Author Topic: Re: Manchester synagogue attack  (Read 14482 times)

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Offline Steve_uk

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Re: Manchester synagogue attack
« Reply #60 on: October 04, 2025, 08:56:PM »
    Palestine Action are not regarded as a terror group by right thinking people and as already stated by ngb, it is our duty to oppose unjust laws. It is perfectly possible to oppose all that Palestine Action stand for but designating them a terrorist organisation opens all activist/protest groups open to the same designation. It is tyrannical and something only a police state would do.
Didn't they interfere with a British air force base?

Offline Hardy Boy

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Re: Manchester synagogue attack
« Reply #61 on: October 04, 2025, 09:00:PM »
But it is not a terrorist organisation and the law relating to this needs to be challenged and changed.
I agree, but because they’ve prescribed as one, holding the supportive placards is a criminal offence, so then it becomes an unlawful protest according to the Law of this Country?   how they deal with the 1000+ that’s been arrested is anyone’s guess, I think as of yet 138 have actually been charged NGB

What’s your view on what the sentencing might be if they are convicted NGB, or do you think they will win their cases, which would be a very bad body blow for this Government?
« Last Edit: October 04, 2025, 09:01:PM by Hardy Boy »

Online ngb1066

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Re: Manchester synagogue attack
« Reply #62 on: October 04, 2025, 09:08:PM »
I agree, but because they’ve prescribed as one, holding the supportive placards is a criminal offence, so then it becomes an unlawful protest according to the Law of this Country?   how they deal with the 1000+ that’s been arrested is anyone’s guess, I think as of yet 138 have actually been charged NGB

What’s your view on what the sentencing might be if they are convicted NGB, or do you think they will win their cases, which would be a very bad body blow for this Government?

I hope they win their cases, but there is no certainty about that.  Sentences are likely to be lenient because those charged have not been violent or threatening and have not damaged anything.  They have not incited others to violence.  I suspect there may be fines or even conditional discharges.  A lot depends upon the individual magistrate or judge.   The courts will get clogged with these cases.  Part of the action is to persuade the police not to act.  The police have a discretion.  Most offences are effectively ignored.  A courageous Chief Constable or the Commissioner could say that resources are not going to be allocated to intervene in demonstrations which are not violent or threatening.

 

Offline Steve_uk

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Re: Manchester synagogue attack
« Reply #63 on: October 04, 2025, 09:15:PM »
I hope they win their cases, but there is no certainty about that.  Sentences are likely to be lenient because those charged have not been violent or threatening and have not damaged anything.  They have not incited others to violence.  I suspect there may be fines or even conditional discharges.  A lot depends upon the individual magistrate or judge.   The courts will get clogged with these cases.  Part of the action is to persuade the police not to act.  The police have a discretion.  Most offences are effectively ignored.  A courageous Chief Constable or the Commissioner could say that resources are not going to be allocated to intervene in demonstrations which are not violent or threatening.
In other words a lily-livered Chief Constable MIGHT BE intimidated by sheer force of numbers. I'm surprised the demonstrators weren't chaperoned to their destination as in the case of the Epping Forest mob.

Online ngb1066

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Re: Manchester synagogue attack
« Reply #64 on: October 04, 2025, 09:29:PM »
In other words a lily-livered Chief Constable MIGHT BE intimidated by sheer force of numbers. I'm surprised the demonstrators weren't chaperoned to their destination as in the case of the Epping Forest mob.

There is no suggestion that the police should be intimidated.  They could decide for operational reasons that their resources should be allocated elsewhere.  They are currently being coerced by our apalling "Labour" government into acting in their percieved political interests.

