Significance of two double marked bullet cases, found in kitchen?

[mike tesko]

If Ralph called Jeremy once June and the boys had been shot, instead of calling the police (still no actual record of that) he would have effectively been inviting Jeremy to his own injury or death.

... It is very interesting to hear you say that no record exists that such a call from Ralph to the police happened? However, if the Pii restriction was not in force, Essex police would not ae able to deceive anyone, any further on this point...

[clifford]

If Ralph called Jeremy once June and the boys had been shot, instead of calling the police (still no actual record of that) he would have effectively been inviting Jeremy to his own injury or death.

... It is very interesting to hear you say that no record exists that such a call from Ralph to the police happened? However, if the Pii restriction was not in force, Essex police would not ae able to deceive anyone, any further on this point...

Mike I cannot understand how witholding this information is in the publics interest. To my way of thinking it is the opposite.
Do you know if this info has been requested for the latest review.

[mike tesko]

If Ralph called Jeremy once June and the boys had been shot, instead of calling the police (still no actual record of that) he would have effectively been inviting Jeremy to his own injury or death.

... It is very interesting to hear you say that no record exists that such a call from Ralph to the police happened? However, if the Pii restriction was not in force, Essex police would not ae able to deceive anyone, any further on this point...

Mike I cannot understand how witholding this information is in the publics interest. To my way of thinking it is the opposite.
Do you know if this info has been requested for the latest review.

... Requested, but as I understand it, not disclosed...

[Jerry]

Surely, Mike, if June and the children had already been shot, Ralph would call for an ambulance and the police? What would be the point of calling Jeremy? How could he help once the shootings had begun?

... But you are forgeting that there are grounds for believing that Ralph did actually call the police, before he made the short call to Jeremy (discussed elsewhere)...

I find it hard to believe that Nevill would have had time to phone the police and Jeremy too if someone was running amok in his home with a rifle.

It is not recorded that Nevill ever phoned the police, only Jeremy's call to police is recorded reporting what his father allegedly said to him in a call some time earlier.

... Well, as you know - there is fresh information available which suggests that Ralph may have, or did make a separate call to the police. Yot only have to look at, why patrol car, CA07, was dispatched to the scene, before Jeremy contacted the police himself, to realize that the police were responding to a call for help, before police were even speaking to Jeremy. In addition to this, the person who called the police before Jeremy did, about this matter, identified the shooter, as 'his daughter', adding that 'daughter has got one of my gtns', and as you well know, Shiela was Ralphs daughter, and the weapon which is supposed to have fired all the bullets, was owned, amd it belonged to non other, than Ralph Bamber...

I fail to see what you are implying in this Mike as car CA07 was despatched at 3.35 and arrived on site at WHF at 3.48.   The telephone call which Jeremy made to the police was timed at 3.26 which by my reckoning is 9 minutes before car CA07 was despatched.

Consequently there is no mystery as to the despatching of car CA07 and no evidence that Nevill ever phoned the police.

[mike tesko]

Surely, Mike, if June and the children had already been shot, Ralph would call for an ambulance and the police? What would be the point of calling Jeremy? How could he help once the shootings had begun?

... But you are forgeting that there are grounds for believing that Ralph did actually call the police, before he made the short call to Jeremy (discussed elsewhere)...

I find it hard to believe that Nevill would have had time to phone the police and Jeremy too if someone was running amok in his home with a rifle.

It is not recorded that Nevill ever phoned the police, only Jeremy's call to police is recorded reporting what his father allegedly said to him in a call some time earlier.

... Well, as you know - there is fresh information available which suggests that Ralph may have, or did make a separate call to the police. Yot only have to look at, why patrol car, CA07, was dispatched to the scene, before Jeremy contacted the police himself, to realize that the police were responding to a call for help, before police were even speaking to Jeremy. In addition to this, the person who called the police before Jeremy did, about this matter, identified the shooter, as 'his daughter', adding that 'daughter has got one of my gtns', and as you well know, Shiela was Ralphs daughter, and the weapon which is supposed to have fired all the bullets, was owned, amd it belonged to non other, than Ralph Bamber...

I fail to see what you are implying in this Mike as car CA07 was despatched at 3.35 and arrived on site at WHF at 3.48.   The telephone call which Jeremy made to the police was timed at 3.26 which by my reckoning is 9 minutes before car CA07 was despatched.

Consequently there is no mystery as to the despatching of car CA07 and no evidence that Nevill ever phoned the police.

------------

It depends upon which clock you are relying on, and whose version of events as being accurate or not?

[Jerry]

Surely, Mike, if June and the children had already been shot, Ralph would call for an ambulance and the police? What would be the point of calling Jeremy? How could he help once the shootings had begun?

