Sheila and one other were responsible......

[lookout]

What a good job JB didn't think that one up. It would have been another nail in his coffin alright.

[maggie]

So saying Sheila was 'a nutter' is his way of keeping a confidence?

To be fair that was a phrase in constant use back 8n the 80s. Would like to bet he probably didn't know what was really wrong with her or his mother. Think he's quoted in a statement from the scene saying Sheila was a psychopath, unless he was misquoted.  He probably did tell himself she was a 'nutter'.  Not great but doesn't make him a murderer,  makes him a 24 year old self obsessed man, which is about normal. (No offence guys were all self obsessed at 24 if we're normal)

[Jane]

The " black flowers " saga was worse. It was really sick ! What sort of a person suggests that ?

Did Ann admit to saying it? I guess you'd feel pretty angry at a person you wanted to send black flowers to, but I suppose anger isn't inappropriate within a mix of emotions if you think someone's killed your family?

[Jane]

To be fair that was a phrase in constant use back 8n the 80s. Would like to bet he probably didn't know what was really wrong with her or his mother. Think he's quoted in a statement from the scene saying Sheila was a psychopath, unless he was misquoted.  He probably did tell himself she was a 'nutter'.  Not great but doesn't make him a murderer,  makes him a 24 year old self obsessed man, which is about normal. (No offence guys were all self obsessed at 24 if we're normal)

He did rather lay it on with a trowel though, didn't he? One could almost say he was desperate to show her in a bad a light as possible? To convince them of her guilt, perhaps? Didn't he say she'd attempted suicide before? Didn't he say she was fully conversant with firearms? Didn't he say she was about to go back into a psych hospital? I believe he said "loony bin"?

[lookout]

Did Ann admit to saying it? I guess you'd feel pretty angry at a person you wanted to send black flowers to, but I suppose anger isn't inappropriate within a mix of emotions if you think someone's killed your family?

AE had actually handwritten it along with the guest list for the funeral arrangements. It's on the forum somewhere and also mentioned in one or two of the books which were written about the murders.

[lookout]

Black flowers wouldn't be an option for those whose minds were balanced and normal.

[Jane]

Black flowers wouldn't be an option for those whose minds were balanced and normal.

But Jeremy's behaviours were all perfectly acceptable because he was grieving? SUCH hypocrisy!!!

[maggie]

He did rather lay it on with a trowel though, didn't he? One could almost say he was desperate to show her in a bad a light as possible? To convince them of her guilt, perhaps? Didn't he say she'd attempted suicide before? Didn't he say she was fully conversant with firearms? Didn't he say she was about to go back into a psych hospital? I believe he said "loony bin"?

He very well may have said loony bin, it is what people said and possibly was a phrase used in the Bamber household.  As for what he said, apparently he said all kinds of things but we cannot be sure what he said that night was remembered word for word by the police when writing their statements hours later when they had been traumatised themselves and up all night.  Immediately I will be accused b6 some of making excuses for him but I'm actually trying to be fair
 He may have said some of it or all of it,  repeated information often gets distorted.  Anyone who has worked nights knows how it feels by 8 am the next morning. Wouldn't just be JB who had low blood sugar.

[lookout]

But Jeremy's behaviours were all perfectly acceptable because he was grieving? SUCH hypocrisy!!!

What behaviours would they be ?

[Caroline]

To be fair that was a phrase in constant use back 8n the 80s. Would like to bet he probably didn't know what was really wrong with her or his mother. Think he's quoted in a statement from the scene saying Sheila was a psychopath, unless he was misquoted.  He probably did tell himself she was a 'nutter'.  Not great but doesn't make him a murderer,  makes him a 24 year old self obsessed man, which is about normal. (No offence guys were all self obsessed at 24 if we're normal)

No of course it doesn't make him a murderer, that wasn't the point I was making. Lookout's claim that he was worried about betraying trusts is clearly incorrect given that he offered up a ready diagnosis of her being a nutter and a psychopath. Trusts wasn't the first thing on his mind, regardless of whether he was talking 'their language' or using his own.

[Jane]

He very well may have said loony bin, it is what people said and possibly was a phrase used in the Bamber household.  As for what he said, apparently he said all kinds of things but we cannot be sure what he said that night was remembered word for word by the police when writing their statements hours later when they had been traumatised themselves and up all night.  Immediately I will be accused b6 some of making excuses for him but I'm actually trying to be fair
 He may have said some of it or all of it,  repeated information often gets distorted.  Anyone who has worked nights knows how it feels by 8 am the next morning. Wouldn't just be JB who had low blood sugar.

Well, if all -or any- of what you say is true, Maggie, we CANNOT, in all justification, apply it ONLY to this case. We MUST apply it elsewhere. Our prisons are likely to be much less full if we're generous with benefit of doubt, but I'll guarantee many more guilty people will be free to commit more crimes. It's probably the sort of stance defense lawyers take but all it does is cast doubt. It doesn't make the guilty innocent.

[Caroline]

Language that they'd understand rather than using medical terms.

These people weren't neanderthals - they would have heard the term 'schizophrenic' before. It would seem to be Bamber who didn't know the medical term for Sheila's condition because he probably wasn't interested past using her as a scapegoat.

[Caroline]

Black flowers wouldn't be an option for those whose minds were balanced and normal.

Neither would killing 5 members of your family but hey ho!

[Caroline]

He very well may have said loony bin, it is what people said and possibly was a phrase used in the Bamber household.  As for what he said, apparently he said all kinds of things but we cannot be sure what he said that night was remembered word for word by the police when writing their statements hours later when they had been traumatised themselves and up all night.  Immediately I will be accused b6 some of making excuses for him but I'm actually trying to be fair
 He may have said some of it or all of it,  repeated information often gets distorted.  Anyone who has worked nights knows how it feels by 8 am the next morning. Wouldn't just be JB who had low blood sugar.

What is written is all we have to go on. It is documented and hasn't been challenged by Jeremy. All he has said in the years since was that 'I didn't understand my sisters illness back then'. He understood it enough to call her 'crazy'.

[Jane]

What behaviours would they be ?

All those you claim he was entitled to display because you claim he was grieving. We've never heard anything about anger though, have we. That's very surprising, don't you think? Sheila who had everything handed to her on a plate has allegedly slaughtered his entire family? One might have thought he'd have felt a little cross?