Channel 5 documentary 8th June 9.00 pm - 10.30 pm

[Armchair Detective]

Well of course the phone would have to be returned to the cradle before dialing out. Then to anyone checking the line it would be "engaged" and not "off the hook"

Even if the operator has the line open the other end?

And the operator didn't think to report that the phone had been replaced while she was listening or was she a freemason too?

desperate stuff.

[Armchair Detective]

They seem to have the bit between their teeth with the latest Milbank revelation. No respect for the wishes of Colin Caffell at all.

Not to mention a complete lack of critical thought as to the veracity of this tale.

I think the phone rang in the control room when the line was transferred and 40 years later, Millbank got confused about some vague memories, perhaps a little flattered by the attentions of reporter after a story.

[Jonathan]

The programme seems to have been forgotten already. Very little chat on X except Peter Tatchell. If the Team were hoping a wave of public outrage was going to fluster the CCRC into maing a reference they are going to be disappointed.

[Rob_]

Even if the operator has the line open the other end?

And the operator didn't think to report that the phone had been replaced while she was listening or was she a freemason too?

desperate stuff.

Someone may have spent 40 years in jail when innocent and the silencer evidence on which the conviction rested having been demolished that's all you can say.

Pretty sad I think.

[Armchair Detective]

Someone may have spent 40 years in jail when innocent and the silencer evidence on which the conviction rested having been demolished that's all you can say.

Pretty sad I think.

Has it been demolished? For real this time?

That would certainly make the conviction unsafe and I would think the CCRC would have no choice but to stop dragging their heals, especially with the heavy criticism they rightly faced over the Andrew Malkinson case, but they've been sitting on this for quite some time haven't they?

Perhaps, like the imaginary phone calls and all of the other conspiracy fiction we've heard ad nauseum over the years, it's not that clear cut after all.

And it wouldn't prove JB innocent either.

 

[Armchair Detective]

The programme seems to have been forgotten already. Very little chat on X except Peter Tatchell. If the Team were hoping a wave of public outrage was going to fluster the CCRC into maing a reference they are going to be disappointed.

Yep. I only became aware of the new doc via a CT post on twitter with about 30 likes.

The Bamber case is fascinating for a number of reasons but people have been hearing how he'll be out next week for 40 years. The CT are only interesting for their incredible levels of cognitive dissonance and the Olympic gold medal standard of mental gymnastics they perform each time the prophecy fails.

[snow66!]

Has it been demolished? For real this time?

That would certainly make the conviction unsafe and I would think the CCRC would have no choice but to stop dragging their heals, especially with the heavy criticism they rightly faced over the Andrew Malkinson case, but they've been sitting on this for quite some time haven't they?

Perhaps, like the imaginary phone calls and all of the other conspiracy fiction we've heard ad nauseum over the years, it's not that clear cut after all.

And it wouldn't prove JB innocent either.

 

You hinted that Philip Boyces Aga evidence may have some merit, Armchair!
I certainly think if used correctly they are JBs best chance to gain his freedom. Indeed I think the Aga evidence does more or less prove his innocence if accepted.
Strangely the Aga burns didn't even get as much as a mention on the recent prog!

[Armchair Detective]

You hinted that Philip Boyces Aga evidence may have some merit, Armchair!
I certainly think if used correctly they are JBs best chance to gain his freedom. Indeed I think the Aga evidence does more or less prove his innocence if accepted.
Strangely the Aga burns didn't even get as much as a mention on the recent prog!

I'm afraid I don't see how. In fact, if it was accepted, any suggestion that NB was moved could be damaging to Bamber as the police W/S clearly state they saw him in his final position through the window before entering.

I just think that Boyce's experiment looks like a far better approximation of NB's mysterious wounds than the previous, perfectly round efforts. How they fit into the crime, if they fit at all, cannot be known. They weren't an issue at trial so almost certainly not a ground of appeal.

[Zoso]

Some parts of previous exchanges/posts

You are posting crap. The Chelmsford Telephone exchange was one of the most modern in the UK. Operators had lights and sounds to assist. I have set all this out many times. Either you did not read my posts or you have memory issues.

You are still wrong. The operator could cut in but she did not need to do this. The switchboard indicated the line status.

Yes, a telephone operator can typically tell the difference between a phone that is off the hook and one that is engaged. When the operator plugged in the signal received gave the answer.

When a phone is off the hook, it usually results in a continuous tone or a “howler” tone after a certain period, indicating that the receiver hasn’t been replaced properly. On the other hand, an engaged line will produce a busy signal, indicating that the line is currently in use.

That is how JR knew it was off the hook. The tone heard gave the answer. In this case she would have heard the howler and nothing else since the howler had been automatic since 1959.


The Chelmsford telephone exchange system was one of the first digital systems in the country. Telephonists could tell the status of a line by both lights and sounds. If off the hook was registered there would be a yellow light and the sound called the howler would be heard by any telephonist who accessed the line.
The engaged tone was a repeating double bleep. Two 400 Hz bleeps. The engaged light was red and the idle light was green. Satisfied?

Why would I read one of your shonky posts where you get everything arse about face? Read what actually occurred, not what you dreamed out of thin air!


https://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,4994.0.html

[Adam]

Seems the main thing people are relying on is the aledged 999 call.

This has already had a PSOR. So people are relying on the Milbank audio overturning it. This was passed to the CCRC several months ago.

Nevill's call has also had a PSOR. It seems this is not being challenged. Neither West or Bonnett have said they received a call from Nevill. West is on video saying what happened.

[ILB]

Very skeptical of the mill bank audio.

You would have to come to a view that someone threatened Milbank and silenced him for four decades.

I would be shouting from the rooftops if I knew an Innocent man was rotting in prison,

[ILB]

Even if he wasn't threatened heavy burden to carry everyday and he'd be reminded of it as he was a career officer

[Jonathan]

Piecing together the CCRC application narrative...

Sheila murders her family 3.30amish. Occupies herself for 2+ hours.

At 6.09am with the house surrounded Sheila phones 999 and says nothing - leaving the phone off the hook.

Police storm the farmhouse - shooting Sheila twice in the neck. Position her body and the rifle to look like suicide. Move Nevill's body (reasons unknown).

Few weeks later Police change their minds and decide Jeremy did it is a better story

[Cambridgecutie]

I do not know but they obviously believe they have sufficient material so this should be well worth watching.  I genuinely feel that we are likely to see some progress in this case by the end of this year.  I know similar claims have been made in the past but I have seen enough recently to make me alter my overall assessment of prospects.

ngb1066 are you able to say if it was included in the C5 docu?  If so which aspect altered your overall assessment of prospects?   

[Roch]

I really can't be bothered Roch. Sorry. 90 minutes is about 85 minutes too long by the sounds of it.

I skipped the first 3rd.