Sheila attempted to commit suicide (but failed), and was shot by the police...

[Patti]

A money mad kind of woman.

Or a scorned one....

[mike tesko]

Hi Roch  I was reading back today and it said at the Trial Jeremy never once said that Julie was telling porkies if this was the case have you any idea why he would do this. (Dare not ask Bridget )

Jeremy was never asked this whilst testifying - but he did say in his interviews by the police that she was not telling the truth and or that she was simply a woman scorned (which DCI "Taff" Jones agreed with). One of the things about Julie Mugfords evidence, is that it dramatically changed over a period of time. She was seen and spoken to by the police over 30 times, and many numerous witness statements giving these unfolding detail which have never yet been disclosed fully. The actual contents of all these witness statements was important to the defence, to the court which tried the matter, and to the appeals which went on to dismiss the case? In most of the instances when police saw Mugford or took new statements from her she was in the company of DS "Stan" Jones, or DC Barlow. This is very interesting because DS Jones was the first police officer to suspect Jeremy of involvement in the shootings, and he undoubtedly influenced what Mugford later went on to say. Mugford should have been handled by a different police officer who was not  so bias in favour of Sheila not having killed the others and then herself? The other thing which needs to be mentioned and taken into consideration is that there is / was a real danger that one or more of those witness statements made in Julie Mugfords name, were not actually made by her, but had been made on her behalf and her name put to them? Such witness statements could have been typed out by DS "Stan" Jones, or the DPP (like in other instances involving the materialization of police officers witness statements made up for them in their absence)?

[ajross]

Yes,,,of the in-family type,,minus Jeremy. I would have said that it was Ralph who got a good bashing,rather than say there'd been a fight. Ralph having been a gentleman wouldn't have " fought " with his own daughter.
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Has it ever ben discussed that having been shot upstairs or on/around the stairs he then proceeed to fall down them, doing lots of damage to himself but not leavin gany marks on JB (or Sheila)? Has this been investigated? It seems more plausible than the wetsuit busines I've heard about.

[susan]

Hi Mike  the thing that is bugging me is any self respecting person who was aware that her boyfriend of 2 years had murdered his whole family did not immediately go to the police and tell them that Jeremy had confessed to her that he had carried out the murders.  She was therefore an accessory to the murders.  She went to the mortuary and identified the two little boys and if what she had said about Jeremy was true she was worse than him.  I think her main motivation for doing what she did was she would not be charged with crimes she had committed i.e. fraud, drug smuggling which would have put an end to her teaching career plus of course the payout of £25,000 new life in Canada goodbye Jeremy the love of my life (I don,t think).

I personally don,t know how she can sleep at night unless of course even with her evidence she thought Jeremy was going to walk a free man if she did it all backfired and then she was in no position to reverse her statement.

[Bridget]

Hi Mike  the thing that is bugging me is any self respecting person who was aware that her boyfriend of 2 years had murdered his whole family did not immediately go to the police and tell them that Jeremy had confessed to her that he had carried out the murders.  She was therefore an accessory to the murders.  She went to the mortuary and identified the two little boys and if what she had said about Jeremy was true she was worse than him.  I think her main motivation for doing what she did was she would not be charged with crimes she had committed i.e. fraud, drug smuggling which would have put an end to her teaching career plus of course the payout of £25,000 new life in Canada goodbye Jeremy the love of my life (I don,t think).

I personally don,t know how she can sleep at night unless of course even with her evidence she thought Jeremy was going to walk a free man if she did it all backfired and then she was in no position to reverse her statement.

The police were none the wiser about those things until she came forward and told them.

[susan]

Morning Bridget  I was not aware of that.  But as I see it the crimes had still be committed and she would have been charged at sometime with them unless of course the crimes had gone undetected if that was the case why would she bother telling the police about them at all.  Unless I am missing something or misread something again

[grahameb]

Hi Mike  the thing that is bugging me is any self respecting person who was aware that her boyfriend of 2 years had murdered his whole family did not immediately go to the police and tell them that Jeremy had confessed to her that he had carried out the murders.  She was therefore an accessory to the murders.  She went to the mortuary and identified the two little boys and if what she had said about Jeremy was true she was worse than him.  I think her main motivation for doing what she did was she would not be charged with crimes she had committed i.e. fraud, drug smuggling which would have put an end to her teaching career plus of course the payout of £25,000 new life in Canada goodbye Jeremy the love of my life (I don,t think).

I personally don,t know how she can sleep at night unless of course even with her evidence she thought Jeremy was going to walk a free man if she did it all backfired and then she was in no position to reverse her statement.

I agree that after all said and done she should have been charged for being an accessory after the fact. Instead, everything criminal that she had ever done was spirited away so that she could not only work with children, but make a new life for herself abroad as a teacher with £25,000 to boot. What a lovely justice system we have. What honourable men we have to uphold that justice system.

[Bridget]

Morning Bridget  I was not aware of that.  But as I see it the crimes had still be committed and she would have been charged at sometime with them unless of course the crimes had gone undetected if that was the case why would she bother telling the police about them at all.  Unless I am missing something or misread something again

I think once she came forward she was probably told that if she had any skeletons in her cupboard she'd better reveal them now.

[grahameb]

I think once she came forward she was probably told that if she had any skeletons in her cupboard she'd better reveal them now.

Not sure about skeletons in her cupboard? But she had a lot of clobber in her wardrobe.

[susan]

Hi Bridget  sorry I thought her crimes were already known or about to be known as my school report always said Must Pay More Attention

[Bridget]

Hi Bridget  sorry I thought her crimes were already known or about to be known as my school report always said Must Pay More Attention

I imagine the crimes themselves were known about, but her involvement wasn't general knowledge. I suppose the thinking was that it would damage her credibility as a witness if JB were to be able to suddenly point to her and call her a crook, so she was encouraged to come clean.

[Jane]

Hi Susan, hope your feet are dry! There's a curious parallel here between JM and Vickie Carr, Ian huntley's girlfriend. I could understand why VC gave him an alibi. I imagine, that under the circumstances it surely must have been impossible to believe that the man she shared a bed with was capable of such horrendous violence and in giving him the alibi she was attempting to make herself believe that he didn't do it. I think it possible that by saying Jeremy was responsible, JM was attempting to make herself  believe that he was.

[Roch]

I think once she came forward was pulled in & interviewed under caution, she was probably told that if she had any skeletons in her cupboard she'd better reveal them now.

[susan]

Morning April1  yes I have dry feet as I am in The Highlands at the mo.  I can,t really relate Julie Mugford and Vickie Carr because Ian Huntley never confessed to her that he had committed the crimes and according to Julie Jeremy had confessed to her not only that but told her when he was going to carry out the horrendous murders so at that stage she should have alerted the family and the police and stopped it from happening.  I do know what you mean about Vicki Carr perhaps deep down she knew Ian had carried out the murders and was kidding herself on that he could not have done it and was kind of obliged to give him an alibi for what ever reason he told her he needed one.

[susan]

Hi Roch  I hear where you are coming from but why was it necessary not to proceed with charges against her "skeletons" in the cupboard surely she had sat on the fact she knew Jeremy to be a mass murderer she should not have been rewarded for withholding that serious information