Jeremy Bamber Forum
JEREMY BAMBER CASE => Jeremy Bamber Case Discussion => Topic started by: mike tesko on February 04, 2012, 04:03:AM
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Crime scene video - taken as part of training exercise - bodies insitu...
Here is a still photograph taken /or recreated later on, by PC Bird from the crime scene video taken by (Headquarters SOCO) police ( at the crime scene during a one hour period between 9.00am - 10.00 am) as part of a training exercise they performed with the bodies of the victims still insitu /or much later at Chelmsford hospital mortuary, and created by PC Bird as part of the overall matter of cops covering the tracks by falsely claiming that Sheila's body had remained unmoved, untouched and left from 7. 30am, until 10.00am, before PC Bird had the first opportunity to ke any crime scene photographs by himself!
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You will recall, how I have previously drawn attention to the fact that during a police de-briefing held at Witham, on evening of 7th August 1985, involving senior police officers and members of the tactical firearms team, how PS 'Brian' Adams had complained about the position of Sheila's body being different in the video taken by PC Bird (SOC), as opposed to when he (Adams) had viewed the body insitu, at about 9am?
Well, this still photograph was taken from that video footage and highlights part of the issue which PS Adams raised with senior officers, at that de-briefing, and which 'HE' brought to the attention of COLP in his 1991 interviews...
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I would just like to say, or point out that in no way do these newly posted images prove that Sheila's body was not on the bed, since clearly they were taken once Sheila's body had been moved to the bedroom floor, from the bed, and transported to Chelmsford hospital mortuary, and by undertakers from 1.15pm, onward...
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What is very interesting by referring to these particular images is that either Sheila was not yet dead and she was thrashing her head about from side to side, and back and forth, or the police at the scene moved and stage managed her body...
Now...
Which is it?
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If these photographs can be proved to be Sheila,then they are very damning. How could she bleed like that after the crime scene photos were taken if the official line was that she had been dead for hours?
But if the photos are indeed of Sheila,then why did Adams not question the amount of blood as well as the position of her head in relation to the bedside cabinet?Or am I missing something?
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If these photographs can be proved to be Sheila,then they are very damning.How could she bleed like that after the crime scene photos were taken if the official line was that she had been dead for hours?
But if the photos are indeed of Sheila,then why did Adams not question the amount of blood as well as the position of her head in relation to the bedside cabinet?Or am I missing something?
That is a very good point, and I don't know why it is not recorded about the amount of blood, the only thing I can think of as to why this was, or is omitted, was down to how COLP recorded the facts due to them not wanting to highlight the existence of the video footage which clearly showed a presence of more blood upon Sheila's face, and neck, which was inconsistent with the amount of blood in those areas in the official crime scene photographs?
COLP obviously knew about the training exercise, and that video footage had been taken with the bodies of the victims insitu, and they did not want to draw attention to this - in my opinion...
The still photograph is genuine, it was taken from the video footage that I have been speaking about and clearly shows a vast amount of extra blood upon her face and neck, which came about as a result of her body being moved and stage managed by police at the scene...
GENUINE CRIME SCENE IMAGE TAKEN FROM VIDEO FOOTAG AT SCENE WITH BODY STILL IN SITU...
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Sheila's head must have been moving around a lot for all this extra blood to end up on her face and neck, by the time this video footage was taken by PC Bird (SOC) and this is not consistent with her being already dead for over seven to eight hours, in my opinion...
What we need, is a time when PC Bird (SOC) started to take this video footage at the scene, and the time when he concluded those duties...
Thank YOU...
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Sheila's head must have been moving around a lot for all this extra blood to end up on her face and neck, by the time this video footage was taken by PC Bird (SOC) and this is not consistent with her being already dead for over seven to eight hours, in my opinion...
What we need, is a time when PC Bird (SOC) started to take this video footage at the scene, and the time when he concluded those duties...
Thank YOU...
I am not sure if anyone has yet asked such a question?
But questions such as this need to be asked, and answers provided, as soon as possible...
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I am not sure if anyone has yet asked such a question?
But questions such as this need to be asked, and answers provided, as soon as possible...
Absolutely!
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For some reason, I am fascinated by that circle of deep red blood at the corner of Sheilas mouth.Her left side as we look at her. Kind of at the bottom of her left nostril. Looks to me as being about the same size as that "almost circle" stain of blood on the carpet to the side of her.The stain that it is thought may have been made by the barrel of a rifle,or an "S" for the word "sin".
Could it have been made from that circular blob of blood that I refer to?
Anyway,gotta go now and get hubby up and off to work.Take care Mike x
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For some reason,I am fascinated by that circle of deep red blood at the corner of Sheilas mouth.Her left side as we look at her.Kind of at the bottom of her left nostril.Looks to me as being about the same size as that "almost circle" stain of blood on the carpet to the side of her.The stain that it is thought may have been made by the barrel of a rifle,or an "S" for the word "sin".
Could it have been made from that circular blob of blood that I refer to?
Anyway,gotta go now and get hubby up and off to work.Take care Mike x
cheers...
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If these photographs can be proved to be Sheila,then they are very damning.How could she bleed like that after the crime scene photos were taken if the official line was that she had been dead for hours?
But if the photos are indeed of Sheila,then why did Adams not question the amount of blood as well as the position of her head in relation to the bedside cabinet?Or am I missing something?
Notice the blood run just under the right nostril. Compare the two photos. Also the two neck wounds are in exactly the same place. Look also at the hairline. Exactly the same.
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Undertakers need to be contacted and shown pictures, and asked what the state of the blood was on Sheila's face and neck, before they moved the bodies and bagged them up, in particular the body of Sheila. I have the names of the undertakers to hand somewhere, the ones who helped take the bodies to the mortuary...
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Such a large amnount of blood around the face could be caused by the use of cpr?
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Notice the blood run just under the right nostril. Compare the two photos. Also the two neck wounds are in exactly the same place.
It's definitely an image taken of Sheila, its taken from the video footage of the scene, a video which PC Bird (SOC) took, but which was handed over to the firearms unit because it recorded the training exercise that unfolded whilst SOC were trying to go about their business. Police Inspector 'Ivor' Montgomery, and PS Woodcock, remained at the scene until turned 11:15am, so they must have been involved in the training exercise whilst bodies were still in situ...
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Such a large amnount of blood around the face could be caused by the use of cpr?
That's a very interesting observation, yet nobody says they attempted it?
It is also very interesting that there are other bloodstains on the other side of her neck near to her chin, which are absent in the earlier photograph?
Could these bloodstains be linked to CPR, activity?