... But you are forgeting that there are grounds for believing that Ralph did actually call the police, before he made the short call to Jeremy (discussed elsewhere)...

I find it hard to believe that Nevill would have had time to phone the police and Jeremy too if someone was running amok in his home with a rifle.

It is not recorded that Nevill ever phoned the police, only Jeremy's call to police is recorded reporting what his father allegedly said to him in a call some time earlier.

... Well, as you know - there is fresh information available which suggests that Ralph may have, or did make a separate call to the police. Yot only have to look at, why patrol car, CA07, was dispatched to the scene, before Jeremy contacted the police himself, to realize that the police were responding to a call for help, before police were even speaking to Jeremy. In addition to this, the person who called the police before Jeremy did, about this matter, identified the shooter, as 'his daughter', adding that 'daughter has got one of my gtns', and as you well know, Shiela was Ralphs daughter, and the weapon which is supposed to have fired all the bullets, was owned, amd it belonged to non other, than Ralph Bamber...

I fail to see what you are implying in this Mike as car CA07 was despatched at 3.35 and arrived on site at WHF at 3.48.   The telephone call which Jeremy made to the police was timed at 3.26 which by my reckoning is 9 minutes before car CA07 was despatched.

Consequently there is no mystery as to the despatching of car CA07 and no evidence that Nevill ever phoned the police.

------------

It depends upon which clock you are relying on, and whose version of events as being accurate or not?

Lets keep to the one clock for consistency, the one the police control-room used when making the entries on the log.  There is a complete dearth of any evidence that Nevill ever phoned the police and it is disingenuous to imply otherwise.

[mike tesko]

Surely, Mike, if June and the children had already been shot, Ralph would call for an ambulance and the police? What would be the point of calling Jeremy? How could he help once the shootings had begun?

... But you are forgeting that there are grounds for believing that Ralph did actually call the police, before he made the short call to Jeremy (discussed elsewhere)...

I find it hard to believe that Nevill would have had time to phone the police and Jeremy too if someone was running amok in his home with a rifle.

It is not recorded that Nevill ever phoned the police, only Jeremy's call to police is recorded reporting what his father allegedly said to him in a call some time earlier.

... Well, as you know - there is fresh information available which suggests that Ralph may have, or did make a separate call to the police. Yot only have to look at, why patrol car, CA07, was dispatched to the scene, before Jeremy contacted the police himself, to realize that the police were responding to a call for help, before police were even speaking to Jeremy. In addition to this, the person who called the police before Jeremy did, about this matter, identified the shooter, as 'his daughter', adding that 'daughter has got one of my gtns', and as you well know, Shiela was Ralphs daughter, and the weapon which is supposed to have fired all the bullets, was owned, amd it belonged to non other, than Ralph Bamber...

I fail to see what you are implying in this Mike as car CA07 was despatched at 3.35 and arrived on site at WHF at 3.48.   The telephone call which Jeremy made to the police was timed at 3.26 which by my reckoning is 9 minutes before car CA07 was despatched.

Consequently there is no mystery as to the despatching of car CA07 and no evidence that Nevill ever phoned the police.

------------

It depends upon which clock you are relying on, and whose version of events as being accurate or not?

Lets keep to the one clock for consistency, the one the police control-room used when making the entries on the log.  There is a complete dearth of any evidence that Nevill ever phoned the police and it is disingenuous to imply otherwise.

-----------------

With respect, Sheila was not Jeremy's daughter, and the gun which is supposed to have been the only murder weapon was owned by Ralph Bamber, it should be obvious to anyone who is remotely interested that Sheila was Jeremy's sister and that Jeremy did not own any of the guns at the scene...

[mike tesko]

Depending upon which clock you choose to rely upon, the police arrived at the scene, at two different times, and everything they did whilst at the scene, had two different times associated with them, depending upon which clock was being referred to - in some instances, individual officers at the scene and elsewhere may have been relying upon their own clocks and timings that were unique and individual to them, and so that would be three different time zones or points of reference that we have to deal and contend with...

[paulg]

So, in your opinion Mike.

Do you think Neville called the police before or after he called Jeremy?

[Jerry]

With respect, Sheila was not Jeremy's daughter, and the gun which is supposed to have been the only murder weapon was owned by Ralph Bamber, it should be obvious to anyone who is remotely interested that Sheila was Jeremy's sister and that Jeremy did not own any of the guns at the scene...

Is this out of context Mike??  I fail to see your point??

