if my hiuse was surrounded by armed police i wouldnt bother having a wash iz be watching exactly what was going off and not getti g distracted for even a second.

The police didn't enter the house until 7.35am. That gives Sheila 4 hours to finish the murders, wash, change and then kill herself.

There was an open phone line being monitured and no sounds were heard.
They would have head two shotds dont you think.

There was an open phone line being monitored and no sounds were heard.
They would have head two shots don't you think as well.

We've established that shot with the silencer are incredibly quiet, without, would be unlikely to be heard if the shots where upstairs and the phone in the kitchen.

It was impossible to shoot herself with the silencer on and they would have heard her rushing around the house on the phone with all the washing going on i think.

[mb1]

The barking dog could be heard on the open line - it was discovered upstairs, under the main bed.
I'm assuming whoever was listening in - BT alone or accompanied by officers sent to the exchange? - was really listening.
The phone was feet away from the bucket with soaking underwear. Wouldn't they have heard that being carried and placed on the floor?

Dr Pal - by washing, do you mean SC showering and dressing, laundering her blood-spattered clothes and gloves, or both?

[jon]

Sheila was also wearing a petticoat which became heavily bloodstained, according to Mike Tesko. There is a thread on this forum with a link to a photograph of this petticoat but unfortunately the link no longer works. I have asked Mike at least three times if he could repost the photograph but I have had no response.

Aside from that, I would like to submit a further theory from a women's point of view lol. Maybe Sheila was fully clothed whilst committing the four murders but then washed and changed into her nightdress before committing suicide. I have read that sufferers of paranoid schizophrenia do undertake such ritualistic behaviour. This could also account for the lack of forensic evidence found upon her body.

She must have manicured all her nails too and done all this to frame Bamber..All this is nonsense I'm afraid.
Remember Bamber says she was unconscious in the Kitchen, so all this she must have done behind the backs of a house full of Police and not one of them Knowing or hearing anything.

Where does Bamber say she was unconscious in the kitchen ?

[chelmsey]

The barking dog could be heard on the open line - it was discovered upstairs, under the main bed.
I'm assuming whoever was listening in - BT alone or accompanied by officers sent to the exchange? - was really listening.
The phone was feet away from the bucket with soaking underwear. Wouldn't they have heard that being carried and placed on the floor?

Dr Pal - by washing, do you mean SC showering and dressing, laundering her blood-spattered clothes and gloves, or both?

Dog was found in a cupboard in the main bedroom,and it was removed quickly  so as to not disturb the scene.