Lest We Forget...................

[Adam]

Bamber mentioning the bible to Julie was a way to show off.

The bible shows there may have been religous reasons as well as foster care reasons. Implicating Sheila further.

Bamber telling Julie the twins did not suffer & that MM carried out the massacre made him seem less of a monster. He had spent months telling Julie what a raw deal he had from his family. She may be less likely to wilt & support him in the coming days.

[Adam]

Some posters believe Julie should have approached the police on the way to WHF in the police car. Which is very extreme as she didn't even know what had happened.

It seems she started wilting within the first week. While simultaneously attending the funeral & then being taken on Bamber's jolly ups.

Over the next 3 weeks things escalated. Julie started talking to other people. Bamber felt more confident & didn't want Julie tagging along with Brett & dampening the mood.

[guest29835]

Might it not have slipped his memory after a fight with his father, in which he didn't die conveniently, a glove came off, and the rifle stock broke with the force of the beating?

Slipped his memory you say?

Curious that Julie mentions the things that were known to the investigation at that stage and she could have heard secondhand, but not the one critical piece of evidence that only became significant later and that an innocent Jeremy would not have known about: the silencer.  How interesting.

[guest29835]

Some posters believe Julie should have approached the police on the way to WHF in the police car. Which is very extreme as she didn't even know what had happened.

It seems she started wilting within the first week. While simultaneously attending the funeral & then being taken on Bamber's jolly ups.

Over the next 3 weeks things escalated. Julie started talking to other people. Bamber felt more confident & didn't want Julie tagging along with Brett & dampening the mood.

Thanks Adam.  Did Julie mention details of the crime to her various friends?  Or just to the police?

I know that Susan is quite broad-minded as she let Jeremy, a mass murderer, come to her 21st. birthday party.  Steve wouldn't like her.

Thanks Adam.

[Adam]

Thanks Adam.  Did Julie mention details of the crime to her various friends?  Or just to the police?

I know that Susan is quite broad-minded as she let Jeremy, a mass murderer, come to her 21st. birthday party.  Steve wouldn't like her.

Thanks Adam.

I thought you had read up on the case.

Why does it matter?

Had Julie told Liz Rimmington before her 21st birthday.

Anyway, she told 5 people before approaching the police. Most likely before Bamber said he 'jilted her'.

[Jane]

Slipped his memory you say?

Curious that Julie mentions the things that were known to the investigation at that stage and she could have heard secondhand, but not the one critical piece of evidence that only became significant later and that an innocent Jeremy would not have known about: the silencer.  How interesting.

No, I didn't say. That would be claiming. I asked a question. Your answer might be right. IF Jeremy is innocent. I believe the police paid MM a visit and he satisfied them with his alibi. Given he'd never been a mercenary, it's quite reasonable to think he may never have handled a gun.

[Adam]

Bamber spoke to Julie for months before & days after the massacre. About his plans & actions.

Julie told 5 people Bamber was involved before going to the police after a month. Submitting a WS, testifying & never retracting.

Obviously no one would do this if the person was innocent.

Not sure what else can be said.

[guest29835]

I thought you had read up on the case.

Why does it matter?

Had Julie told Liz Rimmington before her 21st birthday.

Anyway, she told 5 people before approaching the police. Most likely before Bamber said he 'jilted her'.

I have read up on the case and I know more about the case than you do - that's a certainty.  I can wipe the floor with you.

Sometimes questioning is used as a debating technique, Adam.  Barristers, for instance, ask questions they already know the answer to in order to highlight weaknesses or strengths in a case.

The information flow from Julie to her friends and the police highlights a glaring flaw in the prosecution case.  She DID share some crime scene information with Susan Battersby, but it was vague and undetailed and based on secondhand factoids she could have picked up or inferred from anywhere.

Why didn't Julie mention the silencer to the police?

[guest29835]

No, I didn't say. That would be claiming. I asked a question. Your answer might be right. IF Jeremy is innocent. I believe the police paid MM a visit and he satisfied them with his alibi. Given he'd never been a mercenary, it's quite reasonable to think he may never have handled a gun.

Like both Adam and Steve, you dodge the real question.

[Adam]

I have read up on the case and I know more about the case than you do - that's a certainty.  I can wipe the floor with you.

Sometimes questioning is used as a debating technique, Adam.  Barristers, for instance, ask questions they already know the answer to in order to highlight weaknesses or strengths in a case.

The information flow from Julie to her friends and the police highlights a glaring flaw in the prosecution case.  She DID share some crime scene information with Susan Battersby, but it was vague and undetailed and based on secondhand factoids she could have picked up or inferred from anywhere.

Why didn't Julie mention the silencer to the police?

Why should Bamber mention the silencer to her? He used it & took off without giving it a second thought. It became an issue weeks later.

Julie would assume a silencer would be used in a 2am massacre attempt anyway.

At least this shows the police did not interfere with Julie's WS. Getting hefr to include one line ' Jeremy told me he used a silencer' would have been very damaging.

[Steve_uk]

Slipped his memory you say?

Curious that Julie mentions the things that were known to the investigation at that stage and she could have heard secondhand, but not the one critical piece of evidence that only became significant later and that an innocent Jeremy would not have known about: the silencer.  How interesting.

He wasn't going to tell her everything. As it was he was distancing himself from the crimes with the hitman story, which Julie would not have invented were she desperate to be believed.

[guest29835]

Why should Bamber mention the silencer to her? He used it & took off without giving it a second thought. It became an issue weeks later.

Julie would assume a silencer would be used in a 2am massacre attempt anyway.

At least this shows the police did not interfere with Julie's WS. Getting hefr to include one line ' Jeremy told me he used a silencer' would have been very damaging.

Thanks Adam.  'Matthew' (Jeremy) had to unscrew the silencer and put it back in the gun cupboard because Sheila's arms wouldn't have let her kill herself with a silenced rifle.  On the way to the gun cupboard, he stopped at the aga surround and put some scratch marks there, just to be fair and sporting and give the police a chance.  He also left some blood visible on the outside of the silencer, for the same reason.

Jeremy later forgets to mention all this to Julie.

Meanwhile...

Five police officers inspect the gun cupboard and find nothing of significance.

Stan Jones, formerly of C11 Branch of Scotland Yard, suspects Jeremy from the off.

This same Stan Jones offers Jeremy the keys to the crime scene, including the gun cupboard.

Jeremy refuses and lets the relatives have the keys instead.

It's all falling into place.  Thanks Adam.

[Jane]

Like both Adam and Steve, you dodge the real question.

Okay. Here's another. The debacle with the silencer was such a cock up and bought him so close to losing everything, apart from making him look incompetent, that he buried it. Talking about it would only have made it real.

[guest29835]

He wasn't going to tell her everything. As it was he was distancing himself from the crimes with the hitman story, which Julie would not have invented were she desperate to be believed.

Jeremy was distancing himself from the crimes.

Jeremy told Julie he was involved in the crimes.

It all makes sense now.  Thanks Steve.

[Steve_uk]

Jeremy was distancing himself from the crimes.

Jeremy told Julie he was involved in the crimes.

It all makes sense now.  Thanks Steve.

Only because by that stage Julie had known how long he had been planning them.