DS Stan Jones ( retired ) 2002 interview.

[ILB]

From Stokenchurch

[Steve_uk]

From Stokenchurch

"Julie Mugford was a strong, believable witness, who did not change her evidence from the first day she was spoken to by us, all the way through to and including the trial."

[Hardy Boy]

Found this interesting about TAFF,

Det Cons Michael Clarke told The Sun: "They are making him a scapegoat.

"It wasn't until we started pulling in the evidence provided by Bamber's girlfriend and finding things wrong with Jeremy's story that things started to change.

"And Taff's mind was definitely changed."

[Steve_uk]

Found this interesting about TAFF,

Det Cons Michael Clarke told The Sun: "They are making him a scapegoat.

"It wasn't until we started pulling in the evidence provided by Bamber's girlfriend and finding things wrong with Jeremy's story that things started to change.

"And Taff's mind was definitely changed."

Do you think DCI Thomas "Taff" Jones would have changed the mood or the outcome of the trial substantially had he lived to testify?

[Hardy Boy]

Do you think DCI Thomas "Taff" Jones would have changed the mood or the outcome of the trial substantially had he lived to testify?

That's a good point Steve, even on the first arrest interview of Bamber "Taff" remarked to Barlow "i think were barking up the wrong tree" but that was before the silencer evidence was presented?  I think the Thin Blue Line would have kept him in check though, would he have been called as a witness if he had been removed from the investigation though?  It was basically a new investigation from a murder suicide to a Jeremy Bamber Murder after Taff was removed and Taff was more involved with the Sheila done it side of the investigation.

[Zoso]

That's a good point Steve, even on the first arrest video "Taff" remarked to Barlow "i think were barking up the wrong tree" but that was before the silencer evidence was presented?  I think the Thin Blue Line would have kept him in check though, would he have been called as a witness if he had been removed from the investigation though?  It was basically a new investigation from a murder suicide to a Jeremy Bamber Murder after Taff was removed and Taff was more involved with the Sheila done it side of the investigation.

I believe he would have most definitely been called, I think the defence would have insisted on it. He was adamant that Bamber was innocent initially and they would have wanted to explore that and put doubt in the minds of the jury.

[Hardy Boy]

I believe he would have most definitely been called, I think the defence would have insisted on it. He was adamant that Bamber was innocent initially and they would have wanted to explore that and put doubt in the minds of the jury.

Yes i agree Zoso i did read this?  Taff was part of the interviews

The prosecution are under a duty to call those witnesses whose witness statements have been served as part of the prosecution case and which the defence have identified as being required to attend. Unless the prosecution have good grounds to dispense with the witness, such as where they believe the witness is no longer a witness of truth, the witness will have to be brought to court.

[Steve_uk]

Yes i agree Zoso i did read this?  Taff was part of the interviews

The prosecution are under a duty to call those witnesses whose witness statements have been served as part of the prosecution case and which the defence have identified as being required to attend. Unless the prosecution have good grounds to dispense with the witness, such as where they believe the witness is no longer a witness of truth, the witness will have to be brought to court.

Does that hold true for the defence too? I'm surprised Jeremy Bamber ever got to testify.

[Adam]

Does that hold true for the defence too? I'm surprised Jeremy Bamber ever got to testify.

Was that his & the defences choice. Or did the prosecution call him?

[Hardy Boy]

Was that his & the defences choice. Or did the prosecution call him?

A defendant has the right to testify or not to testify, so i would say it was the defence.

[Zoso]

Yes i agree Zoso i did read this?  Taff was part of the interviews

The prosecution are under a duty to call those witnesses whose witness statements have been served as part of the prosecution case and which the defence have identified as being required to attend. Unless the prosecution have good grounds to dispense with the witness, such as where they believe the witness is no longer a witness of truth, the witness will have to be brought to court.

Yes he was, I also read that he eventually came to believe he was guilty and was relieved when Bamber was apprehended. There was worry that he could abscond. I will admit to not recalling where I saw this but it was in a book. I thought it was Wilkes but can't find it there.

[ILB]

I just balance this fairly as it can be in conclusion to taff.

He died in 1986.

Without hearing from the horses head direct, it's pretty much an open verdict on whether he ended up changing his mind or not.

Phillip Walker says " Taffs death was a great tragedy for Jeremy ", I don't agree it was in terms of being of help to him. He had been stepped over and even if he did testify it would probably form no more impression on the jury than a personal opinion. But who knows, It may had an effect ? We will never know for sure.

I don't believe his death was suspicious as I have heard some supporters of Jeremy say it was before. That's stupid. He apparently fell off a ladder while doing DIY at home.

[Rob_]

I just balance this fairly as it can be in conclusion to taff.

He died in 1986.

Without hearing from the horses head direct, it's pretty much an open verdict on whether he ended up changing his mind or not.

Phillip Walker says " Taffs death was a great tragedy for Jeremy ", I don't agree it was in terms of being of help to him. He had been stepped over and even if he did testify it would probably form no more impression on the jury than a personal opinion. But who knows, It may had an effect ? We will never know for sure.

I don't believe his death was suspicious as I have heard some supporters of Jeremy say it was before. That's stupid. He apparently fell off a ladder while doing DIY at home.

I believe it was a great tragedy for JB Taff dying, all the original case notes were able to be hidden away etc. Also all his reasons for believing in four murders / suicide were never heard.

If Taff did change his mind it was because if you are told a silencer with Sheila's blood in it has been found it is virtually the only conclusion you can come to if you believe the exhibit is genuine.

[ILB]

I believe it was a great tragedy for JB Taff dying, all the original case notes were able to be hidden away etc. Also all his reasons for believing in four murders / suicide were never heard.

If Taff did change his mind it was because if you are told a silencer with Sheila's blood in it has been found it is virtually the only conclusion you can come to if you believe the exhibit is genuine.

There may have pressure and he would ultimately just tow the line in his views.

He was no longer running the investigation. Ainsley said he got him to conduct the first interviews because of him being involved since day one.

The police are " we stick together ," body.

He's not going to risk his pension and career over a 24 year old farmer. That's the bottom line.

As I said though we have no idea if he genuinely had a change of mind, had pressure put on him or anything. He died in 1986.

Me personally I won't take his colleague saying " he believed Bamber gulity in the end for gospel " I always like to hear from the horses head. Other people will have their own views.

Doubt he would have been a defence witness to be honest.

[Rob_]

There may have pressure and he would ultimately just tow the line in his views.

The police are " we stick together ," body.

He's not going to risk his pension and career over a 24 year old farmer. That's the bottom line.

As I said though we have no idea if he genuinely had a change of mind, had pressure put on him or anything. He died in 1986.

Doubt he would have been a defence witness to be honest.

He would struggle to tow the line in court, he would be asked his reasons for being convinced it was suicide and his notes would have to be disclosed. The defense would have ripped him apart.