Sheila attempted to commit suicide (but failed), and was shot by the police...

[mike tesko]

If Sheila shoots herself or is accidentally shot in the kitchen during the struggle with Nevill then lies there either incapacitated or pretending to be dead,which would explain the Police report of one male body and one female body in the kitchen,what is the time frame for the first set of photographs taken of Sheila which show a free flow of blood on her face and neck? Are you saying that in the first set of photographs taken the Police were photographing a person who was still alive?

The photograph which I have seen of Sheila on the bed with only one wound to her throat / neck was taken when Sheila was unknowingly still alive. The photograph I removed from the album at Ewen Smiths office at the beginning of 2004, that I sent to Jeremy and which has been confiscated by prison security, shows Sheila on the bed with no blood running from the corners of her mouth, and back into her left eye socket. So, yes, police did photograph Sheila on the bed when she was not actually dead, despite the fact that she had already been pronounced as being dead by the police surgeon, Dr Craig at 8:44am...

Nothing could be any clearer than that / this...

[tonyb]

The photograph which I have seen of Sheila on the bed with only one wound to her throat / neck was taken when Sheila was unknowingly still alive. The photograph I removed from the album at Ewen Smiths office at the beginning of 2004, that I sent to Jeremy and which has been confiscated by prison security, shows Sheila on the bed with no blood running from the corners of her mouth, and back into her left eye socket. So, yes, police did photograph Sheila on the bed when she was not actually dead, despite the fact that she had already been pronounced as being dead by the police surgeon, Dr Craig at 8:44am...

Nothing could be any clearer than that / this...

But was it a close up shot,from a distance you may be mistaken...The photo you relieved from smith,so to speak?

[tonyb]

This photo Mike,it's always confused me.first it was one bullet wound,then an unshaven vagina without a tampon inserted,now a picture of her mouth?
Must of been one hell of a wide angle lens mike....

[mike tesko]

How does Sheila get from the kitchen where she is shot with a gun with the silencer fitted,move upstairs then scatter her religious messages with the bible,not to mention the other suicide note in capital letters,then wait until the Police enter the bedroom?

There was no evidence given by any police officer about how she actually managed to get upstairs into the bedroom, but police believed that she used the small spiral staircase in the corner of the kitchen to get from downstairs to upstairs, and that once the alarm was raised that her body had disappeared from the kitchen, she was discovered upstairs collapsed on the bed. The gun she used to shoot herself with in the side of the neck was not taken upstairs with her, it was left downstairs and this was seized by DS "Stan" Jones, later that same morning under the identifying mark of SBJ/1, which was the .22 bolt action  rifle and silencer owned by Anthony Pargeter. Sheila shot herself with use of the Pargeter rifle, not the family owned Anshulz rifle. The notes and everything else was not distributed after she fled upstairs from the kitchen, this was done beforehand. She did not flee upstairs and then wait for the police to come and get her, as you try to suggest, she actually collapsed on the bed and was unconscious when police managed to relocate her...

[mike tesko]

This photo Mike,it's always confused me.first it was one bullet wound,then an unshaven vagina without a tampon inserted,now a picture of her mouth?
Must of been one hell of a wide angle lens mike....

There is nothing at all confusing about it, I have always maintained that there was no blood running or leaking or pouring from the corners of her mouth in the photograph I removed from the "Senior Investigating officers album", at Ewen Smiths Office, at the beginning of 2004. And, I have since been shown a photograph which was taken of Sheila on the bed with only one wound to her throat / neck, consistent with what the police surgeon, Dr Craig, has spoken about when he pronounced her as being dead at 8:44am - lets get the facts right so that you cannot try to twist what I am saying, Dr Craig made a witness statement saying that at 8:44am, he pronounced Sheila as being dead at a time when her body was on the far side of the bed, with a solitary wound to her neck. I am not interested in arguing over what he meant when he said what he said, I know what I have seen and what I have been shown, and I am not interested any more in repeating what I have already said about the matter. If no-one believes what I am saying I personally don't give a flying fuck...

[Steve_uk]

Am I right in saying that both bullets with which Sheila was shot were lighter than the others which were used to kill the other victims and what is the significance of this? I took Andrew Hunter's draft to mean that more than one weapon was used in the killings but as has been pointed out this is not necessarily so. Are you also saying that Dr. Craig made a mistake in his diagnosis of Sheila and that some time after that she was shot which has been covered up all this time,even with the £1 million reward on offer for information such as this?