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In David Shaws account (Innocent man) he talks about police at the scene giving Sheila CPR to try and keep her alive, I wonder if this is what he was referring to, what I mean is this image with all this additional blood around the mouth, face and throat?
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In David Shaws account (Innocent man) he talks about police at the scene giving Sheila CPR to try and keep her alive, I wonder if this is what he was referring to, what I mean is this image with all this additional blood around the mouth, face and throat?
What is also interesting, is that none of this blood was leaking at all from the corners of her mouth in the photographs I have seen of Sheila on the bed. Furthermore, she only had one wound to her neck at that time, so it looks like Sheila was shot for the second time, after PC Bird (SOC) started to take his crime scene pictures, and which resulted in Sheila being moved to the bedroom floor, and that once she was moved there, somebody attempted CPR to keep her alive, but why would they do that if Sheila had already been dead for over seven to eight hours?
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That's a very interesting observation, yet nobody says they attempted it?
It is also very interesting that there are other bloodstains on the other side of her neck near to her chin, which are absent in the earlier photograph?
Could these bloodstains be linked to CPR, activity?
I'll be interested in hearing mertol's observation on this one. I'm just wondering if blood flowed so freely out of the wounds both outside and inside the body of Sheila. Could this be an indication that the time of death was very close to when the photos were taken?
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What is also interesting, is that none of this blood was leaking at all from the corners of her mouth in the photographs I have seen of Sheila on the bed. Furthermore, she only had one wound to her neck at that time, so it looks like Sheila was shot for the second time, after PC Bird (SOC) started to take his crime scene pictures, and which resulted in Sheila being moved to the bedroom floor, and that once she was moved there, somebody attempted CPR to keep her alive, but why would they do that if Sheila had already been dead for over seven to eight hours?
Based on this startling discovery, it seems obvious to me, that and because other photographs of Sheila on the bed with no blood running or leaking from the corners of her mouth, and only one wound to her neck exist, and that she is then moved to the bedroom floor and photographed by PC Bird (SOC) again, that these images were taken before the video footage from which this still has been taken was took, that it might well have been recorded on the video footage when and by whom the CPR (if it was applied) was given? This might be true if any CPR was administered before the still from the video footage was actually taken? This is why access to that video recording is of paramount importance to Jeremy's application to the CCRC to get his case referred back to appeal. Anyway, if CPR was being administered around or soon after 10am, then under no circumstances could Sheila have already been dead from as long ago as 3am, or beyond, and Jeremy could not possibly be responsible for killing Sheila by shooting her under the chin with the second fatal shot because the pathologist, Peter Venezis, has gone on record as saying that as soon as the shot under the chin was fired or discharged into her brain death would have followed instantaneously...
Ok, then...
So, if police at the scene administered CPR, why would they be doing that at around 10am, if Sheila was shot and killed by Jeremy, and he had shot her under the chin at some godforsaken unearthly hour prior to 3am?
I think not...
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I'll be interested in hearing mertol's observation on this one. I'm just wondering if blood flowed so freely out of the wounds both outside and inside the body of Sheila. Could this be an indication that the time of death was very close to when the photos were taken?
Yes, mertols view might be important...
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The first photograph shown on this topic is, if I'm not mistaken, the photograph that we were discussing in the 'opinions' topic started by andrea regarding the You Tube video and whether the photograph of Sheila, heavily bloodstained, was actually her or the actress in the video. If I'm correct this means that this is proof that the photograph is indeed Sheilas.
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Notice the blood run just under the right nostril. Compare the two photos. Also the two neck wounds are in exactly the same place. Look also at the hairline. Exactly the same.
The shape of the chin, the slight protrudence under the lower lip and the contours of the area between the lower lip and chin are distinctive too and these are the same in both photos.
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That's a very interesting observation, yet nobody says they attempted it?
It is also very interesting that there are other bloodstains on the other side of her neck near to her chin, which are absent in the earlier photograph?Could these bloodstains be linked to CPR, activity?
That is indeed puzzling. It looks like smears - and must be smears, since there is no source of bleeding in that area of her face.
Who made the smear?
Mike, I asked in another thread, but this is the appropriate place; but how can you with such certainty conclude that the picture is from a video? To me it looks like a still photography.
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That is indeed puzzling. It looks like smears - and must be smears, since there is no source of bleeding in that area of her face.
Who made the smear?
Mike, I asked in another thread, but this is the appropriate place; but how can you with such certainty conclude that the picture is from a video? To me it looks like a still photography.
PC Bird only visited the bedroom twice, and took pictures of June and Sheila, then went elsewhere in the farmhouse, before returning to take two pictures of Sheila's feet. At what stage do you think this image was taken, during the first visit to the bedroom, or the second? Where is the negative for this picture? Nobody knows anything about such a negative, or that Sheila had all this blood all over her face and neck whilst her body was insitu at the scene...
Forget it being a photograph, it's definitely a still taken from the crime scene video, the same video that PS Adams referred to when he spoke to COLP in 1991 about what took place at the debriefing which was held at Witham on evening of 7th August 1985...
Video of crime scene exists but they don't want to disclose it to Jeremy, and there has to be a good reason for that, my guess is that there is something contained in the video which would signal the collapse of the case against him...
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As I say, there is no reason why all this additional blood on Sheila's face and neck, should be there because her body has not been moved to any significant extent, between photographs, other than possibly her head, and it leads me to conclude that all this additional blood must be linked to CPR having been applied?
I would love to know the extent of the delay between the photograph of Sheila on the floor with the rifle against her neck and fresh looking blood which is running and leaking from the wound and the corner of her mouth, and the time when the video footage was taken at the point when she has all this blood on her face and neck was taken?
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Another way of looking at this image which shows all this blood on Sheila's face and neck, is to consider the possibility that it was taken before the other pictures and that Sheila was cleaned up and then her body stage managed with the rifle in various positions on her body or against her neck?
Did police clean up Sheila's face and neck before some crime scene pictures were taken by PC Bird (SOC)?
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Another way of looking at this image which shows all this blood on Sheila's face and neck, is to consider the possibility that it was taken before the other pictures and that Sheila was cleaned up and then her body stage managed with the rifle in various positions on her body or against her neck?
Did police clean up Sheila's face and neck before some crime scene pictures were taken by PC Bird (SOC)?
It's funny you should mention that. I actually wondered about that my self. But I persuaded my self that the clean up job was too good and it was therefore unlikely.
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Our cousins in the guilty camp have expressed the view that blood seeped out in such copious amounts, due to blood having welled up in the mouth area. I further suggested that the wounds would be connected to this area. The blood seeped out of the wounds and then also seeped out of the mouth, when Sheila was moved. I still suspect later death for Sheila as per my previous stance. But why have we not seen the response from the authorities to the submissions made under the GDS period regarding the Italian professors' work?