Offline nugnug

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Re: Manchester synagogue attack
« Reply #65 on: October 04, 2025, 09:35:PM »
He was shot dead when a officer had to make that decision in a  split second to shoot him, he was wearing what he thought was a suicide vest, the officer made the correct call and should be commended for his action.

he also shot 2 totally innocent people

Offline Hardy Boy

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Re: Manchester synagogue attack
« Reply #66 on: October 04, 2025, 09:41:PM »
he also shot 2 totally innocent people
How do you know He shot two others, have they said it was the same police officer?  They were shot behind a closed door, the police had no idea they were there sadly.
« Last Edit: October 04, 2025, 09:43:PM by Hardy Boy »

Offline Hardy Boy

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Re: Manchester synagogue attack
« Reply #67 on: October 04, 2025, 09:46:PM »
There is no suggestion that the police should be intimidated.  They could decide for operational reasons that their resources should be allocated elsewhere.  They are currently being coerced by our apalling "Labour" government into acting in their percieved political interests.
I agree, Starmer has made a rod for his own back,  the same way he has encouraged the Police to clamp down on freedom of speech.

Online ngb1066

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Re: Manchester synagogue attack
« Reply #68 on: October 04, 2025, 09:59:PM »
I agree, Starmer has made a rod for his own back,  the same way he has encouraged the Police to clamp down on freedom of speech.

The misuse of so called anti terrorism legislation has been a hallmark of this government.  There are more repressive powers and curtailment of basic rights through this than ever happened in the UK, even during times of war. 


Offline Hardy Boy

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Re: Manchester synagogue attack
« Reply #69 on: October 04, 2025, 10:12:PM »
The misuse of so called anti terrorism legislation has been a hallmark of this government.  There are more repressive powers and curtailment of basic rights through this than ever happened in the UK, even during times of war.
Enough is enough’ says chief of Police Federation as ‘exhausted’ officers arrest 493 at Palestine Action protest.

The Police are in a no win situation NGB,

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/enough-enough-says-chief-police-174004593.html

Offline Hardy Boy

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Re: Manchester synagogue attack
« Reply #70 on: October 04, 2025, 10:24:PM »
Enough is enough’ says chief of Police Federation as ‘exhausted’ officers arrest 493 at Palestine Action protest.

The Police are in a no win situation NGB,

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/enough-enough-says-chief-police-174004593.html
My own personal opinion, the Police will put up more and more exclusion zone’s around our City’s to try to combat these Protests?

Offline nugnug

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Re: Manchester synagogue attack
« Reply #71 on: October 04, 2025, 10:59:PM »
How do you know He shot two others, have they said it was the same police officer?  They were shot behind a closed door, the police had no idea they were there sadly.

 they might of done if they had bothered to check

Offline Hardy Boy

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Re: Manchester synagogue attack
« Reply #72 on: October 05, 2025, 08:19:AM »
they might of done if they had bothered to check
Very Good point, the officers should have asked the terrorist with what they thought was a bomb strapped to his waist,  to move away from the front of the Synagogue so they could check there was no one behind the door, before they shoot him.

A delivery driver, who only gave his name as Gareth, told BBC Radio Manchester: "Somebody shouted 'He's in the school or the synagogue' and then as we looked over the guy had a knife, and he was just stabbing the window, trying to get in [the building], and within seconds the police arrived.
"They gave him a couple of warnings, he didn't listen, so they opened fire. He went down on the floor and then he started getting back up and then they shot him again."
Another witness, Shah, described seeing the attacker "running with a knife" and "going on the rampage".
Chava Lewin, who lives next door to the synagogue, said: "The second he got out of the car he started stabbing anyone near him.
"He went for the security guard and tried to break into the synagogue.
« Last Edit: October 05, 2025, 08:36:AM by Hardy Boy »

Offline Hardy Boy

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Re: Manchester synagogue attack
« Reply #73 on: October 05, 2025, 09:38:AM »
My own personal opinion, the Police will put up more and more exclusion zone’s around our City’s to try to combat these Protests?
Hate to say it, but I’m right, I could see it coming, the Police cannot cope and the Government are clueless.

