Jeremy Bamber: the Prelude, the Tragedy and the Aftermath

[Caroline]

I appreciate we don't have a degree in psychologies and good spacial awareness but are you able to explain why not rather than just a "No"?

No need to feel inferior - it's not your fault! Perhaps you shouldn't ask about qualifications if not having a degree bugs you so much. However ...

There is a MASSIVE difference in the kind of 'violence' displayed by Sheila and picking up a rifle to shoot 5 people - including your own children - DEAD. Sheila didn't ask for the gun, Jeremy did, Sheila didn't know how to fire it or how to fill the magazine, Jeremy did. Sheila didn't conveniently leave out the gun, Jeremy did - Sheila didn't discuss (with various people) wanting to kill her parents - Jeremy did.

[JackiePreece]

No need to feel inferior - it's not your fault! Perhaps you shouldn't ask about qualifications if not having a degree bugs you so much. However ...

There is a MASSIVE difference in the kind of 'violence' displayed by Sheila and picking up a rifle to shoot 5 people - including your own children - DEAD. Sheila didn't ask for the gun, Jeremy did, Sheila didn't know how to fire it or how to fill the magazine, Jeremy did. Sheila didn't conveniently leave out the gun, Jeremy did - Sheila didn't discuss (with various people) wanting to kill her parents - Jeremy did.

I don't have a degree in psychologies that's why I was aksing you as the subject matter relates to psychologies.  I'm not the feeling inferior type.  How do you know I don't have a degree?

But Colin and Freddie said Sheila displayed angry outbursts and there's no evidence Jeremy did. 

How do we know Sheila didn't know how to fill the magazine?  It's not difficult.

Jeremy said he left the gun out but chances are Nevill put it away.  Not difficult for someone in the house to go to the gun cupboard and find the gun.

Only Julie said Jeremy wanted to kill his parents.   

[Caroline]

I don't have a degree in psychologies that's why I was aksing you as the subject matter relates to psychologies.  I'm not the feeling inferior type.  How do you know I don't have a degree?

But Colin and Freddie said Sheila displayed angry outbursts and there's no evidence Jeremy did. 

How do we know Sheila didn't know how to fill the magazine?  It's not difficult.

Jeremy said he left the gun out but chances are Nevill put it away.  Not difficult for someone in the house to go to the gun cupboard and find the gun.

Only Julie said Jeremy wanted to kill his parents.

Like I have just posted on the 'Why Jeremy is Innocent' thread - he bottled things up and harboured resentment about both his adoption and being ushered off to boarding school. Sheila let out her anger. Everyone has a temper, it's strange that he seems to have been so controlled, although not so much when he pushed a cake in someone's face. He didn't like being the brunt of a joke - but liked to tease others.

Sheila had never seen the gun before and it's too much of a coincidence that Jeremy left out the gun, just on the night that 'Sheila went crazy'.

No, Jeremy told someone else (I will have to look up his name) about his plan to burn down the farm.

[maggie]

I don't have a degree in psychologies that's why I was aksing you as the subject matter relates to psychologies.  I'm not the feeling inferior type.  How do you know I don't have a degree?

But Colin and Freddie said Sheila displayed angry outbursts and there's no evidence Jeremy did. 

How do we know Sheila didn't know how to fill the magazine?  It's not difficult.

Jeremy said he left the gun out but chances are Nevill put it away.  Not difficult for someone in the house to go to the gun cupboard and find the gun.

Only Julie said Jeremy wanted to kill his parents.

Colin did say that Jeremy used to break the heads off the flowers in the garden and on many occasions walked home 20 miles after a fall out with his father.  Colin believes this was the way Jeremy coped with the fact he was not allowed to express his own feelings and opinions.  So he must have bottled up all that anger and frustration against the people who stopped him expressing himself and tried to control him.  It was a very unhealthy situation.

[Caroline]

Colin did say that Jeremy used to break the heads of the flowers in the garden and on many occasions walked home 20 miles after a fall out with his father.  Colin believes this was the way Jeremy coped with the fact he was not allowed to express his own feelings and opinions.  So he must have bottled up all that anger and frustration against the people who stopped him expressing himself and tried to control him.  It was a very unhealthy situation.

Totally agree Maggie and I think resentment bred more resentment. The crime scene was very violent - the pressure cooker finally burst.

[John]

Like I have just posted on the 'Why Jeremy is Innocent' thread - he bottled things up and harboured resentment about both his adoption and being ushered off to boarding school. Sheila let out her anger. Everyone has a temper, it's strange that he seems to have been so controlled, although not so much when he pushed a cake in someone's face. He didn't like being the brunt of a joke - but liked to tease others.

Sheila had never seen the gun before and it's too much of a coincidence that Jeremy left out the gun, just on the night that 'Sheila went crazy'.