I've copy & pasted my own post on to this thread, from the 'Jackie Preece' thread. Mike do you know how the authorities responded to the submissions under GDS, containing the report referenced above? I believe there may also have been a letter to the Home Secretary or at least the CCRC. It's on the GDS legal site.
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I've copy & pasted my own post on to this thread, from the 'Jackie Preece' thread. Mike do you know how the authorities responded to the submissions under GDS, containing the report referenced above? I believe there may also have been a letter to the Home Secretary or at least the CCRC. It's on the GDS legal site.
The CCRC said that they did not attach much weight to the report of the two Italian professors because their conclusions were based only upon examination of photographs.
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I've copy & pasted my own post on to this thread, from the 'Jackie Preece' thread. Mike do you know how the authorities responded to the submissions under GDS, containing the report referenced above? I believe there may also have been a letter to the Home Secretary or at least the CCRC. It's on the GDS legal site.
Basically put...
the Italian expert concluded that Sheila had not died any sooner than about two hours prior to the time of this photograph having been taken:-
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I would hate to think what the conclusion might have been if the Italian expert had seen a good copy of the other image showing all that additional blood on Sheila's face and neck?
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The shot under the chin would not have created the opportunity for backspatter to occur, because the bullet (PV/19) would have penetrated into the void of the mouth, up through the roof of the mouth, and into the brain - basically in order for backspatter to occur there needs to be a build up of pressure in the track created by the bullet which forces blood and tissue back out via the entry wound, but in this case it could not possibly have happened because there would not be an opportunity for the build up of pressure required to produce the phenomena, due to any pressure which followed behind the path and trajectory of the bullet (PV/19) dissipatating in side the void of the mouth...
This should have been a significant part of the defence case to try and counter the argument that Sheila's blood got into the silencer at the time she was killed by being shot under the chin...
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The change in quantity of blood on Sheila's face and neck as shown between reference to the two aforementioned pictures needs to be explained by the police and prosecution...
Was this additional blood the result of CPR being applied?
Follow link and click on 'watch the TV advert':-
(1) - http://www.bhf.org.uk/heart-health/life-saving-skills/hands-only-cpr.aspx?gclid=CMC0_pDZhK4CFQELfAodA3t66g
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The change in quantity of blood on Sheila's face and neck as shown between reference to the two aforementioned pictures needs to be explained by the police and prosecution...
It looks smeared.
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You would have to remove the rifle from atop the body in order to apply CPR...
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You would have to remove the rifle from atop the body in order to apply CPR...
If you apply CPR by pressing forcibly upon the chest of the patient there is always going to be a good chance that any blood which may have pooled in the mouth will be forced out and leave blood trails on the face and neck...
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If you apply CPR by pressing forcibly upon the chest of the patient there is always going to be a good chance that any blood which may have pooled in the mouth will be forced out and leave blood trails on the face and neck...
This is precisely what appears to have happened in this case...
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Key point, then...
Who applied CPR, when and why?
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Seems to me, that the timing of the second fatal shot under the chin is the key to fathoming out when police thought about, or applied CPR...
It's all about working out when CPR could have been applied, to produce the additional blood on Sheila's face and neck...
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would just like to dispel any idea that any member or guest of the forum may have that this picture which shows the additional blood on Sheila's face and neck, was taken at the scene, rather than at the mortuary?
Please be reassured that this still image was taken whilst Sheila's body was in situ at the scene in the bedroom....
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Irrespective of any member or guest thinking this image which shows the additional blood upon Sheila's face or neck, was taken as photograph, or from video footage, you need to ask yourselves why all this additional blood is shown on Sheila's face and neck - how and under what circumstance did it get there?
More importantly...
what was the delay between the following images having been taken at the scene?
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I have studied the evidence in this case, about when PC Bird (SOC) took crime scene pictures in the bedroom of Sheila, including for the fact that he also took the crucial photograph of the rifle leaning up against the bedroom window from the vantage point of the middle landing of the main stair which shows the rifle leaning up against the bedroom window, and the fact that PC Bird went back to the bedroom to take additional pictures of Sheila in the bedroom, after he took photographs in other areas of the farmhouse?
Is it possible that...
PC Bird took the video footage when he returned to the bedroom on the second occasion when he took pictures of Sheila's feet?
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What members and guests should realize is that PC Bird did take video footage as confirmed by comments made by PS Adams to the COLP investigators (1991), but for some reason PC Bird himself does not mention taking any video footage?
Odd, to say the least...
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I do believe it to be Sheila in the 'still/video' photo - same nightie, same nose, same wounds. (Even the 'other forum' accept it is Sheila as they explain the blood is due to Sheila being moved.)
However, IMO, the picture with all the blood is how I'd imagine someone would look if they had been shot twice through the neck.
I wonder if she had been cleaned up? Although Rochy thinks it looks like too good a job, in the original photo we are used to seeing of Sheila on the floor, which shows two wounds and trickles of blood, with pooling of blood under her arm, it looks like there are faint fingermarks on her throat.
I'm trying to work out why there is no rifle in this new picture. Was it by Sheila's side perhaps?
Both pics show two wounds to the throat. But which was taken first? Would a photo be taken just before a video, because to perform CPR, the police must have realised she was just recently shot a second time and they wouldn't have done this with rifle still over her, so how long would she have been in that position? Seconds?! It must be the other way round.
In that case, why would they then just produce the photos of Sheila, showing her looking relatively peaceful/clean with rifle across her body (in different positions)? They must have been taken last and therefore staged.
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Holy Shit! That's all i can say for now.
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Holy Shit! That's all i can say for now.
Gunga, can you expand?!
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Gunga, can you expand?!
Yeah, I just think this is really huge evidence in all that I've view/read.
If this doesn't prove something isn't untoward, then i'm Elvis Prelsey!
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would just like to dispel any idea that any member or guest of the forum may have that this picture which shows the additional blood on Sheila's face and neck, was taken at the scene, rather than at the mortuary?
Please be reassured that this still image was taken whilst Sheila's body was in situ at the scene in the bedroom....
Mike if it helps keira asked me about this earlier this week, based on what i see i do not believe this image of Sheila was taken at i assume Chelmsford mortuary, i think monkeytrafford thought it was, most deceased at a mortuary on arrival normally go onto a steel tray with a headblock, these days the deceaced are weighed 1st, the image needs to be confirmed, but i believe this is Sheila in the same room , and if it is how it can be explained the 2 pictures that may not be easy, i also believe other images like this may exist.