[Jerry]

Depending upon which clock you choose to rely upon, the police arrived at the scene, at two different times, and everything they did whilst at the scene, had two different times associated with them, depending upon which clock was being referred to - in some instances, individual officers at the scene and elsewhere may have been relying upon their own clocks and timings that were unique and individual to them, and so that would be three different time zones or points of reference that we have to deal and contend with...

Everything was logged at the control room.  The police log below clearly shows what occurred and at what time.  The phone call from jeremy was timed at 3.26 and the police cars were despatched at 3.35 and 3.36.

[paulg]

So, in your opinion Mike.

Do you think Neville called the police before or after he called Jeremy?

I'll reply to myself.

Scenario 1:  Neville calls police, then calls Jeremy. Situation is out of hand, as the so called keep it in the family Neville has called the police. He's ignored the boxes of ammo lying around, left June in bedroom, and likely still in bed. But, still has time to call Jeremy, who decides to go through yellow pages........nope, i don't like this scenario.

Scenario 2: Neville calls Jeremy, ignoring ammo, and leaving June in bedroom. Phone goes dead, but some how Neville makes another phone call to Jeremy...nope don't like this one either.

Scenario 3: The police simply relayed information Jeremy had given them, and logged accordingly...yep, thats the one for me.

[mike tesko]

Depending upon which clock you choose to rely upon, the police arrived at the scene, at two different times, and everything they did whilst at the scene, had two different times associated with them, depending upon which clock was being referred to - in some instances, individual officers at the scene and elsewhere may have been relying upon their own clocks and timings that were unique and individual to them, and so that would be three different time zones or points of reference that we have to deal and contend with...

Everything was logged at the control room.  The police log below clearly shows what occurred and at what time.  The phone call from jeremy was timed at 3.26 and the police cars were despatched at 3.35 and 3.36.

-----------------------

Twisting the contents of the log do not make it that Jeremy was responsible for making this call, Jeremy's call was timed at 3:36am, not 3:26am...

Mr Bambers call was timed at 3:26am, and in that call he refers to his daughter, and that she has got hold of one of his guns...

Sheila was Jeremy's sister, not his daughter, and as I say Ralph owned the gun that was supposed to have been the murder weapon, Jeremy did not own any gun. If Jeremy's call was not made until 3:36am, how could the occupants of CA07 be dispatched to the scene, before Jeremy even called the police?

There was a 10 minute delay between Ralph's call to the police, and Jeremy's call to the police, you will see if you examine the contents of Jeremy's call to the police, timed at 3:36am, that he refers to his father calling him, and telling him that his sister had got the gun, Jeremy did not tell the police that his daughter had got one of his guns, why woudl he do that because Sheila was not his daughter, and Jeremy did not own any of the guns at whf...

[Jerry]

Depending upon which clock you choose to rely upon, the police arrived at the scene, at two different times, and everything they did whilst at the scene, had two different times associated with them, depending upon which clock was being referred to - in some instances, individual officers at the scene and elsewhere may have been relying upon their own clocks and timings that were unique and individual to them, and so that would be three different time zones or points of reference that we have to deal and contend with...

Everything was logged at the control room.  The police log below clearly shows what occurred and at what time.  The phone call from jeremy was timed at 3.26 and the police cars were despatched at 3.35 and 3.36.

-----------------------

Twisting the contents of the log do not make it that Jeremy was responsible for making this call, Jeremy's call was timed at 3:36am, not 3:26am...

Mr Bambers call was timed at 3:26am, and in that call he refers to his daughter, and that she has got hold of one of his guns...

Sheila was Jeremy's sister, not his daughter, and as I say Ralph owned the gun that was supposed to have been the murder weapon, Jeremy did not own any gun. If Jeremy's call was not made until 3:36am, how could the occupants of CA07 be dispatched to the scene, before Jeremy even called the police?

There was a 10 minute delay between Ralph's call to the police, and Jeremy's call to the police, you will see if you examine the contents of Jeremy's call to the police, timed at 3:36am, that he refers to his father calling him, and telling him that his sister had got the gun, Jeremy did not tell the police that his daughter had got one of his guns, why woudl he do that because Sheila was not his daughter, and Jeremy did not own any of the guns at whf...

Study the log Mike, it is all there, no conspiracy, no cover up, just hard facts.

I believe the log of Jeremy's phone call to police clearly states.. "Message passed to CD by the son of Mr Bamber..."  ie Jeremy contacted CD in the EP control room.

Nowhere is it recorded and no police officer has ever stated that Nevill Bamber ever telephoned Essex Police.  It just didn't happen mate.

Jeremy uses the term 'daughter' and 'has got hold of one of my guns' as a figure of speech when relaying his fathers alleged message.

[shonapugs]

It's on the log, Mike, as clear as day. The information was relayed by JB.