PSOR on CC's proposed referral to the CCRC.

[Adam]

Wonder if he had head/face protection? Whatever it was he would want it to be secure on the head.

Believe bike helmets existed but were not as common as now.

Beeny hats or a balaclava could be worn.

A jacket with a hood.

Don't know if farm workers wore head gear at any time.

[ILB]

Wonder if he had head/face protection? Whatever it was he would want it to be secure on the head.

Believe bike helmets existed but were not as common as now.

Beeny hats or a balaclava could be worn.

A jacket with a hood.

Don't know if farm workers wore head gear at any time.

Personally believe he did it in his farm overalls. I don't believe he used a mask or gloves.

He didn't expect to be grappling with Nevill. He expected a quick massacre.

Having said to me to support his story of having Nevill phoned him he would need to have Nevill up and about.

Ending Nevill in bed doesn't support the theory of Shelia going ape shit to me.

[Adam]

I sincerely doubt Jeremy did any forensic research prior to 7.8.85.

Doubt he wore gloves it's not like he would have to account for fingerprints. He was at WHF every day.

He could have put some blood on Sheila's hands and feet. Then put some of Sheila's blood on the bible.

Plenty of blood about.

[Adam]

Personally believe he did it in his farm overalls. I don't believe he used a mask or gloves.

He didn't expect to be grappling with Nevill. He expected a quick massacre.

Having said to me to support his story of having Nevill phoned him he would need to have Nevill up and about.

Ending Nevill in bed doesn't support the theory of Shelia going ape shit to me.

Ideally Nevill gets shot in bed, gets out of bed, staggers a few feet, then collapses.

Or he can kill Nevill in bed then drag him a few feet.

He can then take the bedroom phone off the hook.

Either way he would not want blood on Nevill's side of the bed as it suggests he was ambushed in bed.

All tricky.

[Adam]

If Nevill died on the bedroom floor, Sheila would be killed in the twins room.

That is the two main players out of bed & the bedroom phone off the hook.

[Adam]

If Nevill and Sheila both died upstairs, he could still take the downstairs phone off the hook.

It would just mean Nevill went downstairs to phone Jeremy. Then back upstairs.

However seems he wanted Nevill to be next to a phone 'off the hook'. Julie said he wanted to use the 'last number dialled' phone. Assume he would have put that next to Nevill after phoning GH.

[ILB]

If Nevill died on the bedroom floor, Sheila would be killed in the twins room.

That is the two main players out of bed & the bedroom phone off the hook.

The bible with shelia and June one could argue was engineered to suggest religious mania overload gone wrong. I

Out of all the deceased the twins were the victims who probably Jeremy had the least malice toward.  They were just obstacles in his mind to his money.

[Steve_uk]

The bible with shelia and June one could argue was engineered to suggest religious mania overload gone wrong. I

Out of all the deceased the twins were the victims who probably Jeremy had the least malice toward.  They were just obstacles in his mind to his money.

Scant consolation to Colin.

[BarefootDanC]

Scant consolation to Colin.

Yes. Colin and the wider family's loss is often overlooked in these discussions.

[ILB]

Yes. Colin and the wider family's loss is often overlooked in these discussions.

Not overlooked at all by me and often commented upon.

Jeremy very quickly after the massacre was in the company of Colin over the following days, with as the killer portraying the concerned relative and also having the knowledge of having killed the man's children.

It's the coldest aspect of the case.

[ILB]

Scant consolation to Colin.

Theoretically speaking he could have spared the boys. From his perspective.

It wouldn't have effected his inheritance as they were children and would have gone to Colin in the interim before being allowed to stake a claim for Sheila's share. Which would have probably happened in 97 when they turned 18.

12 years would have passed by then.

[ILB]

He could have put some blood on Sheila's hands and feet. Then put some of Sheila's blood on the bible.

Plenty of blood about.

He could have dressed her in her day clothes.

He had time on his side.

[Adam]

He could have dressed her in her day clothes.

He had time on his side.

That would support the theory that she never went to bed. But then why would she wait until 3.00am to do anything?

A lot of work undressing and then dressing a lifeless body.

[ILB]

Don't believe 7.8.85 was stenciled in as D Day by Jeremy.

People can often brag and have fantasies about committing atrocious acts revenge acts for months on ends before finally snapping and doing something.

For me what points to the crime being a spontaneous act if Jeremy Bamber is the murderer. Spontaneous in the sense there was no set date. He finally just snapped.

1) Jeremy's own words to Julie " Ive been thinking all day on the tractor this crime has to happen tonight it's now or never"

2) Sheila's diary entry " I didn't mean to be horrible to Jeremy"  it's very likely brother and sister had a bust up. Which fuelled Jeremy's resentment even further and hatred for her.

3) Jeremy working in the fields and seeing shelia and the twins lolling around that hot summers day. He is working she is doing fuck all and it riled him.

4) Jeremy not mentioning anything to Julie the weekend before by Julie's own words. ( if he had a pre plan he would have mentioned it)

5) the kitchen farmhouse conversation. While many a guilter believe a placebo by Jeremy about the fostering conversation. It's possible a conversation did happen but it involved something in regards to Jeremy. There was talk about Shelia moving into bourtree and Jeremy moving back to WHF. Jeremy had tastefully furnished the cottage and spent thousands. It would have made him go ape shit.

[ILB]

A lot of work undressing and then dressing a lifeless body.

Not really especially when youve murdered five people and are trying to set a scene.