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Poor Sheila
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Poor Sheila
Keira i think said the same Jackie the picture is upsetting im no expert on these matters but her expression may contain part of a answer , this young lady may have been trying to respond to CPR.
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Is there anything to suggest that a pulse was looked for on the wrist, neck and groin of SC?
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People here seem to be implying that the photo/still was taken in the main bedroom, while people at the rival site tend to say that it was taken in the mortuary.
First, I have a very strong feeling that it wasn't the mortuary. Why would a mortuary slab have a vertical piece sticking up right behind the top of the deceased's head like the headboard on a bed? Or, alternatively, why would you put a slab right up against a wall? This would block access to the top of the head, making that part of the body extremely difficult to examine. Surely you should be able to walk freely around the slab and examine the body from all angles without difficulty.
On the other hand, I don't understand why the surface on which Sheila is lying looks so dark. I suppose that it could have something to do with the poor quality of the image and the lighting, but the nightie hasn't come out dark.
And what's that white-looking thing ending in a straight line above Sheila's left shoulder? She seems to be lying on that as well, unless it's a beam of bright light.
And where the hell is the bedside cabinet? It's nowhere in sight.
If it isn't the mortuary, and it isn't the bedroom, where could it be? Could it possibly be the place where the body was originally found when the police entered the building? I must admit, it's difficult to believe that the police would be stupid enough to place the body back there and record its position, but plenty of other things in this case don't make sense!
The dark surface doesn't seem to have a pattern on it, so it doesn't appear to be the kitchen carpet. The pantry floor had a dark surface, but that was tiled, and I can't see any sign of tile edges.
Does anybody who was familiar with the interior of the house as it was in 1985 have any ideas for an alternative location?
Yet another mystery.
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People here seem to be implying that the photo/still was taken in the main bedroom, while people at the rival site tend to say that it was taken in the mortuary.
First, I have a very strong feeling that it wasn't the mortuary. Why would a mortuary slab have a vertical piece sticking up right behind the top of the deceased's head like the headboard on a bed? Or, alternatively, why would you put a slab right up against a wall? This would block access to the top of the head, making that part of the body extremely difficult to examine. Surely you should be able to walk freely around the slab and examine the body from all angles without difficulty.
On the other hand, I don't understand why the surface on which Sheila is lying looks so dark. I suppose that it could have something to do with the poor quality of the image and the lighting, but the nightie hasn't come out dark.
And what's that white-looking thing ending in a straight line above Sheila's left shoulder? She seems to be lying on that as well, unless it's a beam of bright light.
And where the hell is the bedside cabinet? It's nowhere in sight.
If it isn't the mortuary, and it isn't the bedroom, where could it be? Could it possibly be the place where the body was originally found when the police entered the building? I must admit, it's difficult to believe that the police would be stupid enough to place the body back there and record its position, but plenty of other things in this case don't make sense!
The dark surface doesn't seem to have a pattern on it, so it doesn't appear to be the kitchen carpet. The pantry floor had a dark surface, but that was tiled, and I can't see any sign of tile edges.
Does anybody who was familiar with the interior of the house as it was in 1985 have any ideas for an alternative location?
Yet another mystery.
I certainly don't think it is the mortuary. It is far too dark a picture for that. And as mertol has said before, there is no head block. It may be the bedroom? Her haed seems to be in the same position as the other photo?
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It does look as though the head is tilted towards the right, although maybe not as much as in the more familiar photos. It's difficult to tell.
If it is the bedroom and Sheila is in the same place, then not only has the gun been removed, so has the bedside cabinet!
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Another way of looking at this image which shows all this blood on Sheila's face and neck, is to consider the possibility that it was taken before the other pictures and that Sheila was cleaned up and then her body stage managed with the rifle in various positions on her body or against her neck?
Did police clean up Sheila's face and neck before some crime scene pictures were taken by PC Bird (SOC)?
That is too far fetched for me to believe. Besides, a forensic pathologist would have spotted that.
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It does look as though the head is tilted towards the right, although maybe not as much as in the more familiar photos. It's difficult to tell.
If it is the bedroom and Sheila is in the same place, then not only has the gun been removed, so has the bedside cabinet!
No...
its definitely in the bedroom...
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Here is reference to video of crime scene that was taken:-
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Don't know if it's been brought up, but you would surely place body on floor and tilt head back to perform CPR.you would also have to "plug all the leaks in the neck" to efficently get air into the lungs. This would surely cause any blood trace on the neck area to show massive amounts of disturbance.... I'm not sure I see that in these photos.i think CPR should be discounted until someone sticks there hand up to doing it.
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Video of scene recorded at entries, in MPR - 604, 605, 606 and 628...
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Here is reference to video of crime scene that was taken:-
That seems very clear Mike.
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Don't know if it's been brought up, but you would surely place body on floor and tilt head back to perform CPR.you would also have to "plug all the leaks in the neck" to efficently get air into the lungs. This would surely cause any blood trace on the neck area to show massive amounts of disturbance.... I'm not sure I see that in these photos.i think CPR should be discounted until someone sticks there hand up to doing it.
You were saying about additional blood to the entry wounds in the neck?
Take a closer look at how much more blood there is in those particular areas...
Or am I seeing things?
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Don't know if it's been brought up, but you would surely place body on floor and tilt head back to perform CPR.you would also have to "plug all the leaks in the neck" to efficently get air into the lungs. This would surely cause any blood trace on the neck area to show massive amounts of disturbance.... I'm not sure I see that in these photos.i think CPR should be discounted until someone sticks there hand up to doing it.
Looking at the two holes in the neck, if CPR had been attempted the fatal wound would of been more smeared IMO. I obviously agree there is more blood on the neck & right cheek but could be this more to do with the recovery position?
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That seems very clear Mike.
Here is a clearer view of what is said about these videos:-
Looks like the video cassettes were held in storage at Braintree police station?
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Looking at the two holes in the neck, if CPR had been attempted the fatal wound would of been more smeared IMO. I obviously agree there is more blood on the neck & right cheek but could be this more to do with the recovery position?
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All the blood runs down that one side. As if the heads been laid over. And wasnt a patch of bloodied carpet cut out of that area?
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Item 7(a) is of interest, because it appears to be the nut from the end of the rifles barrel, and no-one says where this was found, who found it, or when it was found?
I was just wondering if this was the end of the guns barrel which DS Davidson was talking to COLP about in his 1991 police interviews?
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Did this nut have paint ingrained into/onto it, and was this the reason why 'Ron' Cook took paint sample RC/1 from the scene on 8th August 1985?
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Did this nut have paint ingrained into/onto it, and was this the reason why 'Ron' Cook took paint sample RC/1 from the scene on 8th August 1985?