Police forces will be granted powers to put conditions on repeat protests, the government has announced, a day after nearly 500 protesters were arrested.
Senior officers will be able to consider the "cumulative impact" of previous protests, the Home Office said, which could mean they instruct organisers to hold events elsewhere if a site has seen repeated demonstrations.
Anyone who breaches these conditions will risk arrest and prosecution, it said.
Following Thursday's deadly attack at a synagogue in Manchester all police forces in England and Wales are offering additional support to the 538 synagogues and Jewish community sites across the country.
The new powers will be "brought forward as soon as possible", the Home Office said.
While the right to protest is fundamental "this freedom must be balanced with the freedom of their neighbours to live their lives without fear", Home Secretary Shabana Mahmood said.
She said large, repeated protests could leave sections of the country, particularly religious communities, "feeling unsafe, intimidated and scared to leave their homes".
Mahmood said this had been particularly evident within the Jewish community recently.
The home secretary will carry out a review of current protest legislation to "ensure powers are sufficient and being applied consistently", the government said.
This will include powers to ban protests outright, the government said.

Offline Hardy Boy

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Re: Manchester synagogue attack
« Reply #74 on: October 05, 2025, 09:45:AM »
Hate to say it, but I’m right, I could see it coming, the Police cannot cope and the Government are clueless.

Police forces will be granted powers to put conditions on repeat protests, the government has announced, a day after nearly 500 protesters were arrested.
Senior officers will be able to consider the "cumulative impact" of previous protests, the Home Office said, which could mean they instruct organisers to hold events elsewhere if a site has seen repeated demonstrations.
Anyone who breaches these conditions will risk arrest and prosecution, it said.
Following Thursday's deadly attack at a synagogue in Manchester all police forces in England and Wales are offering additional support to the 538 synagogues and Jewish community sites across the country.
The new powers will be "brought forward as soon as possible", the Home Office said.
While the right to protest is fundamental "this freedom must be balanced with the freedom of their neighbours to live their lives without fear", Home Secretary Shabana Mahmood said.
She said large, repeated protests could leave sections of the country, particularly religious communities, "feeling unsafe, intimidated and scared to leave their homes".
Mahmood said this had been particularly evident within the Jewish community recently.
The home secretary will carry out a review of current protest legislation to "ensure powers are sufficient and being applied consistently", the government said.
This will include powers to ban protests outright, the government said.
Id also like to add, if this was miners fighting for their jobs and holding protests in London week in and out, Batons and horses would have been deployed and an exclusion zone would have been put in place after a few weeks.

Whether we like it or not, these protesters are breaking the law and deliberately doing so by supporting Palestine action, are they brave, they will have Terrorist supporter branded to their name for the rest of their lives, it will be on every DBS check they have, and never leave the Police national Computer.  Consequences when travelling abroad there might be restrictions at Passport control and will be viewed at any job interview that requires DBS check?

Key Proscribed Organizations
Hamas: The entire organization was proscribed in November 2021, following a partial proscription of its military wing since 2001.
Hizb ut Tahrir: Proscribed in November 2021, according to the UK Parliament briefing.
Wagner Group: This mercenary group was also proscribed, as announced in November 2021, according to UK Parliament.
Palestine Action: Added to the list in 2025, referring specifically to the organization based in the United Kingdom.
Maniacs Murder Cult (MMC): This group was added to the list by an amendment order in 2025, according to the UK's official website.
Russian Imperial Movement (RIM): Also proscribed in 2025, according to the UK's official website.
Why Organizations Are Proscribed
An organization is placed on the list if it is believed to be involved in or to promote or encourage terrorism.
Consequences of Proscription
It is a criminal offence to become a member of or give support to a proscribed organization.
Individuals can be imprisoned for up to 14 years and/or fined for a more serious offence, or face up to 6 months in prison and/or a fine of up to £5,000 for other proscription offences, notes Counter Terrorism Policing.
« Last Edit: October 05, 2025, 09:52:AM by Hardy Boy »