Author Topic: Who was turning lights on and off inside the farmhouse if everyone was dead?  (Read 12479 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline mike tesko

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 51079
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline Steve_uk

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 21102
.."only a small amount of light in the Master bedroom which was light emitting from a different room.."


I'm not sure what Mackintosh and Matthews mean.

Offline lookout

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 48676
Whichever room was closest to the master bedroom was throwing its light enough to see inside the master bedroom.

Offline Caroline

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 27076
...

So different people had different impressions of the light situation. That doesn't indicate that lights were going on and off.
Few people have the imagination for reality

Offline lookout

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 48676
It indicates that there was someone operating them though ?

Offline Caroline

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 27076
It indicates that there was someone operating them though ?

No it doesn't
Few people have the imagination for reality

guest154

  • Guest
No it doesn't

If lights had been going on and off outside the house. Jeremy would have been saying lights were going on and off. Surely?  >:( :o

Offline gringo

  • Veteran Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3414
If lights had been going on and off outside the house. Jeremy would have been saying lights were going on and off. Surely?  >:( :o
    As you well know Jeremy was not on observation duty. In fact he was taken to a call box at some point and as far as I recall spent most of the time at the end of Pages lane. Regardless of where exactly he was, he was most certainly not observing the farmhouse so your observation is based on a false premise.

guest154

  • Guest
    As you well know Jeremy was not on observation duty. In fact he was taken to a call box at some point and as far as I recall spent most of the time at the end of Pages lane. Regardless of where exactly he was, he was most certainly not observing the farmhouse so your observation is based on a false premise.

Ah, so this happened after Jeremy had been removed from outside the Farmhouse. How unlucky, this man seems to be the unluckiest man alive.
It's based on the premise that someone would have said something. No one has said they saw a light go on or off. Not one person.

Offline gringo

  • Veteran Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3414
Ah, so this happened after Jeremy had been removed from outside the Farmhouse. How unlucky, this man seems to be the unluckiest man alive.
It's based on the premise that someone would have said something. No one has said they saw a light go on or off. Not one person.
    Where exactly "outside" do you think Jeremy was all night?
     Several officers have reported the same lights as being both off and on. Are you basing your argument on the spurious fact that there isn't one reported observation of the lights changing from off to on?
   

Offline Caroline

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 27076
Ah, so this happened after Jeremy had been removed from outside the Farmhouse. How unlucky, this man seems to be the unluckiest man alive.
It's based on the premise that someone would have said something. No one has said they saw a light go on or off. Not one person.

Because it didn't happen.
Few people have the imagination for reality

guest154

  • Guest
    Where exactly "outside" do you think Jeremy was all night?
     Several officers have reported the same lights as being both off and on. Are you basing your argument on the spurious fact that there isn't one reported observation of the lights changing from off to on?
   

Officers unfamiliar with the house disagree with what lights were on/off from where they were standing. No one is saying a light went on or off. The document posted doesn't state anyone saw light go on or off, there are no statements with any officer saying they saw a light go on or off. Maybe they all happened to be looking elsewhere when it happened -more bad luck for Bamber. He really is the unluckiest man alive.

No single officer says a room they were looking at was lit up and then later in the night that SAME ROOM was in the dark.  No single officer says a room they were looking at was dark and then later in the night that SAME ROOM was lit up. I wonder why?

This document Mike posted doesn't say any lights went on or off and if this is the best you or anyone else has got to prove lights went on or off then it's no wonder Bamber is where he is, it's playing games with human error and confusion by people who had never been inside the house before.

If you've any statement from any officer where they say they saw a light flick on and a room light up, or a light turn off and a room go dark - then post it. But you don't because no one is saying that happened.

I'll wait for your reply of an officer saying they saw a light turn on or a light turn off. Until then I'll ignore you because I'm not getting into the strange 1250430 day long hole you tried to drag Caroline in when she made the mistake of replying to you.

guest154

  • Guest
Because it didn't happen.

You don't say? Really?!!  ;D

Offline gringo

  • Veteran Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3414
    The changes in the status of the lights as reported make perfect sense if Sheila carried out the shootings. Whether Jeremy or Sheila is guilty, we do know that from what unfolded,either reloading or second guns involved, Neville's presence in the kitchen and the number of bullets that hit their intended target, that it is surely more likely that lights were on as the incident unfolded.
    At 4.09 the lights are reported as being all on. Again this makes perfect sense in a scenario of Sheila having committed the killings. It is just prior to this that the police arrive on the scene. Sheila having just killed everyone in the house is now faced with police turning up to the house. It is not too much of a stretch to see that this new turn of events may cause Sheila to observe from the inside what was unfolding outside. We can reasonably infer that she would probably turn off the light in the room before making her way to the window to observe the unfolding scene.
    The original logs which EP have failed to disclose would no doubt clear up the matter of observing the act of the lights changing status. Perhaps this is why the original logs have never been disclosed for ESDA testing. I am pretty certain that EP would not be stupid enough to leave references to seeing a light turn off and this may explain the coyness of EP in this matter. It is difficult to think of a good reason why EP have been so obstructive on this matter.
     It also lends credence to the movement in the window observed by Bews, Myall and Jeremy by which time the light was out.
     Mat's unconvincing and not believable explanation that, "Officers unfamiliar with the house disagreed with what lights were on/off from where they were standing", to explain these discrepancies is barely worth consideration.
     From what has been learnt over the years about EP and their removal of and tampering with evidence eg. photos, logs etc., there are reasonable suspicions that evidence which would clearly exonerate Jeremy is exactly the evidence that has been removed/tampered with. Surely nobody is naive enough to believe that the log disclosed by EP would have an entry specifically stating that a light was seen going off.
     It is not feasible that under the circumstances of their attendance at WHF that EP were doing a half arsed observation. They had strong suspicions that four were already dead and that the perpetrator was alive and armed. There is little doubt that the observations were accurate and claims otherwise lack credence for the reasons stated. EP were setting up for what they believed a siege situation with an armed person.
     It is obvious that the changing status of the lights cannot have been Jeremy, so to maintain belief in guilt it is necessary to claim that several separate observations by police officers who believed themselves in a siege situation with a suspected armed and dangerous individual were as a result of them not really paying attention.

« Last Edit: August 22, 2018, 02:40:AM by gringo »

Offline lookout

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 48676
It should have been proof enough that someone was still alive inside the farmhouse. What a bunch of dozy individuals.