How did it end up as court exhibit 49, iof no-one referred to it in any way, either in statement, pocketbook or whilst testifying?
have I missed something altogether, here?
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Sorry to resurrect a vintage thread, but I'm absolutely fascinated by the photography aspects of the case, and especially by this idea that there is a crime scene video somewhere. It's real dramatic conspiracy stuff, and best of all, there is serious evidence to support it.
In this thread, which I found having done a quick forum search, Mike seems to provide good evidence for it, if only in documentary form. It is possible that the items in PC Whiddon's memo refer to video montage cassettes rather than moving image video, but we don't know. Does anybody here know?
The images Mike includes at the beginning of the thread need further explanation. I suspect they come from a dramatisation or documentary about the shootings, but Mike thinks they're real and from the crime scene video. It could be both. Could Mike come back on the thread and elaborate, please?
And where is this video? I think there is one. Portable video recording technology was available and already mainstream back in 1985. If the police really did turn the scene into a training op, you can't necessarily blame them. This was a once-in-a-generation crime scene, and at least the more senior officers thought at this stage that the incident was immediately solved as an 'obvious' murder-suicide.
Mike comes in for some stick about his theories, which I think is unfair. Whatever, I think there may be something in the theory of a training op scenario. It's not far-fetched.
I think it's important because I'm fairly sure in my mind that Essex Police moved Sheila's body. The evidence for it doesn't quite reach the legal standard of proof, perhaps, but it's compelling enough to warrant further inquiries. There's the pocketbooks. There's Ann Eaton's statements and even her evidence-in-chief at trial. There's Julie Mugford's evidence, and while I'm not inclined to believe her on the kernel of it, she must have been reporting things from the crime scene from somebody else who knew. There's the blood patterning on Sheila's lower arms, which is not mirrored on the carpet and is thus consistent with the body having been moved, yet there is no evidence for Jeremy having moved her, nor is it clear why he would do so, unless he shot her in the second bedroom - that is, assuming she didn't kill herself.
I think, along with the extent of Mrs Mugford's constabularian dealings, that are probably shrouded by PII, moving Sheila's body is one of the dirty secrets of the case. If the suspicion is correct, then I think it was a terrible mistake on the part of Essex Police to conceal it at the time, they should have owned it and explained it to the jury - but the concealment reflected the culture at the time.
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Another thing:
Are there videos of the police and/or FSS disassembly and examination of exhibits? The silencer? The rifle?
I'd be very surprised if there aren't.
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That seems very clear Mike.
Neil, the CCRC had the video of the crime scene and refused to let Jeremy have access to it because they ruled that footage of his deceased family were too distressing to allow him to see it...
The Witham SOCO (Cook, Davidson, Hammersley or Bird) didn't take video footage at the crime scene, it must have been taken by Headquarters SOCO (Oakey, Eastwood or Henderson) whilst senior officers conducted informative's around the bodies of the victims...
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Neil, the CCRC had the video of the crime scene and refused to let Jeremy have access to it because they ruled that footage of his deceased family were too distressing to allow him to see it...
The Witham SOCO (Cook, Davidson, Hammersley or Bird) didn't take video footage at the crime scene, it must have been taken by Headquarters SOCO (Oakey, Eastwood or Henderson) whilst senior officers conducted informative's around the bodies of the victims...
Moving images or just a montage of static images?
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Moving images or just a montage of static images?
I do not have a conclusive answer to this. There was certainly a video made and shown to police officers but I was told by someone likely to have correct information that the video was not of the crime scene itself but contained a review of the crime scene still photographs. I found that a bit surprising because I know that at that time it was becoming increasingly common to video the scene of a serious crime as an addition to the normal crime scene photographs.
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I do not have a conclusive answer to this. There was certainly a video made and shown to police officers but I was told by someone likely to have correct information that the video was not of the crime scene itself but contained a review of the crime scene still photographs. I found that a bit surprising because I know that at that time it was becoming increasingly common to video the scene of a serious crime as an addition to the normal crime scene photographs.
The TFG were shown a montage of crime scene images, which resulted in 'real concerns' being raised to their superiors, regarding the movement of gun / head / bible. One had no recollection of a rifle, which is extraordinary. The defence didn't know about this until many years post conviction.
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I do not have a conclusive answer to this. There was certainly a video made and shown to police officers but I was told by someone likely to have correct information that the video was not of the crime scene itself but contained a review of the crime scene still photographs. I found that a bit surprising because I know that at that time it was becoming increasingly common to video the scene of a serious crime as an addition to the normal crime scene photographs.
How would they have done that, do you think? Would they have used a hi-res film scanner and then recorded the output?
I ask because there may be some forensic significance to it. If you're scanning negatives, then you're creating an additional forensic trail with scans of each negative produced and presumably stored somewhere.
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The TFG were shown a montage of crime scene images, which resulted in 'real concerns' being raised to their superiors, regarding the movement of gun / head / bible. One had no recollection of a rifle, which is extraordinary. The defence didn't know about this until many years post conviction.
Roch, see my post above (I think our posts must have been submitted simultaneously). Do you know how Essex Police would have produced such a montage technologically back in the 1980s?
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How would they have done that, do you think? Would they have used a hi-res film scanner and then recorded the output?
I ask because there may be some forensic significance to it. If you're scanning negatives, then you're creating an additional forensic trail with scans of each negative produced and presumably stored somewhere.
I really am not sure about this. The way it was explained to me was that there was a video made showing a sequence of the still photographic prints (not negatives) and it was used in a debriefing exercise for police officers involved. It does seem surprising to me and it may or may not be true but it is not what would happen today.
What is clear and is very suspicious is that many negatives were destroyed. The reasons given for that are not credible. Whatever your view on the case there is a lot which is very unsatisfactory.
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Roch, see my post above (I think our posts must have been submitted simultaneously). Do you know how Essex Police would have produced such a montage technologically back in the 1980s?
I'm afraid I don't know the answer QC. But I do know they were unhappy 'as a team' regarding the anomalies. I think they spoke with Montgomery, DCI Jones and maybe one other detective. Something happened in that farmhouse, between the TFG leaving the crime scene and Bird's crime scene photography commencing. There was quite a gap as well. Crime scene photography commenced about 10am.
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I'm afraid I don't know the answer QC. But I do know they were unhappy 'as a team' regarding the anomalies. I think they spoke with Montgomery, DCI Jones and maybe one other detective. Something happened in that farmhouse, between the TFG leaving the crime scene and Bird's crime scene photography commencing. There was quite a gap as well. Crime scene photography commenced about 10am.
