Nevill's Premonition?

[susan]

Yeltrah  you are as much as a burns expert as the rest of us.  Burns too big for a cigarette burn but I think maybe a cigar could do it but the poker would have to have a rounded end I would have thought but I also think he rifle could have been responsible sadly we will never really know   Did the Police ever give an explanation for the burns.  Wonder why these burn marks were inflicted.

[maggie]

Based solely on the visual appearance in the image posted by Nickos, they do not appear similar, I don't know about a cigar/cigarette burn, I think the marks are too severe and a cigar might not be robust enough to make all three marks.
A poker still seems plausable depending on the shape and they did find one in the gun cupboard next to the silencer, so maybe. 

Of course I'm no burns expert, so what do I know.

I just feel Simon McKay and his team surely must have done a certain amount of research before spending the precious money on the American tests.  I go with the idea that the highest burn was done when Nevill's head was dropped forward and his skin was taught, hence the different shape when his head  was in an upright position....gather the photo was taken when he was lying on his front. Can't go with the poker idea it's the wrong shape and the cigar....not sure of the circumference of a large cigar but I agree I don't think it would be robust enough to withstand three burns. imo

[lookout]

Based solely on the visual appearance in the image posted by Nickos, they do not appear similar, I don't know about a cigar/cigarette burn, I think the marks are too severe and a cigar might not be robust enough to make all three marks.
A poker still seems plausable depending on the shape and they did find one in the gun cupboard next to the silencer, so maybe. 

Of course I'm no burns expert, so what do I know.

Hartley,,,I worked on a childrens' ward where children who were abused by cigarette burns were treated. A cigarette burn is exactly the same as Nevilles' burns,and the only difference is the circumference,which I say is a cigar. 
Needless to say,,a hardened nurse like myself cried every time. 

[-Harters-]

Yeltrah  you are as much as a burns expert as the rest of us.  Burns too big for a cigarette burn but I think maybe a cigar could do it but the poker would have to have a rounded end I would have thought but I also think he rifle could have been responsible sadly we will never really know   Did the Police ever give an explanation for the burns.  Wonder why these burn marks were inflicted.

They just said they could have been caused by a poker, but I don't think that opinion had any scientific base to it.
It was left alone by the defence and prosecution, so it's a mystery.

We could always ask Jeremy how they were caused, there is a chance he would know?   

[-Harters-]

Hartley,,,I worked on a childrens' ward where children who were abused by cigarette burns were treated. A cigarette burn is exactly the same as Nevilles' burns,and the only difference is the circumference,which I say is a cigar. 
Needless to say,,a hardened nurse like myself cried every time.

What a world we live in hey?. 

[killingeve]

Dr Fowler, of the recent JR fame, indicates in the judgement in paragraph 34, that Ralph had residue consistant with contact shots.

Also the 2002 appeal and the associated blood evidence indicates that Sheila, Ralph & Junes blood was present in the silencer. I also thought I had read that another male blood had been detected which they attributed to one of the twins, but I can't seem to find where I read that now. 

Hi Yeltrah

Yes BUT the initial findings in 1985 by Vanezis and the ballistics expert (Malcolm Fletcher) show only Nicholas as having definite contact shots.  I can find no documentary evidence of his blood being present in the silencer or gun, or any suggestion of an intimate mix, which is what I would have expected to have found given that Sheila's and/or an initimate mix of Nevill and June's blood is said to have been found from shots that seem to have some ambiguity surrounding them in terms of whether they were contact or near contact or not. 

Assuming Sheila, Nevill and June received shots sufficient for back spatter to occur then why did back spatter not occur with Nicholas given his two confirmed contact shots?  Maybe anatomy plays a role 

[susan]

Yeltrah  bet he would'ent tell us

[maggie]

They just said they could have been caused by a poker, but I don't think that opinion had any scientific base to it.
It was left alone by the defence and prosecution, so it's a mystery.

We could always ask Jeremy how they were caused, there is a chance he would know? 

The three circles do have connections with various spiritual beliefs from witchcraft to christianity.  I find it hard to believe that Jeremy Bamber would be aware of such things, but feel pretty sure Sheila would.

[susan]

Hi Mags we have discussed this in detail about religious connotations before re: the burn marks.  Caroline told us it was a special day Feast of ........ we will have to ask her when she comes on it was quite a significant religious feast.

[Lugg]

Lookout  I agree with you cigar burns would have made marks similar to those on Ralphs back or the heated rifle but not for the poker idea too pointed the end.

Trouble is of course we are none of us experts as ngb has reminded us. Come to think of it neither are the CCRC.

[Lugg]

Hartley,,,I worked on a childrens' ward where children who were abused by cigarette burns were treated. A cigarette burn is exactly the same as Nevilles' burns,and the only difference is the circumference,which I say is a cigar. 
Needless to say,,a hardened nurse like myself cried every time.

Who would cause such suffering to a child? Some of these things are beyond me.

[maggie]

Hi Mags we have discussed this in detail about religious connotations before re: the burn marks.  Caroline told us it was a special day Feast of ........ we will have to ask her when she comes on it was quite a significant religious feast.

Hi susie, yes I think it was the Transfiguration that was celebrated on that day and the bible was open at the page marking that day.
Of course they may only be marks to see if Neville was alive but the way they are placed in a line appears to possibly be symbolic to my mind. 

[susan]

Maggie I think there was more to it that jsut seeing if poor Ralph was still alive it was symbolic in someway poor man

[Steve_uk]

Hi Yeltrah

Yes BUT the initial findings in 1985 by Vanezis and the ballistics expert (Malcolm Fletcher) show only Nicholas as having definite contact shots.  I can find no documentary evidence of his blood being present in the silencer or gun, or any suggestion of an intimate mix, which is what I would have expected to have found given that Sheila's and/or an initimate mix of Nevill and June's blood is said to have been found from shots that seem to have some ambiguity surrounding them in terms of whether they were contact or near contact or not. 

Assuming Sheila, Nevill and June received shots sufficient for back spatter to occur then why did back spatter not occur with Nicholas given his two confirmed contact shots?  Maybe anatomy plays a role 

It does seem strange. Malcolm Fletcher at trial put forward the explanation that the first shot to Nicholas may not have been contact in nature yet may still have proved fatal,therefore stopping any further blood flow.

[susan]

By the way I don't have something on the top righthand side of my screen to correct an error in my post they forgot to give me one