telephone logs.

[grahameb]

Tanks grahame, that must be where I read it.

In fact I am absolutely amazed that the police gave his crackpot ideas even the time of day. That's what you get when you take a common sense every day copper off the case and replace him with a sycophantic idiot.

[maggie]

Jeremy certainly must have been Superman.....15 hours harvesting.....home at 10 ish.  About 2am walk or bike in pitch black for 30 - 45 mins.....climb through window....kill family....bike 30/40 mins pitch black ....call police ....turn up at farm all clean, unmarked and innocent..my oh my.

[-Harters-]

By bike, something between 30-45minutes I'd say.

Difficult?
I guess it depends who you ask, people who want to persuade you that Jeremy was innocent would no doubt tell you that it was an impossible journey, in pitch blackness with a deadly crumbling seawall between you and certain death.
Those who want to persuade you that Jeremy is guilty might tell you that it was an easy journey, in fact it's so easy that you may as well leave your car at home and stay off the main roads all the time, this is in fact a short cut.

The reality is probably somewhere between the two.
Yes it was night time and dark, but there was moonlight, whether enough to make the journey or not, who knows? I'd say it would add to the journey time but not make it impossible.
The majority of the journey is by farm tracks several metres wide, potentially just about 800metres is along the seawall which isn't and wasn't anywhere near as treacherous as is being suggested, Think of it as a mound with a track on top of it rather than a wall, plus there was and is a grassed track at the bottom of the mound for a good length of it (that the farm vehicles use(d)). Right now some cheeky bugger has put a caravan on one corner of the seawall which people are using as a base for going kyaking.

Also the police walked several routes (on advice from Robert Boutflour), they clearly considered the journey possible and in turn the prosecution clearly persuaded the jury that the journey was possible.

I'm not sure what else I can tell you about it.

As with the access into the house, the prosecution didn't need to prove that a particular route was taken, only that it was possible to take a route.

Extract from the 2002 AJ:
145. The prosecution case at trial was that the appellant, motivated by hatred and greed, had planned and carried out the killings. Having left White House Farm at about 10 p.m. on Tuesday 6 August 1985 he had returned by bicycle (taking a route which avoided the main roads) in the early hours of the following morning.

[maggie]

As with the access into the house, the prosecution didn't need to prove that a particular route was taken, only that it was possible to take a route.

Extract from the 2002 AJ:
145. The prosecution case at trial was that the appellant, motivated by hatred and greed, had planned and carried out the killings. Having left White House Farm at about 10 p.m. on Tuesday 6 August 1985 he had returned by bicycle (taking a route which avoided the main roads) in the early hours of the following morning.

Just because it's official doesn't mean it isn't rubbish.

[Caroline R]

Off the top of my head Neil, I know the police tried various routes and I cant remember the conclusiin. Grahame will know better than myself but I"m pretty sure the seawall was ruled out.  There is a report somewhere but cant remember where I read it.

There is mention of it here Maggie ....

http://www.jeremy-bamber.co.uk/bicycle

[Steve_uk]

Jeremy certainly must have been Superman.....15 hours harvesting.....home at 10 ish.  About 2am walk or bike in pitch black for 30 - 45 mins.....climb through window....kill family....bike 30/40 mins pitch black ....call police ....turn up at farm all clean, unmarked and innocent..my oh my.

It's not so far. One of the policemen cycled it in 10 minutes. Maybe curiousessex can tell us more about the routes,or if anyone knows where Maldon Road is from White House Farm which takes six minutes to travel.http://www.jeremy-bamber.co.uk/bicycle

[-Harters-]

Just because it's official doesn't mean it isn't rubbish.

It may well be rubbish, I haven't really pushed it one way or the other, clearly if it was rubbish, then it was good enough rubbish to convince the jury.

I'm not sure that the CCRC will accept "It's rubbish" as a ground of appeal that they could refer on.

Clearly it is not as ludicrous as people are making out, it is entirely plausible and that is all the prosecution needed to put forward.

Why people are getting angry about it I'm not quite sure. 

[maggie]

There is mention of it here Maggie ....

http://www.jeremy-bamber.co.uk/bicycle

Thanks Caroline, that poor policeman must have been shattered and it didn't prove anything.

[Neil]

By bike, something between 30-45minutes I'd say.

Difficult?
I guess it depends who you ask, people who want to persuade you that Jeremy was innocent would no doubt tell you that it was an impossible journey, in pitch blackness with a deadly crumbling seawall between you and certain death.
Those who want to persuade you that Jeremy is guilty might tell you that it was an easy journey, in fact it's so easy that you may as well leave your car at home and stay off the main roads all the time, this is in fact a short cut.

The reality is probably somewhere between the two.
Yes it was night time and dark, but there was moonlight, whether enough to make the journey or not, who knows? I'd say it would add to the journey time but not make it impossible.
The majority of the journey is by farm tracks several metres wide, potentially just about 800metres is along the seawall which isn't and wasn't anywhere near as treacherous as is being suggested, Think of it as a mound with a track on top of it rather than a wall, plus there was and is a grassed track at the bottom of the mound for a good length of it (that the farm vehicles use(d)). Right now some cheeky bugger has put a caravan on one corner of the seawall which people are using as a base for going kyaking.

Also the police walked several routes (on advice from Robert Boutflour), they clearly considered the journey possible and in turn the prosecution clearly persuaded the jury that the journey was possible.

I'm not sure what else I can tell you about it.

Very informative post.  Thank you

[maggie]

Whose angry Hartley?  It is however questionable.

[-Harters-]

Whose angry Hartley?  It is however questionable.

It's just the impression that is being given by some of the posts, fighting tooth and nail in an attempt to show the bike route up as "rubbish", "crackpot theory", etc.

Whether anybody thinks it's rubbish or not, doesn't really matter, it was accepted at the original trial as part of the prosecutions case which ultimately led to the conviction of Jeremy for murder.

[-Harters-]

Very informative post.  Thank you

The estimated time of 30-45minutes is taking into account that it would have been night time, you could probably half that time for a daytime journey.

[Steve_uk]

Thanks Caroline, that poor policeman must have been shattered and it didn't prove anything.

Let's put it this way..he was not asleep in an armchair in John O' Groats with his wife and children around to vouch that he never stirred from his slumber. He was in Goldhanger,with no alibi,10 minutes away from the crime scene.

[susan]

Hi mags  the policeman they are saying did the journey in 10 minutes was on a motorbike

[mike tesko]

Let's put it this way..he was not asleep in an armchair in John O' Groats with his wife and children around to vouch that he never stirred from his slumber. He was in Goldhanger,with no alibi,10 minutes away from the crime scene.

Any one or more of the relatives who ended up benefitting from the Bamber parents estate, were also not too far away, and none was asked for an alibi...