I agree Roch. It is absolutely beyond doubt that some police officers involved felt very uncomfortable. The crime scene was certainly re-staged, for whatever reason.
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I agree Roch. It is absolutely beyond doubt that some police officers involved felt very uncomfortable. The crime scene was certainly re-staged, for whatever reason.
Here is a relevant question I have asked before and didn't receive an answer, so it may not be known, but let me re-try:
Does anybody here know if the bed in the master bedroom was hard or springy?
What brand/make of bed was it?
What was the mattress made of?
Was it wooden or metal framed?
How high was it off the floor?
The hard/springy question is particularly important, I think, to the question of police staging the scene.
I think the police did stage Sheila's body in the master bedroom, but for innocent reasons. To be precise, they re-staged it. One possibility is that, rightly or wrongly, the raid group officers found Sheila on the bed and they believed she was still breathing and/or conscious and went to her assistance. This caused the body to be moved on to the floor. (It may also have resulted in an accidental discharge of the rifle).
It sounds far-fetched, but in reality it's not because you would only need maybe two or three officers to know and they could, for one reason or another, keep it to themselves. Possibly the initial reason may have been a mistake or misunderstanding in which the information 'slipped through the cracks' because they simply weren't asked. It was just assumed by the detectives that the bodies were positioned as found.
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I agree Roch. It is absolutely beyond doubt that some police officers involved felt very uncomfortable. The crime scene was certainly re-staged, for whatever reason.
What was re staged?
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What was re staged?
The position Sheila is found in, with the position of the right arm and the left leg, resembles how somebody would look had they been untangled from the first aid recovery position.
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The position Sheila is found in, with the position of the right arm and the left leg, resembles how somebody would look had they been untangled from the first aid recovery position.
Of course.
The police must have pulled Sheila's legs after there accidental second shot as well.
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Of course.
The police must have pulled Sheila's legs after there accidental second shot as well.
The police shot Sheila.
Thanks Adam.
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The police shot Sheila.
Thanks Adam.
Do you agree with the CT. Who say Sheila was in the kitchen when the police entered WHF.
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Do you agree with the CT. Who say Sheila was in the kitchen when the police entered WHF.
You mean just before they entered?
I don't know. I'm open-minded about everything. My first reaction to it was that it's far-fetched, so I dismissed it in my own mind, but as I learn more about the case, I am having to re-consider basic things.
The main problem, as I see it, with her in the kitchen is that, when eventually found, she would have to have Nevill and June's blood on her and her hands and feet could not be 'clean' (within the parameters of the prosecution evidence). For that reason, her in the kitchen when the raid group are about to enter doesn't really fit the evidence.
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You mean just before they entered?
I don't know. I'm open-minded about everything. My first reaction to it was that it's far-fetched, so I dismissed it in my own mind, but as I learn more about the case, I am having to re-consider basic things.
The main problem, as I see it, with her in the kitchen is that, when eventually found, she would have to have Nevill and June's blood on her and her hands and feet could not be 'clean' (within the parameters of the prosecution evidence). For that reason, her in the kitchen when the raid group are about to enter doesn't really fit the evidence.
Thag is a good point. If Sheila had spent 4 hours walking around WHF between Nevill's call & the police entering, there is more chance of her feet being covered in blood.
No one has ever said why Sheila would keep herself alive for another 4 hours after such a brutal massacre of the other four
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Thag is a good point. If Sheila had spent 4 hours walking around WHF between Nevill's call & the police entering, there is more chance of her feet being covered in blood.
No one has ever said why Sheila would keep herself alive for another 4 hours after such a brutal massacre of the other four
To be fair, that part of it is a bit more plausible because, as a schizophrenic, she may have been in the habit of wandering aimlessly around the house and maybe in the farm yard, as if in a trance, and this could have gone on for several hours. One thing I have wondered about is if that used to happen, but she was not diagnosed with schizophrenia until after she had reached her teens, married and left the family home, and I've not seen it mentioned in accounts of visits there.
In any event, if - I only say, 'if' - she's just shot her entire family, then who knows what mental state should would have been in? As Dr. Bradley said at trial: The ordinary canons of logic do not apply in discussions about Sheila.
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To be fair, that part of it is a bit more plausible because, as a schizophrenic, she may have been in the habit of wandering aimlessly around the house and maybe in the farm yard, as if in a trance, and this could have gone on for several hours. One thing I have wondered about is if that used to happen, but she was not diagnosed with schizophrenia until after she had reached her teens, married and left the family home, and I've not seen it mentioned in accounts of visits there.
In any event, if - I only say, 'if' - she's just shot her entire family, then who knows what mental state should would have been in? As Dr. Bradley said at trial: The ordinary canons of logic do not apply in discussions about Sheila.
One minute in a murderous rage. The next wandering around in a trance.
Surprised she had time to read the bible.
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One minute in a murderous rage. The next wandering around in a trance.
Surprised she had time to read the bible.
Maybe she was carrying the Bible round with her?
Remember she needed time for a shower too. She's a busy gal.
By the way, I'm surprised you've not put me forward for the CT on the basis of my Crispy theory. You've hurt my feelings, Adam.
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I remember Mick Gradwell saying, as he viewed the WHF investigation that it was a shambles---pretty much the same words as he'd viewed the Jersey abuse scandal for which he was more involved in as an SIO at the time. During the WHF murders Gradwell was Deputy Superintendent.
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Video of scene recorded at entries, in MPR - 604, 605, 606 and 628...
So, who took the video footage at the crime scene, and Witham SOC, and or HQ scenes of crime (SOC)?
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So, what is who took the video footage at the crime scene, and Witham SOC, and or HQ scenes of crime (SOC)?
What's the official position of Essex Police on this, Mike? Do they say it was just a video montage of static images, and has any further disclosure been made about how the montage was produced and put together, and has there been disclosure of the montage itself?
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Crime scene video - taken as part of training exercise - bodies insitu...
Here is a still photograph taken /or recreated later on, by PC Bird from the crime scene video taken by (Headquarters SOCO) police ( at the crime scene during a one hour period between 9.00am - 10.00 am) as part of a training exercise they performed with the bodies of the victims still insitu /or much later at Chelmsford hospital mortuary, and created by PC Bird as part of the overall matter of cops covering the tracks by falsely claiming that Sheila's body had remained unmoved, untouched and left from 7. 30am, until 10.00am, before PC Bird had the first opportunity to ke any crime scene photographs by himself!
This practice of using a junior officer, to fabricate and produce a dishonest record concerning all the crime scene photographs that were taken (in particular) on the first morning of the investigation, only by PC David Bird, who was/is a damning lie, and which underscores with a very high degree of significance, the 'fairness' of Jeremy Bamber prosecution, his trial and its outcome, the appeal process, and his continued incarceration, simply because Essex police/CPS/trial judge, tricked ordinary members of the public (jury), and Bambers defence team of buying into a faked ( controversial/contentious) script..
