She's got the gun

[Bridget]

Bridget, one of the problems I have is with all the little "extras" that are attributed to Jeremy. OK, mostly by Steve :D He "arranges" Sheila's body. He places a bible strategically. He takes the trouble to "brand" his father, something which must have taken considerable time because whatever was used must have need reheating. It would, IMO, have required total calm. A total disregard for the carnage and detritus of so many deaths. This is why I believe who ever was responsible must have been almost unaware of what they were doing. I don't think Jeremy could have done that, cycled home, calmed himself down to the point where he was coherent enough to call the police and then return to the farmhouse without visualizing what he had done inside it.  I think at some point he would have gone into shock. It wasn't as if he had a background of violence.

I suppose we all take different views on these things April. I don't see the bible as having been placed "strategically". I think he just saw it on the side and thought it would add a nice touch to his scenario. It wouldn't have taken more than a second to drop it there and was probably very much an afterthought. With regards the marks to Neville's back, I would agree that it doesn't really fit but I can't be sure that they were inflicted during the course of the murders. Even if they were, it hardly fits with the psychotic rampage theory either.

[Bridget]

If he did plan it all for a year, then it was a shoddy bit of planning I'd say. If he did then why all these senarios on the forum? We'd know exactly how he did it.

I think it would be more accurate to say that he planned to do it for a year, not that he planned the actual way he was going to do it for a year. I believe it was an opportunistic killing in the end.

[lookout]

Bridget, one of the problems I have is with all the little "extras" that are attributed to Jeremy. OK, mostly by Steve :D He "arranges" Sheila's body. He places a bible strategically. He takes the trouble to "brand" his father, something which must have taken considerable time because whatever was used must have need reheating. It would, IMO, have required total calm. A total disregard for the carnage and detritus of so many deaths. This is why I believe who ever was responsible must have been almost unaware of what they were doing. I don't think Jeremy could have done that, cycled home, calmed himself down to the point where he was coherent enough to call the police and then return to the farmhouse without visualizing what he had done inside it.  I think at some point he would have gone into shock. It wasn't as if he had a background of violence.

Jeremy just wasn't the type to have killed in such a way without appearing that he did it. If he'd committed the carnage,,,it certainly would have showed,,,no doubt about that,whatsoever. He would have been in an unholy mess of  blood and sheer exhaustion,,,,with possibly an immediate confession.

I've actually experienced a confrontation by a killer in the past. A young man whom I got on well with and was teaching him to write and to learn the English language. On the face of it,,he was a pleasant,,,willing to learn chap who put a lot of trust in me,,,,, and my daughters who were very young at the time,,,loved him because he was so happy with them and they with him.
However,,,this incident spills over to involve a big case,,of which I can't say much about,,,but this young man actually came to me,,blood on his clothing,,dishevelled,,the usual sign that he'd  perhaps" been in a fight ",,so when I questioned him,,,he'd actually murdered a girl and didn't know what to do. I obviously directed him to the nearest police station where he gave himself up.
What the young chap didn't confide in was that he was having relationship problems,,,and I'm sure that if he'd told me,,,I could have helped him.
Like Sheila,,,he hadn't displayed any violence and was more than happy when he was with the girls and myself and said he felt " safe ".  I would say now,that his " illness " was well hidden,,because of his  "highs",,,then probably " lows " when he left our company.
At no stage would I have said that he was capable of murder. This happened in the 70's.

[Alias]

I answered you in reply #310

Had a look at 310. I didn´t see that as an answer - not that you HAVE to answer me.

[Bridget]

Had a look at 310. I didn´t see that as an answer - not that you HAVE to answer me.

Oh ok, I'll try harder

I don't think he could have counted on her sleeping through, I think he believed he'd be able to deal with all 3 adults asleep or awake. He had the advantages of the rifle and the element of surprise. I think he probably overestimated the killing power of the rifle.

[lookout]

Oh ok, I'll try harder

I don't think he could have counted on her sleeping through, I think he believed he'd be able to deal with all 3 adults asleep or awake. He had the advantages of the rifle and the element of surprise. I think he probably overestimated the killing power of the rifle.

" He " had enough shots from the rifle to make that possible.!

[Reader]

. . . there was a stabbing only the other week of a Long Sutton inmate . . .

There are prisons named Long Lartin and Full Sutton, but not Long Sutton (as far as I know).

I suspect some do (hence the knife attack) and some don't.

Did you mean that the other way round?

. . .  sometimes criminals have a greater sense of justice than those who claim to uphold the law.

The majority know he is innocent. They have a sixth sense about other prisoners. More than we do, . . .

It doesn't require a "sense of justice" or "sixth sense" to recognize that someone is being truthful. However, that is not the same thing as knowing that Jeremy is innocent (of the killings).

[Please do not quote this post in full if replying to just a part of it.]

[Lugg]

I think it would be more accurate to say that he planned to do it for a year, not that he planned the actual way he was going to do it for a year. I believe it was an opportunistic killing in the end.

That doesn't make sense Bridget. What else would he be planning?

[Lugg]

There are prisons named Long Lartin and Full Sutton, but not Long Sutton (as far as I know).
Did you mean that the other way round?

It doesn't require a "sense of justice" or "sixth sense" to recognize that someone is being truthful. However, that is not the same thing as knowing that Jeremy is innocent (of the killings).

[Please do not quote this post in full if replying to just a part of it.]

You never fail to surprise me reader. You must be hell to live with?

[Bridget]

That doesn't make sense Bridget. What else would he be planning?

What I'm saying is that he planned to kill them for a year, i.e he mulled over and expressed a variety of different half formulated methods by which to do so. This is as opposed to taking a year to hone and refine the actual method which he later carried out.

[Lugg]

What I'm saying is that he planned to kill them for a year, i.e he mulled over and expressed a variety of different half formulated methods by which to do so. This is as opposed to taking a year to hone and refine the actual method which he later carried out.

Oh right. In other words it was in essence an unplanned killing, or on the spur of the moment.

[Bridget]

Oh right. In other words it was in essence an unplanned killing, or on the spur of the moment.

Sort of yes, in that he hadn't put it in his diary as a thing to do that particular day.

[Patti]

What I'm saying is that he planned to kill them for a year, i.e he mulled over and expressed a variety of different half formulated methods by which to do so. This is as opposed to taking a year to hone and refine the actual method which he later carried out.

How do you know he planned this for a year, are you not going on hearsay, here Bridget? 

[Bridget]

How do you know he planned this for a year, are you not going on hearsay, here Bridget? 

No, I'm going by JMs evidence as to what he told her.

[lookout]

I wonder how many people have said something " out of turn " at sometime in their lives,,,and it's actually happened. This is what's happened in Jeremys' case I imagine.