No, Jeremy told someone else (I will have to look up his name) about his plan to burn down the farm.

According to some Julie Mugford invented that story about torching the farmhouse but tellingly, Bamber never denied it.

[Steve_uk]

To be fair to Jackie there must be thousands of teenage boys who have done all these things to their parents and grown out of the phase. I think circumstances came together with such incredible happenstance to put into his mind a way out from his predicament, summed up in the "tonight's the night..it's now or never" speech to Julie, suggesting that very possibly all this was a flight of fancy which may well all have blown over..

[Caroline]

According to some Julie Mugford invented that story about torching the farmhouse but tellingly, Bamber never denied it.

No he hasn't. I'm sure that he did tell someone else but I can't remember their name - I think Steve has posted about it before?

[Steve_uk]

No he hasn't. I'm sure that he did tell someone else but I can't remember their name - I think Steve has posted about it before?

Well I don't think he ever entrusted his murder plot to anyone except Julie, but he did go on a rant to James Richards that "I hate my f***ing parents."

[Jane]

Well I don't think he ever entrusted his murder plot to anyone except Julie, but he did go on a rant to James Richards that "I hate my f***ing parents."

He told RWB "I could easily kill my parents".

[Steve_uk]

He told RWB "I could easily kill my parents".

Yes it does seem strange that he said that. I wonder if he ever warned Nevill?

[Caroline]

Well I don't think he ever entrusted his murder plot to anyone except Julie, but he did go on a rant to James Richards that "I hate my f***ing parents."

Yes, there was him but he did mention to someone about burning the house down. I'll have to try and remember. It's a cast of thousands! 

[JackiePreece]

Like I have just posted on the 'Why Jeremy is Innocent' thread - he bottled things up and harboured resentment about both his adoption and being ushered off to boarding school. Sheila let out her anger. Everyone has a temper, it's strange that he seems to have been so controlled, although not so much when he pushed a cake in someone's face. He didn't like being the brunt of a joke - but liked to tease others.

Sheila had never seen the gun before and it's too much of a coincidence that Jeremy left out the gun, just on the night that 'Sheila went crazy'.

No, Jeremy told someone else (I will have to look up his name) about his plan to burn down the farm.

But Sheila was also adopted and sent off to boarding school. Why would Jeremy be angry about being adopted?  Lots of people are adopted like Steve Jobs and Michael Gove.  They are not angry are they?

Most people I know don't have a temper at all.  I have a friend who was adopted and she's very laid back and I have never known her to be angry.

Jeremy was annoyed with Susan Battersley squeezing his neck with dairy cream.  A bit insensitive I would say when you could say a dairy cream cannister sprayed on his neck might have reminded him of gunshots to his family.

It reminds me of that nasty b***h that shouted "bang, bang" at PC David Rathband

http://www.theguardian.com/uk/2011/jun/27/woman-jail-raoul-moat-jeer

[David1819]

Sheila didn't ask for the gun, Jeremy did

Jeremy works on the farm, he has to shoot pests.

Sheila didn't know how to fire it or how to fill the magazine,

There is no substance to this claim. you take a leap of faith

[maggie]

But Sheila was also adopted and sent off to boarding school. Why would Jeremy be angry about being adopted?  Lots of people are adopted like Steve Jobs and Michael Gove.  They are not angry are they?

Most people I know don't have a temper at all.  I have a friend who was adopted and she's very laid back and I have never known her to be angry.

Jeremy was annoyed with Susan Battersley squeezing his neck with dairy cream.  A bit insensitive I would say when you could say a dairy cream cannister sprayed on his neck might have reminded him of gunshots to his family.

It reminds me of that nasty b***h that shouted "bang, bang" at PC David Rathband

http://www.theguardian.com/uk/2011/jun/27/woman-jail-raoul-moat-jeer

Hi Jackie, All babies removed from their mothers in the first couple of years of life suffer from loss and difficulties with attachment unless they bond on a deep level with a permanent replacement mother/carer.  Even those who bond and grow up in secure loving homes usually at some time have problems with self worth etc.  I recommend The Primal Wound... it explains about the adoptee, the adoptive mother and the natural mother and their feelings and emotions.  Worth a read.

Steve |Jobs is dead and I know nothing about his adoptive family but his drive to succeed and prove himself may have grown because he had a lack of self worth etc. or not.  Michael Gove another one who needed to be top dog, goodness knows what goes on in that head. .... 

I am not saying all adoptees are ready to go for the jugular, in fact the point is that most bury their feelings and insecurities in various ways and many will only show them if they have to face the reality of their adoption or not but we all have buttons which can be pressed by certain situations or phrases and  the result depends on the anger and frustration which has built up around such sore spots, if the pressure is very high it can blow and then things can get out of hand very quickly.