You must bear with us Mike as the devil may be in the detail in this case,which reminds me..I urge you once again to remove your Sheila thread..

[tonyb]

There is nothing at all confusing about it, I have always maintained that there was no blood running or leaking or pouring from the corners of her mouth in the photograph I removed from the "Senior Investigating officers album", at Ewen Smiths Office, at the beginning of 2004. And, I have since been shown a photograph which was taken of Sheila on the bed with only one wound to her throat / neck, consistent with what the police surgeon, Dr Craig, has spoken about when he pronounced her as being dead at 8:44am - lets get the facts right so that you cannot try to twist what I am saying, Dr Craig made a witness statement saying that at 8:44am, he pronounced Sheila as being dead at a time when her body was on the far side of the bed, with a solitary wound to her neck. I am not interested in arguing over what he meant when he said what he said, I know what I have seen and what I have been shown, and I am not interested any more in repeating what I have already said about the matter. If no-one believes what I am saying I personally don't give a flying fuck...

Quote from: mike tesko on July 15, 2012, 09:33:PM
I will say the following on the matter, and you will be well advised to take note of what I am saying - The photograph of Sheila on the bed which I have taken control of back in 2003, shows Sheila with pubic hair in her most private parts. Now I am not seeking to try and make out that there is anything sexual in what I am saying, I am merely pointing out that she was unshaven or untrimmed - now anybody who wants to know the truth (especially those in high places, and in positions of influence) only has to find out if what I have described was / is the truth?

Without being too specific, or intend to appear rude or perverted, but I would also like to add that there was no evidence that a tampon had been internally inserted, in the photograph I have taken control and possession of back at the beginning of 2003 from Ewen Smith (at his offices in Birmingham) - Now any of you can choose to believe anything you want to, I don't particularly care any more...

I just struggle to see how a single photo will show the detail,you describe. As an avid lensman I'd of thought you'd see the limitations of getting it all in one frame?

I am getting fucking fed up of telling the truth and being accused of all manner of things...

[tonyb]

Sorry,the last lines mikes....
Poor,poor editing on my part.

[mike tesko]

If she resists arrest and the Police feel they were in danger they can justify shooting her without a cover-up. Why do the Police have to stage-manage a death,and how does the rifle manage to discharge in the bedroom?

First of all, Sheila did not resist arrest as you try to put it. She was unconscious on the bed, and in these circumstances the police could not justify shooting her. Fact of the matter is, police used the rifle which was propped up against the left hand side window Jamb (as observed from the vantage point of being inside the main bedroom) to falsely suggest that she had taken her own life on the bed (upstairs) to try and cover for the mistake of her being originally found downstairs in the kitchen, and declared to be already dead by members of the raid team at 7:37am - "the body of one dead male, and the body of one dead female found in kitchen upon entry". This was in addition to the police surgeon, Dr Craig, later pronouncing Sheila as being dead inside the bedroom, her body being "on the far side of the bed with only a solitary wound to her neck" by 8:44am. If you study the available crime scene photographic evidence, it will become apparent to all and sundry that police moved the rifle from the window about on Sheila's body at a time when it had not been checked to see if it was still loaded with bullets, or if it was safe to handle? You will see the barrel of the anshulz rifle in different positions upon Sheila's body, in particular that the end of the guns barrel was at one stage beneath her chin and later resting against the side of her neck. You will also note that the positioning of Sheila Caffells right hand and fingers were photographed in different positions upon and around the guns trigger mechanism. Surely, it is not that difficult to imagine that whilst the police were busy reconstructing the scene to make it appear as though Sheila's body had been found in the bedroom, rather than downstairs in the region of the kitchen, that the rifle actually discharged a second bullet that penetrated beneath her chin and killed her...

According to the police, no-one moved or touched the body or any exhibits until after PC David Bird had taken all of his photographs, yet the photographs he took tell a completely different story...

[Steve_uk]

Didn't I read somewhere that Jeremy might have cleaned the silencer with one of his sister's tampons..had Sheila not worn a tampon this would explain her bloodstained knickers. If Sheila attempted to commit suicide but failed this rules out her having received the shot accidentally with the struggle with Ralph(Nevill).According to Andrew Hunter the silencer was on the rifle at this stage,so either Sheila after the first shot puts the silencer back in the gun cupboard or someone else finds the silencer..I'm assuming that Sheila takes the Anschutz rifle back upstairs with her minus the silencer..