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This practice of using a junior officer, to fabricate and produce a dishonest record concerning all the crime scene photographs that were taken (in particular) on the first morning of the investigation, only by PC David Bird, who was/is a damning lie, and which underscores with a very high degree of significance, the 'fairness' of Jeremy Bamber prosecution, his trial and its outcome, the appeal process, and his continued incarceration, simply because Essex police/CPS/trial judge, tricked ordinary members of the public (jury), and Bambers defence team of buying into a faked ( controversial/contentious) script..
Let's get the facts right, PC Bird took crime scene photographs at whf after 10.00am, and that there was 'no potential for anyone' to have taken other crime scene photographs, beforehand!
Yet, a team of headquarters SOCO took a series of crime scene photographs inside the farmhouse, between 9.00pm - 10.00am!
Unfortunately for PC Bird, Essex police and the CPS, some of those crime scene photographs which had been taken by Headquarters SOCO were included by PC Bird in the contents of 'The Master Copy album' which he created himself, and which were produced at Bambers trial (October 1986), initially, as photographs of which only he himself could have taken!
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Yet, a team of headquarters SOCO took a series of crime scene photographs inside the farmhouse, between 9.00pm - 10.00am!
Not only that or this, but Headquarters SOCO had been there at the scene, during a one hour period (9.00am - 10.00am), which coincides with the one hour period when senior officers claim to have been conducting 'Informatives' by reference to the position of the five dead bodies, and general items which have been considered to be 'of evidential value', and originally laid here and there in different locations to a body, or two...
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Not only that or this, but Headquarters SOCO had been there at the scene, during a one hour period (9.00am - 10.00am), which coincides with the one hour period when senior officers claim to have been conducting 'Informatives' by reference to the position of the five dead bodies, and general items which have been considered to be 'of evidential value', and originally laid here and there in different locations to a body, or two...
Reconstructing what senior officers at the scene and elsewhere thought had happened ('Informatives' carried out inside the farmhouse between 9.00am - 10.00am) included movement of victims bodies in an attempt to present a crime scene which supported the official view of the senior investigation officers (opinion).. .
They 'restaged the position of bodies' at the scene between 9.00am - 10.00am, used a team from Headquarters scenes of crime (SOCO) to photograph and film the entire transformation from where the bodies of all five victims had been 'there' and 'then' (9.00am), at various points throughout that period until 10.00am, by which stage senior officers were satisfied that the position of victims bodies and key pieces of evidence had been reset to support what police theorised had taken place!
Then, and once the crime scene was handed over to the team of Witham police station SOCO at 10.00am, who (they) photographed the crime scene which had been reset under the authority of senior officers beforehand, and made out that the photographs which had been taken by them showed the positions of the five bodies as though they had 'always been or which had remained insitu', and untouched by anyone - which was basically a deception.. .
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Reconstructing what senior officers at the scene and elsewhere thought had happened ('Informatives' carried out inside the farmhouse between 9.00am - 10.00am) included movement of victims bodies in an attempt to present a crime scene which supported the official view of the senior investigation officers (opinion).. .
'OH, WHAT A TANGLED WEB (of lies and mistruths) WE WEAVE, WHEN WE FIRST PRACTICE TO DECIEVE'
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'OH, WHAT A TANGLED WEB (of lies and mistruths) WE WEAVE, WHEN WE FIRST PRACTICE TO DECIEVE'
Why do the four cassettes upon which the crime scene videos were recorded prior to 1.15pm on the afternoon of 7th August 1985 (or later), haven't got any individual exhibit reference no's?
Video Cassettes of scene - MPR reference 604, 605, 606, and 626/628
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According to this official Essex police document, the four video cassettes (604, 605, 606 and 626/28) taken of the crime scene at whf, were returned to special Branch at Southend and they were all to be 'destroyed!
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They'd have to destroy everything before they all croak. I'm surprised there's anything but dust left in the archives.
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They'd have to destroy everything before they all croak. I'm surprised there's anything but dust left in the archives.
And as I've time and time again, surely it would make sense to destroy anything incriminating, and SURELY Jeremy's team of whatever they call themselves would have the sense to, at least recoginize it. What a waste of time then, to keep going on about how they need 'stuff' if they suspect there isn't any.
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And as I've time and time again, surely it would make sense to destroy anything incriminating, and SURELY Jeremy's team of whatever they call themselves would have the sense to, at least recoginize it. What a waste of time then, to keep going on about how they need 'stuff' if they suspect there isn't any.
That's just it, wouldn't the team think that everything would be long gone ? Surely common sense would tell you that there was nothing to stop you from burning everything before each appeal, particularly now.
Allegedly, whatever Ainslie sent to CAL was destroyed and he in turn would have told her to do the same.
The reason no more documents/files/photo's aren't forthcoming is that there aren't any, they'll all be burned but EP aren't likely to say that are they ?
They wouldn't have been destroyed if they all pointed to guilt that's for sure. The legal team at the back of JB have been working blind, so they have my greatest respect as lawyers working under those conditions.
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What's the official position of Essex Police on this, Mike? Do they say it was just a video montage of static images, and has any further disclosure been made about how the montage was produced and put together, and has there been disclosure of the montage itself?
Hi QCC,
Essex police have made no comment regarding any of the four cassette tapes (604, 605, 606, and 626/28). But, documentation exists to show that at a debriefing, held at Witham (Masonic Lodge) on the evening 7th August 1985, a senior officer told all the firearm officers who had been present at White House farm earlier in the day, that they should make up their pocketbook entries and statements by reference to (images) a crime scene video taken by PC Bird (Witham SOCO)!
Yet, according to 'Witham SOCO', no-one took a crime scene video at whf, and when you take into account, the reference to the numbered crime scene videos (604, 605, 606 and 626/28?). It becomes clear that three separate crime scene videos (604, 605 and 606), were taken, long before reference to cassette 626/28?
Linked to this, is the fact that PC Bird was only instructed to put together a photographic record (THE MASTER COPY ALBUM) which turned out to contain 223 images, after Jeremy Bambers first arrest at the beginning of September 1985, albeit he was present at the scene, and he took crime scene photographs there between 10.00am - 1.15pm, on 7th August 1985.
PC Bird himself, nor any other member of Witham SOC who performed duties at White House farm on that first morning of the police investigation refer to PC Bird or anyone of them taking video footage of the crime scene! There is no disclosed documentation the Witham SOC took video footage, only that PC Bird took all the photographs that were taken by Witham SOCO at the scene, which were referred to as many of those forming of 'THE MASTER COPY ALBUM'...
