Jeremy Bamber proven innocent?

[Caroline]

Why does it depend on when he shot them?

Didn't he want officers to go in and find them all? What would be the purpose of delaying that?

Well, had Sheila ‘just’ shot them and herself, you would expect them to still be warm. Had they been dead for sometime it would be noticeable - which would mean Nevill couldn’t have called so .....

[Caroline]

Waiting 25 minutes after what? The alleged phone call from Nevill? That supposedly happened about 3.10, and Jeremy called the police at about 3.24. That's not 25 minutes.

I don't see why he would suddenly want the police to hurry up if he'd been delaying them.

The claim is now, that he called the police at 03:36!

[Kaldin]

Well, had Sheila ‘just’ shot them and herself, you would expect them to still be warm. Had they been dead for sometime it would be noticeable - which would mean Nevill couldn’t have called so .....

I take your point, but I still don't think that the fact he didn't call 999 means very much. He couldn't have known that Witham or Chelmsford wouldn't call out the firearms unit straightaway, or that the Witham police wouldn't try to get into the house.

[Caroline]

I take your point, but I still don't think that the fact he didn't call 999 means very much. He couldn't have known that Witham or Chelmsford wouldn't call out the firearms unit straightaway, or that the Witham police wouldn't try to get into the house.

He could if he was there to influence matters. The 999 issue is very much down to interpretation but even when I thought he was innocent, I couldn't understand why he wouldn't have called the emergency services or, if he didn't want to do that, why he didn't do as his father had requested and head on over to WHF. I'd have done both!

[Jane]

I take your point, but I still don't think that the fact he didn't call 999 means very much. He couldn't have known that Witham or Chelmsford wouldn't call out the firearms unit straightaway, or that the Witham police wouldn't try to get into the house.

Why would anyone in his situation need to try to second guess what the emergency services might -or not- do? Regarding what Jeremy did, had there been no duplicity on his part, there'd have been no need to worry. Not for a moment do I think that half a dozen boys in blue would have charged the door with a rammer, they'd have tried to make contact first, If there HAD been a terrible misunderstanding and an irate Nevill had answered the door, the responsibility would have been his, not Jeremy's. I feel quite certain he could have smoothed the whole thing over in some way.

[Kaldin]

I'm afraid I'm not following all this any more - it's too confusing. All I can say is that I don't find it suspicious that Jeremy didn't ring 999.

[Steve_uk]

I'm afraid I'm not following all this any more - it's too confusing. All I can say is that I don't find it suspicious that Jeremy didn't ring 999.

But why then flick through the telephone directory looking for another number..

[Jane]

I'm afraid I'm not following all this any more - it's too confusing. All I can say is that I don't find it suspicious that Jeremy didn't ring 999.

I'm confused about WHY you find it confusing. Try to imagine yourself on the receiving end of a terrified family member who has found themselves in a potentially life threatening situation. Are you going to flick through various numbers until you find a manned police station? Are you going to phone a friend? Won't you be worried out of your mind every minute you do nothing positive? OR are you going to phone 999?

[Kaldin]

I'm confused about WHY you find it confusing. Try to imagine yourself on the receiving end of a terrified family member who has found themselves in a potentially life threatening situation. Are you going to flick through various numbers until you find a manned police station? Are you going to phone a friend? Won't you be worried out of your mind every minute you do nothing positive? OR are you going to phone 999?

I find all the different points of view confusing.

We simply don't know how terrified Nevill allegedly sounded. He didn't actually say much did he? It seems that Jeremy rang Julie, and she told him to go back to bed. Perhaps he thought at first it wasn't that serious, then thought it might be, but not enough to ring 999. Perhaps he wasn't that bothered what Sheila was doing. Perhaps it didn't occur to him that the whole family would be shot.

It's all speculation anyway.

[Caroline]

I'm afraid I'm not following all this any more - it's too confusing. All I can say is that I don't find it suspicious that Jeremy didn't ring 999.

Factor in that (according to him now), he didn't call 999 AND it took him 26 minutes not to do so. 26 minutes is a long time to contemplate and even by the original timings, 14 minutes is aso quite some time if you believe that your family are in danger!

[Jane]

I find all the different points of view confusing.

We simply don't know how terrified Nevill allegedly sounded. He didn't actually say much did he? It seems that Jeremy rang Julie, and she told him to go back to bed. Perhaps he thought at first it wasn't that serious, then thought it might be, but not enough to ring 999. Perhaps he wasn't that bothered what Sheila was doing. Perhaps it didn't occur to him that the whole family would be shot.

It's all speculation anyway.

Or is it that you're confused about what you think?

We actually DO know how terrified was Nevill.
 A) He allegedly got his son out of bed circa 3am to tell him
 B) We have Jeremy's word that he'd sounded panicked/terrified.

I'll grant that it's extremely difficult to decipher how Jeremy was feeling about something I don't believe happened, however, he pulled it out the bag eventually and went through the motions.

Some of the padding may be speculation. The facts aren't.

[Kaldin]

Factor in that (according to him now), he didn't call 999 AND it took him 26 minutes not to do so. 26 minutes is a long time to contemplate and even by the original timings, 14 minutes is aso quite some time if you believe that your family are in danger!

It wasn't 26 minutes, unless you now believe that he phoned the police at 3.37.

[Caroline]

It wasn't 26 minutes, unless you now believe that he phoned the police at 3.37.

I don't believe that - but that is what he is prepared to now say in order to ask people like yourself to buy that Nevill phoned the police. Don't you find it odd that he is prepared to stretch the time of his phone call from his initial timing of 03:24/5 to 03:36 when he knows this isn't the case? He KNOWS this isn't the case because he attempted to bring a perjury case against West for logging his call at 03:36. An innocent man would stick to the facts but he's prepared to change them.

[Caroline]

I don't believe that - but that is what he is prepared to now say in order to ask people like yourself to buy that Nevill phoned the police. Don't you find it odd that he is prepared to stretch the time of his phone call from his initial timing of 03:24/5 to 03:36 when he knows this isn't the case? He KNOWS this isn't the case because he attempted to bring a perjury case against West for logging his call at 03:36. An innocent man would stick to the facts but he's prepared to change them.

However, what I find even MORE disturbing, is that people who know what has been claimed before, are prepared to promote such a change without even bothering to explain the change!

[Kaldin]

I don't believe that - but that is what he is prepared to now say in order to ask people like yourself to buy that Nevill phoned the police. Don't you find it odd that he is prepared to stretch the time of his phone call from his initial timing of 03:24/5 to 03:36 when he knows this isn't the case? He KNOWS this isn't the case because he attempted to bring a perjury case against West for logging his call at 03:36. An innocent man would stick to the facts but he's prepared to change them.

I've never believed that Nevill phoned the police. He will get nowhere with this appeal IMO, unless there are other pieces of new evidence. The fact is that Jeremy phoned West at about 3.24. It could have been 3.22 or 3.23, but he did not leave it 25 minutes before he phoned.

I don't find it odd because he is looking for anything which he thinks could clear him. That doesn't signify either guilt or innocence.