[Roch]

Didn't I read somewhere that Jeremy might have cleaned the silencer with one of his sister's tampons..had Sheila not worn a tampon this would explain her bloodstained knickers. If Sheila attempted to commit suicide but failed this rules out her having received the shot accidentally with the struggle with Ralph(Nevill).According to Andrew Hunter the silencer was on the rifle at this stage,so either Sheila after the first shot puts the silencer back in the gun cupboard or someone else finds the silencer..I'm assuming that Sheila takes the Anschutz rifle back upstairs with her minus the silencer..

Andrew Hunter clearly states where he is theorising.  His manuscript is 8 years old.  He theorises in places by making use what was known 8 years ago.

[Steve_uk]

First of all, Sheila did not resist arrest as you try to put it. She was unconscious on the bed, and in these circumstances the police could not justify shooting her. Fact of the matter is, police used the rifle which was propped up against the left hand side window Jamb (as observed from the vantage point of being inside the main bedroom) to falsely suggest that she had taken her own life on the bed (upstairs) to try and cover for the mistake of her being originally found downstairs in the kitchen, and declared to be already dead by members of the raid team at 7:37am - "the body of one dead male, and the body of one dead female found in kitchen upon entry". This was in addition to the police surgeon, Dr Craig, later pronouncing Sheila ass being dead inside the bedroom, her body being "on the far side of the bed with only a solitary wound to her neck" by 8:44am. If you study the available crime scene photographic evidence, it will become apparent to all and sundry that police moved the rifle from the window about on Sheila's body at a time when it had not been checked to see if it was still loaded with bullets, or if it was safe to handle? You will see the barrel of the anshulz rifle in different positions upon Sheila;'s body, in particular that the end of the guns barrel was at one stage beneath her chin and later resting against the side of her neck. You will also note that the positioning of Sheila Caffells right hand and fingers were photographed in different positions upon and around the guns trigger mechanism. Surely, it i not that difficult to imagine that whilst the police were busy reconstructing the scene to make it appear as though Sheila's body had been found in the bedroom, rather than downstairs in the region of the kitchen, that the rifle actually discharged a second bullet that penetrated beneath her chin and killed her...

According to the police, no-one moved or touched the body or any exhibits until after PC David Bird had taken all of his photographs, yet the photographs he took tell a completely different story...

How easy is it to discharge a .22 anschutz rifle accidentally? I read somewhere that this rifle needed two hands to make it steady.

[mike tesko]

How easy is it to discharge a .22 anschutz rifle accidentally? I read somewhere that this rifle needed two hands to make it steady.

Sheila didn't handle the rifle which fired the fatal bullet (PV/19) which killed her after it penetrated beneath her chin, it was a police officer who accidentally or carelessly activated the trigger mechanism on that occasion...

Now, if you are the police and you are moving a rifle about on the body of one of the victims, and you have not checked to see if the weapon in question is till loaded with a bullet or more) and you start to move the barrel of the rifle around in the vicinity of the victims beck, and you adjust the right hand and fingers of the victim about near or close to the trigger mechanism of the gun, there is going to be a good chance, or at least some risk involved in the loaded weapon (if it is loaded with a live bullet) discharging and causing an additional injury, do you not agree?

[tonyb]

Sheila didn't handle the rifle which fired the fatal bullet (PV/19) which killed her after it penetrated beneath her chin, it was a police officer who accidentally or carelessly activated the trigger mechanism on that occasion...

Now, if you are the police and you are moving a rifle about on the body of one of the victims, and you have not checked to see if the weapon in question is till loaded with a bullet or more) and you start to move the barrel of the rifle around in the vicinity of the victims beck, and you adjust the right hand and fingers of the victim about near or close to the trigger mechanism of the gun, there is going to be a good chance, or at least some risk involved in the loaded weapon (if it is loaded with a live bullet) discharging and causing an additional injury, do you not agree?

That's an awful lot of if's,but yes.

[mike tesko]

That's an awful lot of if's,but yes.

Sorry about spelling mistakes - well, police state categorically that no-one moved or touched anything until after PC Bird took his crime scene pictures, but they have lied...

look at the pictures PC Bird took, and we can all see the police have lied, and that in fact they did n=move things around whilst PC Bird was taking his pictures...

You do not tell lies of this nature unless you are trying to cover something up...

"Oh, look, we shot and killed Sheila, but it doesn't matter because she was already pronounced as being dead by the police surgeon at 8:44am"...

If you get my drift?