Occupants of CA07, relayed information to control room, from raid team...

[mertol22]

The images also clearly show that Sheilas limbs are not immobile.

[mike tesko]

I do not take too kindly to anyone trying to take the piss by insulting my intelligence where as in this matter, there is clearly no visible preence of HYPOSTASIS anywhere at all on Sheila's legs which is puzzling since if Jeremy killed Sheila and stage managed her body on the bedroom floor as claimed by the prosecutions case, and that Sheila's body had been in that position 9undisturbed) for over six to seven hours, her legs would not be that colour, there would undoubtedly be significant discoloration of the skin, which I am afraid to say is absent in these images...

[mike tesko]

There is absolutely no discoloration of the skin at all, to support the claim that Sheila had been dead already some six to seven hours by the time PC Bird took these photographs - no wonder Essex police deliberately withheld over 358 of them...

No wonder PC Bird created a false MASTER COPY ALBUM SCHEDULE (containing only 223 pictures) to try and conceal the existence of all 581 photographs taken in connection with this investigation...

[mike tesko]

There should have been corresponding marks on the relevant parts of Sheila's body (Vibices) where the weight of the rifle had been resting if it had been resting there undisturbed for six to seven hours...

Yet, none exist...

Absence of the same supports the fact that police stage managed Sheila's body on the floor, by placing the rifle in different positions upon or atop the body...

[mike tesko]

Jeremy Bamber was therefore framed for these murders by the police, who used stage managed images of Sheila's body on the bedroom floor with the rifle atop it, to deliberately mislead and fool the jury into accepting that Jeremy had done the very things which the police are responsible for doing themselves...

Police stage managed Sheila's body on the bedroom floor, not Jeremy, or any as yet unidentified killer, and they stage managed it with the semi-automatic rifle upon the body because they came to the conclusion that both shots could have been fired by a process of recoil, using a semi-automatic weapon...

[Bridget]

There should have been corresponding marks on the relevant parts of Sheila's body (Vibices) where the weight of the rifle had been resting if it had been resting there undisturbed for six to seven hours...

Yet, none exist...

Absence of the same supports the fact that police stage managed Sheila's body on the floor, by placing the rifle in different positions upon or atop the body...

I can't see anything in the article you linked to which suggests that a rifle lain across a body for a few hours would leave marks.

[mike tesko]

I can't see anything in the article you linked to which suggests that a rifle lain across a body for a few hours would leave marks.

In the normal course of events, the pale areas of the body which are in contact with the ground are produce by compression, a similar phenomena occurs when objects end up on top of a body, areas of the skin where objects have been resting for several hours after death occurs, are created by compression that produces areas of pale skin which come into contact with such objects...

I refer to those areas of pale skin as marks, which are conspicuously absent from the relevant patts of Sheila Caffells body, paryicularly in those areas where the rifle was photographed and resting agalnst or upon...

[tonyb]

In the normal course of events, the pale areas of the body which are in contact with the ground are produce by compression, a similar phenomena occurs when objects end up on top of a body, areas of the skin where objects have been resting for several hours after death occurs, are created by compression that produces areas of pale skin which come into contact with such objects...

I refer to those areas of pale skin as marks, which are conspicuously absent from the relevant patts of Sheila Caffells body, paryicularly in those areas where the rifle was photographed and resting agalnst or upon...

Therein lies another problem.the weigh of the rifle,is it heavy enough to leave the marks you suggest. There are going to be many variables,one obvious one being the physical build of SC. as for rigor mortis and immovable joints I believe this was a thread subject a few months ago and the mobility of limbs is quite possible after a 6 / 7 hour time period.skin discolouration I don't know,I haven't doe any research.
In this thread there is a lot of assumption. It has to be backed up by proof. A little snippet out of a website downloaded cannot be regarded as fact,wouldn't you agree?

[mike tesko]

Therein lies another problem.the weigh of the rifle,is it heavy enough to leave the marks you suggest. There are going to be many variables,one obvious one being the physical build of SC. as for rigor mortis and immovable joints I believe this was a thread subject a few months ago and the mobility of limbs is quite possible after a 6 / 7 hour time period.skin discolouration I don't know,I haven't doe any research.
In this thread there is a lot of assumption. It has to be backed up by proof. A little snippet out of a website downloaded cannot be regarded as fact,wouldn't you agree?

According to you then, once Sheila was dead, once her heart stopped beating, and her  body ended up on its back, either on the kitchen floor, or the bed, or the bedtoom floor, you are saying or suggesting that her blood did not drain off to the lowest parts of her body? That is effectively what you are saying, and that is what you are asking members of the forum to believe. So, l think you are basically trying to suggest that for one reason or another, there could not be, or there was not any possibility of Sheila's skin being discoloured even though Sheila would have had to have been already detd for up to seven hours or more?

You are advocating that 'hypostasis' did not apply in the circumstances of her death?

You are trying to hoodwink members of this rforum into accepting that there might not be any physical evidence associated with discoloration of skin linked to the timing of Sheila's death...

[NewChilledOutHartley]

According to you then, once Sheila was dead, once her heart stopped beating, and her  body ended up on its back, either on the kitchen floor, or the bed, or the bedtoom floor, you are saying or suggesting that her blood did not drain off to the lowest parts of her body? That is effectively what you are saying, and that is what you are asking members of the forum to believe. So, l think you are basically trying to suggest that for one reason or another, there could not be, or there was not any possibility of Sheila's skin being discoloured even though Sheila would have had to have been already dead for up to seven hours or more?

You are advocating that 'hypostasis' did not apply in the circumstances of her death?

You are trying to hoodwink members of yhis forum into accepting that there might not be any physical evidence associated with discoloration of skin linked to the timing of Sheila's death...

I thought the blood drains to the lowest parts of a body causing darkening in the lower parts i.e. the parts in contact with the ground, and the upper surfaces become paler due to the blood draining from these areas.

Sheila appears to adhere to this, it's just that you don't have images of the lower parts of her body in contact with the ground.

That's how I understood it anyway.

[maggie]

I thought the blood drains to the lowest parts of a body causing darkening in the lower parts i.e. the parts in contact with the ground, and the upper surfaces become paler due to the blood draining from these areas.

Sheila appears to adhere to this, it's just that you don't have images of the lower parts of her body in contact with the ground.

That's how I understood it anyway.

I think it is impossible to tell from the photos Hartley.

[NewChilledOutHartley]

I think it is impossible to tell from the photos Hartley.

Yes that's what I was trying to say, in a round about way. I agree with you.

[mike tesko]

I thought the blood drains to the lowest parts of a body causing darkening in the lower parts i.e. the parts in contact with the ground, and the upper surfaces become paler due to the blood draining from these areas.

Sheila appears to adhere to this, it's just that you don't have images of the lower parts of her body in contact with the ground.

That's how I understood it anyway.

Just goes to show how wrong you were, are...

[bob]

You are trying to hoodwink members of this rforum into accepting that there might not be any physical evidence associated with discoloration of skin linked to the timing of Sheila's death...

Tell us more about trying to hoodwink members of the forum Mike...

[lookout]

It's usual to take a rectal temperature to determine the time of death. A GP would normally do this.