Involvement of and by Headquarters SOCO, at the scene was pushed to one side, as though they had never been there at all...
But..
It has since transpired, that a further 358 photographs had been taken at the scene, and elsewhere, which became part of another photographic album called, 'THE SENIOR INVESTIGATING OFFICERS ALBUM', which contained no less than a total of 581 images, including all the other 223 photographs of 'THE MASTER COPY ALBUM'...
Two photograph albums, then (a) 'THE SENIOR INVESTIGATING OFFICERS ALBUM' (581 images), and (b) 'THE MASTOR COPY ALBUM' (223 images). It seems almost inevitable that album (a) consisting of 581 images, included approximately 358 photographs taken by (1) Headquarters SOCO, and approximately 223 photographs taken by (2) Witham SOCO...
And..
That album (b) consisting of 223 images was intended to only contain photographs taken by (2) Witham SOCO...
Unfortunately, the task of PC Bird to create 'THE MASTER COPY ALBUM', proved too much, and in his haste, he included some images from the crime scene which had been taken by Headquarters SOCO before the Witham SOCO took their own...
The truth regarding this came out during PC Birds evidence in chief and cross examination. For example, he admitted that he had not taken some of the crime scene photographs contained in 'THE MASTER COPY ALBUM' that was introduced and being relied upon by the prosecution. He admitted that some photographs had been taken by DC OAKEY (Headquarters SOCO)! Some had been taken in the main bedroom, and showed the anshultz rifle in a different position on the body of Sheila Caffell, than photographs taken by PC Bird after 10.00am. In particular, one such photograph shows a view from the middle landing of the main stairs looking through an open door to the parents bedroom, with the rifle leaning up against the inside of the bedroom window! When questioned about this, in cross examination, he conceded that he did not know who had removed that rifle from the body of Sheila Caffell, or who had placed the rifle there against the main bedroom window! However, he did manage to get to say, that he had taken 'that' particular photograph (23), which was taken after he had completed his first period of photographing the main bedroom scene, and he going out of the bedroom to areas in the upstairs landing, bathroom, and top of the main stairs, before returning back into the main bedroom to take more pictures of Sheila Caffells, hands and feet...
(to be continued)...
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Hi QCC,
Essex police have made no comment regarding any of the four cassette tapes (604, 605, 606, and 626/28). But, documentation exists to show that at a debriefing, held at Witham (Masonic Lodge) on the evening 7th August 1985, a senior officer told all the firearm officers who had been present at White House farm earlier in the day, that they should make up their pocketbook entries and statements by reference to (images) a crime scene video taken by PC Bird (Witham SOCO)!
Yet, according to 'Witham SOCO', no-one took a crime scene video at whf, and when you take into account, the reference to the numbered crime scene videos (604, 605, 606 and 626/28?). It becomes clear that three separate crime scene videos (604, 605 and 606), were taken, long before reference to cassette 626/28?
Thanks. I think a crime scene video is likely. I can understand why Essex Police and the CPS might be coy about it, though, as I'm not sure I would want it floating around the worldwide web for everybody to see; but surely, if it exists, it should be released to Jeremy's defence?
I think there are at least six avenues of inquiry here:
(i). Crime scene video - does it exist, and if it does, where is it and who captured it?
(ii). Crime scene montage- we know it exists, so where is it? Who produced it and why?
(iii). Production/development methods for (i) and (ii) and surviving materials for forensic examination.
(iv). Presence of other press and media the crime scene. Who was there? What was recorded? Do private libraries/archives exist?
(v). Additional images captured by D.C. Bird that remain undisclosed. Full extent of police photo album required. Why have they not been disclosed?
(vi). Any photographs or other media captured by officers/police workers other than D.C. Bird. Where are these? Who took them? Why? Why have they not been disclosed?
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Thanks. I think a crime scene video is likely. I can understand why Essex Police and the CPS might be coy about it, though, as I'm not sure I would want it floating around the worldwide web for everybody to see; but surely, if it exists, it should be released to Jeremy's defence?
I think there are at least six avenues of inquiry here:
(i). Crime scene video - does it exist, and if it does, where is it and who captured it?
(ii). Crime scene montage- we know it exists, so where is it? Who produced it and why?
(iii). Production/development methods for (i) and (ii) and surviving materials for forensic examination.
(iv). Presence of other press and media the crime scene. Who was there? What was recorded? Do private libraries/archives exist?
(v). Additional images captured by D.C. Bird that remain undisclosed. Full extent of police photo album required. Why have they not been disclosed?
(vi). Any photographs or other media captured by officers/police workers other than D.C. Bird. Where are these? Who took them? Why? Why have they not been disclosed?
And not a single reason why any of this information should NOT be released unless they are trying to hide information that should be sent to Jeremy’s solicitor
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Thanks. I think a crime scene video is likely. I can understand why Essex Police and the CPS might be coy about it, though, as I'm not sure I would want it floating around the worldwide web for everybody to see; but surely, if it exists, it should be released to Jeremy's defence?
I think there are at least six avenues of inquiry here:
(i). Crime scene video - does it exist, and if it does, where is it and who captured it?
(ii). Crime scene montage- we know it exists, so where is it? Who produced it and why?
(iii). Production/development methods for (i) and (ii) and surviving materials for forensic examination.
(iv). Presence of other press and media the crime scene. Who was there? What was recorded? Do private libraries/archives exist?
(v). Additional images captured by D.C. Bird that remain undisclosed. Full extent of police photo album required. Why have they not been disclosed?
(vi). Any photographs or other media captured by officers/police workers other than D.C. Bird. Where are these? Who took them? Why? Why have they not been disclosed?
Hi QC,
I agree...
The prosecution and convictions against Jeremy Bamber appears to be based upon speculation, and an untrue script..
He was 'stitched up'.
He was a convenient scapegooat..
Essex police tampered with exhibits and bodies of victims in order to protect themselves, and to point the finger of guilt upon him!
Sheiila was almost certainly still alive, at the time the firearms officers forced entry into the farmhouse at around 7.30am..
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Police (or anybody else for that matter) do not have the habit of falsifying evidence which ordinarily confirms that they rely upon a pack of lies, to nail somebody (anybody) for a crime(s) he, or she did not commit, or be responsible for!
Sheila was still alive in the kitchen (when police forced entry into the farmhouse) - 7.30am, onwards!
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Sheila was still alive in the kitchen (when police forced entry into the farmhouse) - 7.30am, onwards!
By 9.13am she was shot and presumed to be dead!